yes, if I understood you correctly Maria, you say that I am not trying to work with grief over ones own complicity or remorse. I am more invested in the notion and symbolic power as well as real experience of communal grief -- this is what oppressive systems fear most -- the symbolic "power" of the connecting tissue of our emotions but not those on individual level alone On Oct 4, 2012, at 6:41 PM, Maria Damon wrote:
> Yes, when I mentioned Lamentations, I meant the Hebrew Bible. Old. Grieving > for ones city, ones polis, ones people. Also, it seems that this is *not* > where you were going, Monika, a sense of grief over ones own possible > complicity, real or imagined... remorse. > > On 10/4/12 5:55 PM, Monika Weiss wrote: >> While aware of some of the lamentations explored by artists such as Martha >> Graham (who is not my favorite although I have a great respect for her) -- >> what I am working towards is a connection with the older, before now, before >> any specific time, lamentation. My dancer actually took me to Wender's film >> about Pina Baush last Spring, and while aware of her name I never really >> knew of this work until quite recently (maybe even Alan mentioned her to me >> a long time ago) but it took a person whose body literally inhabited my work >> 'Sustenazo (Lament II)' to "discover" this work and a feeling of connection. >> >> Monika >> >> On Oct 4, 2012, at 4:05 PM, Alan Sondheim wrote: >> >>> >>>> which "Lamentations" are you refering to? (not Martha Graham's >>>> Lamentation?) >>> >>> Book of Lamentations in English >>> >>> All Sandy and I are/were on about, I think, is the silence and the obdurate >>> that occurs in relaton to severe pain; I'm thinking for example of my >>> mother shortly before her death, when she had been anesthetized to >>> alleviate her suffering in the hospice. The silence is also the silence at >>> the heart of the signifier; the signifier is both suture and broken suture, >>> covering and dis/covering pain, naming it for those who are suffering, who >>> can no longer hear the name, who are no longer with us, coffin or not - >>> when my father died, there were issues at the cemetary about the burial of >>> ashes. >>> >>> - Alan >>> >>> >>> >>> >>>> >>>> Alan schreibt: >>>> >>>> >>>> public lament and gardening >>>> >>>> On Thu, 4 Oct 2012, Maria Damon wrote: >>>> >>>>> Is there then (I'm sort of assuming the answer is yes, but asking anyway >>>>> in >>>>> order to make it part of the fabric of the conversation) a way in which >>>>> lamentation is also critique as well as community self-constitution, as in >>>>> Lamentations? >>>>> >>>> >>>> Maria, I wonder what sort of critique would be possible? Lamentations >>>> seems to bridge the political and the obdurate. When pain becomes >>>> overwhelming, silence is at the core and the signifier dissolves; I think >>>> this is also the core of anguish. One is left speechless. On the other >>>> hand, how much clarity is necessary for political or 'rational' thought? >>>> In an odd way this also brings up mathematical thinking - which, from an >>>> outsider point-of-view, seems based on the manipulation of symbols, but >>>> from within is much more of clouded movements with indeterminate focus >>>> (see Jacques Hadamard). Thinking itself, in other words, may well have >>>> less content than its representations, and certainly its representations >>>> in virtual worlds, where everything, one way or another, is determinate >>>> and rationalized on a pixel-by-pixel level. >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> empyre forum >>>> empyre@lists.cofa.unsw.edu.au >>>> http://www.subtle.net/empyre >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> empyre forum >>> empyre@lists.cofa.unsw.edu.au >>> http://www.subtle.net/empyre >> >> M o n i k a W e i s s S t u d i o >> 456 Broome Street, 4 >> New York, NY 10013 >> Phone: 212-226-6736 >> Mobile: 646-660-2809 >> www.monika-weiss.com >> gnie...@monika-weiss.com >> >> M o n i k a W e i s s >> Assistant Professor >> Graduate School of Art & Hybrid Media >> Sam Fox School of Design & Visual Arts >> Washington University in St. Louis >> Campus Box 1031 >> One Brookings Drive >> St. Louis, MO 63130 >> mwe...@samfox.wustl.edu >> http://samfoxschool.wustl.edu/portfolios/faculty/monika_weiss >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> empyre forum >> empyre@lists.cofa.unsw.edu.au >> http://www.subtle.net/empyre > > _______________________________________________ > empyre forum > empyre@lists.cofa.unsw.edu.au > http://www.subtle.net/empyre M o n i k a W e i s s S t u d i o 456 Broome Street, 4 New York, NY 10013 Phone: 212-226-6736 Mobile: 646-660-2809 www.monika-weiss.com gnie...@monika-weiss.com M o n i k a W e i s s Assistant Professor Graduate School of Art & Hybrid Media Sam Fox School of Design & Visual Arts Washington University in St. Louis Campus Box 1031 One Brookings Drive St. Louis, MO 63130 mwe...@samfox.wustl.edu http://samfoxschool.wustl.edu/portfolios/faculty/monika_weiss
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