I stopped using VDE years ago when TUV came to the US. There are several
TUV's, and you can take your pick of them. While not able to write or amend
standards they have been authorized some time ago to inspect and issue the
German safety marks, at least for the standards I have always used.
This is not an ad for them, as I have had my share of issues with them
as well but it saved me time, money and because I could discuss the issues
in real time rather than letters, e-mails, or phone calls at strange hours
and was generally much more convenient. If you are in Europe this may not be
nearly the convenience here across the pond.
I don't know if Tania was actually quoting anyone, but I have actually
heard the same statement. "It's the right thing to do" My response was
simply that the right thing to do was to follow the standards - not wishes.
Show me the requirement in the standard or get onto the next issue. I, like
everyone else I suppose, have occasionally been caught by obscure articles
in the standards, but I have also staved off some of these "desk standards"
as well. Occasionally, this part of the process has gotten the large vein in
my forehead throbbing pretty good, but generally the discussion was
reasonable.
Gary
One would hope that it doesn't really matter from a compliance standpoint
which agency you use, that includes US houses as well. -----Original
Message-----
From: Tania Grant [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Wednesday, May 02, 2001 8:15 PM
To: Peter Merguerian; '[email protected] '
Subject: Re: Stuck in Germany!
Peter,
And which standard is it that has all these requirements specified!
I've had some unfortunate experiences some time back with German test houses
demanding that all sorts of unexpected compliances be met. I very firmly
and politely asked them to show me just where and in which standard these
requirements are stated. After some back and forth verbal negotiations,
they came back to say that it is not in the standard but that is still a
requirement, etc., "...and it is the right thing to do...!" My response
was that these mandatory requirements should be stated in writing up front
rather than surprising their clients later on in the investigation. I
persisted and finally they relented.
I am not saying that in this case these requirements are not justified (I
know nothing of ballast lamps!) But you certainly should be more assertive
in finding out where these requirements are coming from.
My other suggestion (and too late for you) is not to deal with German test
houses if at all possible. I believe there is a harmonized standard for
luminaires (or is that only for household use?) that might enable you to go
through other test houses in Europe.
Tania Grant
[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>
----- Original Message -----
From: Peter Merguerian
Sent: Wednesday, May 02, 2001 4:14 PM
To: '[email protected] '
Subject: Stuck in Germany!
Dear All,
I have submitted an electronic ballast (ballast designed for building-in and
provided with pigtail leads used for installation at the base of road
lamps) to a reputable German test house for investigation and the following
points were discovered:
1. PCB is not European approved!!! I convinced them (do not know how!) that
a UL Recognized board is OK to use.
2. Leads are UL and must be approved to a European Standard by a European
test house. Tried for half an hour to convince them that the ballast is
designed for international usage and UL Listed or Recognized leads would be
sufficient. They insist that the leads must be European approved.
Question: Anyone knows of manufacturers of leads which are UL and also
approved by a European test house?
3. Ballast fails a hipot of 1500 Vac. Told them to conduct test at 2121 Vdc
(1.4 x Vrms) because of the filtering but they insisted that luminaire
standards always require a test with an ac applied voltage. Was unable to
convince that most standards allow the use of an ac or a dc voltage equal to
the 1.4 x Vrms.
Question: Anyone knows of a quick way (other than the autobahn) through the
German Appeals Procedure? It took 4 months just to begin the tests!. I do
not wish to wait another year for the Appeal!
4. In the case of faults within the ballast, they require a fuse or other
overcurrent protective device within the ballast and not to rely on the main
16 A breaker on the road lamp installation. I told them that the ballast
installation instructions specify an overcurrent protective device between
the main 16 A breaker and the power supply input. They are still requring a
fuse or fuselink within the ballast.
Question: Anyone with a similar problem?
Thanks to All,
PETER MERGUERIAN
-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Sent: 5/2/01 3:29 PM
Subject: FW: EN 41003:1999
Hi Zohar:
The Scope of EN41003 reads:
"This standard applies to equipment designed and intended to be
connected to
a TELECOMMUNICATIONS NETWORK termination. It does not apply to equipment
covered by EN60950."
Therefore, equipment intended to connect to the network that is not ITE
(for
example Test and Measuring, Process Control, Laboratory equipment, and
whatever others) should use EN41003 for the requirements to be applied
to
the network connection.
As internet applications proliferate, more and more product categories
other
than ITE will likely need to use these requirements. Although EN41003
references EN60950 in a number of areas, not all of the EN60950 clause 6
requirements are referenced, and EN41003 adds a few other requirements.
Also, EN41003 has an interesting Annex C which describes why
telecommunication voltages which exceed "safe to touch limits set within
general safety standards" are actually "electrically safe".
I hope that helps some.
Richard Payne
Richard Payne
Tektronix, Inc.
Product Safety Engineering
Ph: (503) 627-1820
Fax: (503) 627-3838
email: [email protected]
-----Original Message-----
From: Zohar Zosmanovich [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Wednesday, May 02, 2001 3:20 AM
To: '[email protected]'
Subject: EN 41003:1999
Hello to all,
Any one familiar with EN 41003:1999 standard, if yes, where is it
applicable?
Does EN 60950/IEC 60950 covers EN 41003 requirements?
Zohar (Jana) Zosmanovich
Compliance Engineer, RADWIN ltd.
34 Habarzel St., Tel Aviv 69710, Israel
Tel.: 972-3-7666735 ; Fax: 972-3-7657535
Email: <mailto:[email protected]>
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