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Ed wrote: To the best of my knowledge, there is NO SUCH THING as a Coupe incapable of recovering from a spin. Do you have some evidence to the contrary? I think: If you can get into a spin with a coupe, be it by mis-rigging the plane, overloading, loading wayy after CG, turbulences or all of those together, How do you get out of the spin? No rudder pedals to work against the autorotation. I know , the test of the Ercoupe model in a wind canal were showing that a Coupe recovers pretty fast from a spin by putting the flight controls into the positions for normal flight. But this was a model tested, I do not want to demonstrate that to anybody. There is the accident report that 2 guys managed to get into a flat spin with a coupe. They could not get out of that spin and decided to step onto wing before they hit ground. That disturbed the airflow in a way that the Coupe stated flying again. Might be anecdotal evidence. However I don't recommend becoming a test pilot of a unairworthy plane, just because everyone says , it's just fine. Hartmut ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ed Burkhead" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Coupe-Tech" <[email protected]> Sent: Friday, March 04, 2005 9:17 AM Subject: RE: FW: WRB Re: [COUPERS-TECH] D and CD model history > ----[Please read http://ercoupers.com/disclaimer.htm before following any advice in this forum.]---- > > > > John said: > > > John, > > You'll find that in NO case will a Coupe have "no hope of recovery." > Heck, it isn't easy to get a Coupe INTO a spin at all - a hammerhead > stall can do it but not much else will. > > Let's please agree that with the CG within limits and . . . > > a. the weight at 1400 lb. and the elevator limited to 9? the Coupe > can't be HELD in a spin - it will automatically come out of the spin and > you then recover from the unusual attitude. > > a. the weight at 1260 lb. and the elevator limited to 13? the Coupe > can't be HELD in a spin - it will automatically come out of the spin and > you then recover from the unusual attitude. > > So let's consider your hypothetical situation, with the airplane > mis-rigged to (let us say) 15? of up travel and 1400 lb. gross weight. > Even then, it will exit the stall/spin when the elevator up angle is > reduced to 9?, let alone moving it to neutral or full forward (as is > standard operating procedure in spin recovery). > > A spin is a condition in which one wing is stalled more than the other - > hence autorotation or a spin. When the elevator up angle is reduced to > certificated levels in a Coupe, the Coupe's stall reduces to the point > the airplane is flying with effective ailerons. > > Per the information Bill Bayne has dig up, it seems there was > flight-testing that showed the Coupes were still safe to fly with the > elevator rigged to allow up angle of several degrees higher than was > certificated. (Not that you'd catch me flying that way - I LIKE the > Coupe's designed-in safety margins!) > > To the best of my knowledge, there is NO SUCH THING as a Coupe incapable > of recovering from a spin. Do you have some evidence to the contrary? > > Ed Burkhead > http://edburkhead.com/ > ed -at- edburkheadQQQ.com (change -at- and remove the QQQ) > > I know you believe you understand what you think I said, but I am not > sure if you realize that what you heard is not what I meant. (Jim, AKA > Midnight Plowboy) > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Skyport Services [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Friday, March 04, 2005 10:56 AM > To: Coupe-Tech > Subject: RE: FW: WRB Re: [COUPERS-TECH] D and CD model history > > At 10:51 AM 3/4/2005, Wood, Percy wrote: > >As I tried to explain in my review of "Stick and Rudder," the pedals > are not > >needed. > > Ah, Percy, isn't that circular logic? Agreed, if the plane can't spin > then > pedals are unnecessary. From www.ercoupe.org "Combined with a somewhat > limited elevator up travel (on some models), a Coupe's tail can't be > pushed > down enough to stall or keep stalled the majority of the wing on any > Coupe." Allow the up-elevator travel to exceed the safe limits and "all > bets are off" just as they are over gross or aft CG. My point was > simply > that the CAA weenie had to develop some standard by which it could be > ensured that the plane would in fact remain unstallable and > unspinable. The penalty for an error is finding yourself in a spin with > no > hope of recovery. > > John Cooper > Skyport Services > PO Box 249 > 4996 Delaware Tnpk > Rensselaerville, NY 12147 > 518 797-3064 > > > > ========================================================================== == == > To leave this forum go to: http://ercoupers.com/lists.htm > Search the archives on http://escribe.com/aviation/coupers-tech/ > > > > ========================================================================== ==== To leave this forum go to: http://ercoupers.com/lists.htm Search the archives on http://escribe.com/aviation/coupers-tech/
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