Paul Boddie wrote: > On Tuesday 07 July 2009 12:51:42 Steve Holden wrote: >> Jeff Rush wrote: >>> The children of the cobbler continue to go without shoes, and I continue >>> to have people ask me why if Python is so cool for webapps do the basic >>> needs of the community go unmet? "People are busy" while accurate seems >>> a poor response. > > The saying about the cobbler is something I'd expect Steve to say. :-) > >> I asked much the same question at both PyCon and EuroPython (with a >> rather more positive response at the latter, I might add, possibly due >> to the talk being a plenary). See "ThePSFAndUs.pdf" on >> >> http://wiki.europython2009.eu/TalkMaterials >> >> I believe it's up to the PSF to advertise this need until it gets >> filled. If necessary I'll threaten to have PHP programmers do it ;-) > > I was going to have a few words with you about this at EuroPython, Steve, > especially after your talk, but I didn't manage to track you down at the > right point. > > The problem with all these Web-related activities is that people approach > them > from a "Soviet" perspective and after having wiped the slate clean (or pushed > all the toys off the table - choose a metaphor!), the result is usually a > top-down solution with very few engaged participants. Meanwhile, a bunch of > other people are usually plotting to replace the existing solution with > another developed in much the same fashion. The result is a large number of > dissatisfied people complaining about everything and anything, in my > experience, even if the solution is actually usable and not actively detested > by most people. > > As far as python.org is concerned, there is already a solution that involves > a > fair number of people: the wiki.python.org part of the site. Just as we see > with the EuroPython site, that's where most of the action is, and the > sensible thing would be to emphasize it instead of pretending that it isn't > a "proper site" and then developing a custom solution that won't be properly > maintained. I've recently helped another organisation already using MoinMoin > with the behind-the-scenes theme code and useful extensions, and the > EuroPython Wiki theme developer has already offered his work for python.org > use, so the pieces are already there to use. > > If Bruce Eckel sees the point of using a Wiki instead of the combination of > Sphinx and a version control system [1] - arguably a "developer mindset" take > on what some would call a "proper site" - surely there's some merit in going > in the direction already shown by wiki.python.org after all. > > Paul > > [1] http://www.artima.com/weblogs/viewpost.jsp?thread=261930 > > > Paul:
Yes, EuroPython was a blast but it went by far too fast! I agree there's a lot to be said for maintaining Wiki content as a group, and much of the Wiki content is successfully being so managed. But if we want to make the web site a portal, then we can't *just* use a wiki. The intent, though, is the same: democratize the web content and try to open up the maintenance task to a wider group. None of this gainsays the work of the existing volunteers, and I am sure that many of them will also have ideas about how the site can be incrementally improved to include dynamic content and much more linkage to community-based and project-based activities not necessarily directly related to core Python development, but nevertheless relevant to the PSF's mission. regards Steve -- Steve Holden +1 571 484 6266 +1 800 494 3119 Holden Web LLC http://www.holdenweb.com/ Watch PyCon on video now! http://pycon.blip.tv/ _______________________________________________ EuroPython mailing list EuroPython@python.org http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/europython
