On Jun 16, 4:50 am, Robert <[email protected]> wrote:
> Chazwin, are you entirely unable to converse without resort to
> occipital lobe eruptions?

You are confusing your own experience of me with a generalised
statement. I m.ay react bluntly at times , but only in response to
reactionary ideological nonsense.
As a teacher I might have a better handle on this situation. I can
assure you that I have never met a teacher who did not agree that
moves to re-acquire control of the classroom was not a good idea. You
assertion that it is all the fault of the unions is quite frankly
idiotic.


>
> In the US, teacher unions do indeed request discipline in schools, but
> this is far down on their list of priorities.

Are you a teacher? Or are you just dreaming this up?


> The union leadership is so entrenched that even the rank and file
> teachers can do little to dislodge them.

Ideological nonsense. The union leadership is democratically elected,
thus rank and file have th vote to 'dislodge them'.


> The leaders are lavishly funded and politically connected, and are
> able to ignore the sincere teachers in the classroom.
> The union leadership are entirely resistant to any attempts to hold
> teachers accountable.
> They have protested the idea of merit pay, which is bizarre, but they
> do.
> They reject attempts to test teachers for continuing competence.

There is a deep contradiction here. You are suggesting that they are
in the hands of the government, and yet you say they manage to resist
any change that the government is suggesting.


> And when parents actually attempt to give input to the schools, the
> schools reject these attempts.

You are making this up as you go along.

> Numerous news documentaries on TV have addressed these issues, but to
> no avail.

Ah, now I understand. Your evidence is the gutter press. A gutter
press that has been scapegoating teachers for generations.


> The politicians constantly promise improvements, but the only increase
> is in taxes, not in quality of education.

IN the UK schools suffer from annual realignments of the curriculum
and edicts on a daily basis. Teachers know how to teach and they ought
to be allowed to get on with it.

>
> My interest in education began some years ago when, as a new student,
> I applied for teaching curricula in my university.

I'm not sure exactly what you mean by "applied for teaching curricula"

> Because of my age, (I was 40 then) I was interviewed, and was told
> what to expect.
> Things would not be as I remembered them.
> In my years, if a student so much as said "damn" in class, he was
> suspended.
> Today, much harsher words, directed at high school teachers by young
> students,
> are considered free speech.

This is a very limited experience.


> I finally selected a curriculum in financial accounting instead.
>
> The state of government-run schools in the US is well known to be
> awful.

Presented as such by the press. But who or what is to blame?


> Many thousands of dollars per year (per student) are spent in failing
> school systems.
> Nearly every state in the Union publicizes its annual efforts to
> improve matters,
> but next year, there is always a need for even more programs at even
> greater cost.
> Our test scores slip almost every year by international standards.

The problems and solutions are complex. Everyone thinks that because
they have been to school that they have a fair idea of how to teach
and that there are ready solutions. Its easy to snipe form the side-
lines and attack your ideological bug-bears, blaming them for the ills
of education.



>
> As a result, whenever a "charter" school opens, with limited seats
> available, there are tens of applicants for each available seat, and
> these are often in impoverished districts where students are trapped
> in schools often described as hell holes.
> Charter schools are similar to other government run schools, but with
> the major difference being that they are locally controlled and free
> from contracts with teacher unions.
> Which is why every charter offered is opposed by the teacher unions.

I'm not surprised. What happens when a teacher gets stabbed in a
charter school or accused of violence or touching a child? WIthout
union support teachers can easily loose they jobs on accusation
without legal help from the union.


>
> Teachers compete for teaching slots in these schools, even though the
> pay is LESS.
> Yes, there are many good, dedicated teachers who resent their own
> union.
>
> Chaz, what is with you?
> Must you attribute absolutely everything I say to ignorance, hate or
> some other vile motive?

I just don't think you know what is really happening out there.


> If your interest is to simply be a provocateur, then so be it.
> If your sense of superioroty depends on insulting those who disagree
> with you, then I feel for you.
> But what I suspect is that you are actually a pleasant person face to
> face, but that you are so utterly insulated from opposing points of
> view that you have no skill at civil discourse with those with whom
> you disagree.

You are now doing what you are accusing me of.


> --------------------------------------------------------------------------- 
> ------------------
>
> On Jun 15, 8:03 pm, chazwin <[email protected]> wrote:
>
>
>
> > On Jun 15, 2:36 pm, Robert <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > > On Jun 14, 5:44 am, chazwin <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > > > DO you agree with closing more schools?
>
> > > The choice is not between closing schools or not.
> > > It is eminently possible to improve the schools AND save money.
> > > The prescription:
>
> > > 1)  enforce basic student discipline, which has eroded to atrocious
> > > depths.
> > > 2)  establish, monitor, and enforce basic teaching standards.  Many
> > > teachers are abysmally incompetent.
> > > 3)  require at least a minimal degree of parental involvement where
> > > feasible.  Many parents are apathetic.
> > > They should be required to pay extra for school services unless they
> > > demonstrate some basic effort to help their children.
>
> > > There are other needed steps, but these are a good start.
> > > The obstacle is the teacher unions, which wield enormous political
> > > power.
>
> > As usual you are speaking from ideological ignorance. The points you
> > raise above are all supported by unions idiot!
>
> > > Their only answer to every issue in the schools is to raise taxes and
> > > increase spending, despite the fact that many years of this policy
> > > have continued to produce illiterate, innumerate students.
> > > The unions vociferously resist any attempt at holding teachers
> > > accountable.
> > > Plus, when taxes ARE raised, the bulk of the money goes into the
> > > pockets of school administrators and union officials, with a bone
> > > tossed to the teachers, and almost none of it to improving education
> > > for the students.
>
> > More ignorance.
>
> > > > Do you want hoards of the poorest children from the most deprived
> > > >  neighbourhoods knocking on your door during daylight hours when you
> > > > are at work?
>
> > > Melodrama.
>
> > > > Would you rather the roads fixed themselves;
>
> > > Now there's an idea!  Nano tech!
>
> > > > that we go back to privatised fire-service?
>
> > > You have a talent for hyperbole.
>
> > > > > -----------------------------------------
> > > > > On May 18, 12:57 pm, nominal9 <[email protected]> wrote:
>
> > > > > > > Video--- Example of How Politicians Should Act
>
> > > > > > > Governor of New Jersey was accused by a reporter of being
> > > > > > > confrontational.
> > > > > > > Governor replies as follows:
>
> > > > > > >http://hotair.com/archives/2010/05/13/video-chris-christie-destroys-r...Hide
> > > > > > > quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> > - Show quoted text -

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