I have a copy of EN 55016-1-2 A2:2006 which calls out phase measurements in Section 4 (specifically 4.2, 4.3, and 4.4). EN 55016-1-2 A2:2006 says that it is identical with CISPR 16-1-2:2003 incorporating amendments 1:2005 and 2:2006 and corrigendum January 2009.
Bob Heller 3M EMC Laboratory, 76-1-01 St. Paul, MN 55107-1208 Tel: 651-778-6336 Fax: 651-778-6252 ======================================= =============================================================== From: Larry Stillings <[email protected]> To: 'Ken Javor' <[email protected]>, <[email protected]> List-Post: [email protected] Date: 04/18/2011 08:20 PM Subject: RE: [PSES] LISN Phase angle Sent by: <[email protected]> ________________________________ Ken, In quickly reviewing CISPR 16-1-2 Ed 1.2 2006-08 where phase was introduced. I do not see any background in Annex A regarding the measurement of phase. Annex A is specific to the construction and design of LISNs (AMNs). As you are aware this standard covers all of the measurements of conducted disturbances, and my best guess would be, since they were concerned with phase on items such at T-LISNs capacitive voltage probes and other ISNs where phase could be important, it was just a logical step to add phase requirements to LISNs (AMNs) without really thinking through the implications. But, I wasn't on the committee, so maybe someone on this list whom was could elaborate and educate us, to why it was added for AMNs (LISNs). Or maybe this has been addressed in a future edition, which I currently don't have a copy of. Larry ________________________________ From: Ken Javor [mailto:[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> ] Sent: Monday, April 18, 2011 9:02 PM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [PSES] LISN Phase angle But Derek's question still remains to be answered. Isn't there a normative annex with this kind of background info? Ken Javor Phone: (256) 650-5261 ________________________________ From: Larry Stillings <[email protected]> List-Post: [email protected] Date: Mon, 18 Apr 2011 19:58:41 -0400 To: 'Ken Javor' <[email protected]>, <[email protected]> Subject: RE: [PSES] LISN Phase angle Ken, Agreed. However now that it is in the standard(s). It will be hard to get it removed. It is the problem for all of us, not having time to attend all of the different committees and putting our two cents worth into the standard writing. That's why I have personally have started becoming active in the standards committees, although on a limited basis (eg as time permits). Larry ________________________________ From: Ken Javor [mailto:[email protected]] <mailto:[email protected]]> Sent: Monday, April 18, 2011 6:51 PM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: [PSES] LISN Phase angle Just because the EMI filters are part now of the measurement, doesn't mean that an amplitude vs. frequency requirement still wouldn't suffice... Ken Javor Phone: (256) 650-5261 ________________________________ From: Larry Stillings <[email protected]> List-Post: [email protected] Date: Mon, 18 Apr 2011 18:40:15 -0400 To: "'[email protected]'" <[email protected]>, Derek Walton <[email protected]> Cc: <[email protected]> Subject: RE: [PSES] LISN Phase angle My smart a** response, is so they could sell every test lab a network analyzer with phase capability. I believe the measurement is to be performed with the LISN and EMI filters in place. Larry ________________________________ From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] <mailto:[email protected]]> Sent: Monday, April 18, 2011 6:16 PM To: Derek Walton Cc: [email protected] Subject: Re: [PSES] LISN Phase angle I wonder why the committee thought that was all important? I would have kept it simple and asked for an ampl-freq response check, because I think that accomplishes the same thing. _______________________________________ _____________________________________________ Ralph McDiarmid | Schneider Electric | Renewable Energies Business | CANADA | Regulatory Engineer From: Derek Walton <[email protected]> To: [email protected] List-Post: [email protected] Date: 04/18/2011 01:03 PM Subject: [PSES] LISN Phase angle ________________________________ Hi All, I understand that it is now important we measure LISN phase as well as impedance. Can anyone point me to the document requiring that please. Thanks, Derek Walton L F Research - ---------------------------------------------------------------- This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to <[email protected]> All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at: http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/> <http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/> <http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/> Graphics (in well-used formats), large files, etc. can be posted to that URL. Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ <http://www.ieee-pses.org/> <http://www.ieee-pses.org/> <http://www.ieee-pses.org/> Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html <http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html> <http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html> <http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html> List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html <http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html> <http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html> <http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html> For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas <[email protected]> Mike Cantwell <[email protected]> For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher: <[email protected]> David Heald: <[email protected]> ______________________________________________________________________ This email has been scanned by the MessageLabs Email Security System. ______________________________________________________________________ - ---------------------------------------------------------------- This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to <[email protected]> All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/> Graphics (in well-used formats), large files, etc. can be posted to that URL. Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ <http://www.ieee-pses.org/> Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html <http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html> List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html <http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html> For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas <[email protected]> Mike Cantwell <[email protected]> For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher <[email protected]> David Heald <[email protected]> - ---------------------------------------------------------------- This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to <[email protected]> All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/> Graphics (in well-used formats), large files, etc. can be posted to that URL. Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ <http://www.ieee-pses.org/> Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html <http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html> List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html <http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html> For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas <[email protected]> Mike Cantwell <[email protected]> For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher <[email protected]> David Heald <[email protected]> - ---------------------------------------------------------------- This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to <[email protected]> All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/> Graphics (in well-used formats), large files, etc. can be posted to that URL. Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ <http://www.ieee-pses.org/> Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html <http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html> List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html <http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html> For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas <[email protected]> Mike Cantwell <[email protected]> For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher <[email protected]> David Heald <[email protected]> - ---------------------------------------------------------------- This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> > All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/> Graphics (in well-used formats), large files, etc. can be posted to that URL. Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ <http://www.ieee-pses.org/> Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html <http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html> List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html <http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html> For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> > Mike Cantwell <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> > For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> > David Heald <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> > - ---------------------------------------------------------------- This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> > All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/> Graphics (in well-used formats), large files, etc. can be posted to that URL. Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ <http://www.ieee-pses.org/> Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html <http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html> List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html <http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html> For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> > Mike Cantwell <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> > For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> > David Heald <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> > - ---------------------------------------------------------------- This message is from the IEEE Product Safety Engineering Society emc-pstc discussion list. To post a message to the list, send your e-mail to <[email protected]> All emc-pstc postings are archived and searchable on the web at http://product-compliance.oc.ieee.org/ Graphics (in well-used formats), large files, etc. can be posted to that URL. Website: http://www.ieee-pses.org/ Instructions: http://listserv.ieee.org/request/user-guide.html List rules: http://www.ieee-pses.org/listrules.html For help, send mail to the list administrators: Scott Douglas <[email protected]> Mike Cantwell <[email protected]> For policy questions, send mail to: Jim Bacher <[email protected]> David Heald <[email protected]>
