Joe/Bob- It has been said (mostly by us big tree coordinator types) that there's ALWAYS a taller tree, and perhaps there's a second truism too, "there's always an older tree"! -Don
From: [email protected] To: [email protected] CC: [email protected]; [email protected] Subject: [ENTS] Re: ordinary versus extraordinary forests Date: Thu, 20 Aug 2009 09:02:39 -0400 Bob, I have no way of proving it- but I suspect most species can live much longer than any which have yet been found. Since remaining old growth is such a small percentage of the entire landscape, we can at best only estimate what the full potential is. Joe ----- Original Message ----- From: [email protected] To: [email protected] Cc: Zelazo, Timothy ; CAMPANILE, ROBERT Sent: Thursday, August 20, 2009 8:47 AM Subject: [ENTS] Re: ordinary versus extraordinary forests Ed, Don Bertolette and I cored a large white ash on Dunbar Brook back in the 1990s. It was 230 years old at core height. The big Dunbar Ash can be considered to be 275. I dated two other white ash trees that fell across the Raycroft Extension Trail. One was 170+/- and the other was 180+/-. This was at the distance up the trunk where they fell across the trail - about 35 feet for both trees. I dated a downed ash on Bryant Homestead that was approximately 200 years old. My guess is that the species commonly reaches ages of 175 to 250 years. I doubt that many get much over 300 years, but that's just a guess. I'll search for written records. Bob ----- Original Message ----- From: "Edward Frank" <[email protected]> To: [email protected] Sent: Wednesday, August 19, 2009 6:12:12 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern Subject: [ENTS] Re: ordinary versus extraordinary forests Bob, Image #1 - Striped Maple - The oldest we have found is 69 years old from the Great Smokies - a core or ring count would be worthwhile for this tree. Surely there are specimens older than 69 years - Maybe this one. Certainly coring the tree would not harm it. Image #4 - Bigtooth Aspen - Bob, how do you know what the lifespan of a Bigtooth Aspen really is? Any population will loose members over time, and this may be happening in this stand, but I am not sure how that directly relates to the end of lifespan for the tree species or stand. Again this is a species for which we have no organized data (actually I have not found any good numbers a all.) The oldest in the Eastern old-List for the species is just 113, and I am sure some of these are older than that - but we just don't have good numbers for the species. Image #5: Bob do you have a compilation of the results of your coring in the early 1990's? Can you get one? If so how about posting the information, along with notations on whether the tree is still alive if you know. Again our data for the species is pitiful. The oldest I have compiled is a relatively young 141 from the Smokies by Blozan and Riddle. I know that is no where close to the oldest for the species. But so many trees are cored and the data is never available for anyone else to see. That is why I created the ENTS Maximum Age list, to supplement official compilations. I will add this post to the Special Places Category as well as the Massachusetts Location. Ed "The most beautiful thing we can experience is the mysterious. It is the source of all true art and all science." - Albert Einstein Image#1-TanyaRolandOnStripedMaple.jpg: This image conveys a message. Yes, the downed tree that Roland Blaich and his daughter Tanya are sitting on is a striped maple. Striped maple? Impossible, you say! Not at all. I visited this very tree for years and watched it get larger and larger. But alas, it went down. It now returns its nutrients to the earth that so faithfully nourished it. Image#4-BigtoothAspen.jpg: Another stretch near the brook has a stand of impressive bigtooth aspens that are now at the far end of their life spans. One on the other side of the brook may soon become the height champion. Image#5-TanyaAndWhiteAsh: In the early 1990s, we cored the Dunbar Ash, and at the time, we counted 258 rings at core height. Today this old gent is at least 275 years young. Image#7-OldYellowBirch.jpg: Roots of this ancient yellow birch engulf the rock on which it seeded maybe 300 years ago. "Rock-eating" birches are a common sight in the Dunbar forest. A Tolkien-like environment of moss and fern-covered boulders, tangled roots, twisting trunks and limbs, many species of herbs, and a canopy high above create that magic forest elixir that we commonly associate with old growth forests. <BR _________________________________________________________________ With Windows Live, you can organize, edit, and share your photos. http://www.windowslive.com/Desktop/PhotoGallery --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ Eastern Native Tree Society http://www.nativetreesociety.org Send email to [email protected] Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/entstrees?hl=en To unsubscribe send email to [email protected] -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
