EV Digest 3432
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: conEV: X-trail fcv limited lease
by Rod Hower <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Seeking Concorde AGM advice
by Green VW <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Re: Models burned down house still around.
by Ken Trough <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) EVLN(Ford to sell hybrid Escape SUV at a loss)
by Bruce EVangel Parmenter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: EVLN(Ford to sell hybrid Escape SUV at a loss)
by Ken Trough <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Panasonic batteries on eBay
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
7) Re: EVLN(Ford to sell hybrid Escape SUV at a loss)
by Shawn Rutledge <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) Re: EVLN(Ford to sell hybrid Escape SUV at a loss)
by Derrick J Brashear <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) Re: New Car or Not (Was Tom Hanks = Big EV Fan)
by Peter VanDerWal <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: ACPropulsion combo on eBay
by Jim Coate <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Slow overcharge/float: Any thoughts?
by Chris Zach <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) S10 adaptor plate
by Rod Hower <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) RE: Models burned down house still around.
by Peter VanDerWal <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) ah vs wh
by Jeff Shanab <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) bad battery
by Jeff Shanab <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) Brush timing for Hondas
by Jude Anthony <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Re: S10 adaptor plate
by Bob Brooks <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Re: ACPropulsion combo on eBay
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Re: Seeking Concorde AGM advice
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) Re: AMP connectors
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) Re: AMP connectors
by Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) OTish: Re: EVLN(h2 Prius)
by Lightning Ryan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) Re: AMP connectors
by Alex Karahalios <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
24) Re: Brush timing for Hondas
by "Joe Smalley" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
25) Re: Seeking Concorde AGM advice
by "Joe Smalley" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
26) Re: Brush timing for Hondas
by Bob Bath <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
27) Re: Slow overcharge/float: Any thoughts?
by "Joe Smalley" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
28) Re: Symptoms of a bad battery in a string
by "Joe Smalley" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
29) step up transformer and zivans?
by elaine chiu <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
30) Power lines under roads
by Ryan Bohm <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
31) Re: step up transformer and zivans?
by "Joe Smalley" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
32) Re: Power lines under roads
by "Joe Smalley" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
Amen Sam!
My company supplies products to 90% of the fuel
cell companies in the US. All of them being
stationary backup systems that are somewhat practical
in their market. However, to use this technology
on an EV requires a major break through that is not
on the horizon. Even my customers admit that mobile
fuel cells for EV's are not realistic.
Another shell game by the auto lobbiest.
At least EV drive trains are benifiting from
this development. Hopefully this will result in more
cost effective parts for the battery EV community.
(always an optimist!)
Rod
--- Sam Thurber <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Fear not, the day any private person, or, for that
> matter, any private enterprise (i.e. not a tax
> dollar
> funded $400-hammer-govt-bureaucrat type) pays
> between
> $250K and a cool million (depending on who you talk
> to) for a fuel cell vehicle that requires fuel
> costing
> the equivalent of $15/gallon when generated cleanly,
> is the day I become a rich man. I'm sure anyone
> could
> easily figure out a way to make a mint of such a
> sucker. And no, the price of H2 FCV's won't come
> down
> with mass production like battery EV's. Not only is
> the fuel cell orders of magnitude more complex than
> a
> battery to manufacture, it currently contains too
> much
> platinum. Bring the price of Platinum down to the
> cost
> of Nickel or Zinc, and these cars may have a chance
> of
> seeing private ownership given enough miraculous
> breakthroughs in hydrogen generation and storage
> technology.
>
> Yeah, I'm just a tinny bit angry that my local (Los
> Angeles), state, and federal tax dollars are being
> funneled into these carmarkers coffers to fund what
> is
> no more than a very expensive greenwash of their
> lack
> of any willingness to mass produce an affordable,
> utilitarian ZEV.
>
> --- Bruce EVangel Parmenter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
> > As time progresses and fcvs get into the public's
> > hands, I fear
> > EVs will be drowned out and lost in the media's
> fcv
> > and hybrid
> > PR noise.
> >
> >
> >
> > =====
> > ' ____
> > ~/__|o\__
> > '@----- @'---(=
> > . http://geocities.com/brucedp/
> > . EV List Editor & RE newswires
> > . (originator of the above ASCII art)
> > =====
> >
> > __________________________________
> > Do you Yahoo!?
> > Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File online. File on
> > time.
> > http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html
> >
>
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File online. File on
> time.
> http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Has anyone had any luck bringing Concorde AGM's back to life. My batteries
(4-D's) would charge up to 13.1 volts when new, but won't make it past 12.6
now. All 10 batteries are in similar condition, no weak ones. They are 2
years old with 150 cycles. Most cycles less than 60%. I am using a smart
charger with powercheq regs. The charger checks out ok. Any help would be
appreciated.
Ben
> http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/384.html
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I'm curious as to the point of this post. Maybe I am missing something.
This story was exposed as a big pack of lies right after it was posted.
Yes a fire occurred, and yes, there was some damage to a garage, some
minor smoke damage to the house and a dog apparently died of smoke
inhalation.
The rest of the sensationalism about how her house was a smoking crater
was proven to be crap. The quotes from firefighters on the scene have
been totally disavowed as false by the actual firemen on the scene. This
has never happened before in anyone's memory on that fire department
according to the fire chief who was later contacted regarding these
quotes.
Basically, there was a whole lot of hype about how electrics are "fire
spewing death machines" but no actual substance to the exaggerated
claims.
-Ken Trough
Publisher - V is for Voltage Magazine
http://visforvoltage.com
24 hour AIM - ktrough
24 hour message center - 866-872-8901
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
EVLN(Ford to sell hybrid Escape SUV at a loss)
[The Internet Electric Vehicle List News. For Public EV
informational purposes. Contact publication for reprint rights.]
--- {EVangel}
http://www.usatoday.com/money/autos/2003-03-06-ford-hybrid-suv_x.htm
Posted 3/6/2003 12:39 PM
Ford to sell hybrid Escape SUV at a loss
DEARBORN, Mich. (Reuters) � Ford Motor said Wednesday it will sell a
gasoline-electric hybrid version of the Ford Escape small
sport-utility vehicle at a loss while it tries to cut the costs of
the hybrid system in half.
Ford says there will be no difference between the hybrid and regular
version of the Escape. Wieck
"We have to subsidize the price of the hybrid technology," said
Prabhakar Patil, chief program engineer for the hybrid Escape, set
to go on sale late this year. "We feel it's important to get in the
market for this technology and get feedback from customers."
The hybrid Escape, the first such vehicle to hit the market from a
Detroit automaker, will boast a combined fuel economy of 35 to 40
miles per gallon in city driving and 30 mpg in highway driving. The
four-cylinder base model Escape averages 23 mpg in city and 28 mpg
on the highway. Executives say the hybrid Escape's performance will
match that of the V6 model.
Hybrid vehicles use electric motors and battery packs to improve the
fuel efficiency of internal combustion engines, adding power during
acceleration and reclaiming energy during braking.
The rollout of the hybrid Escape comes even as the world's No. 2
automaker tries to cut total automotive costs by $500 million this
year and keep its automotive unit headed toward break-even earnings,
a goal many analysts call unrealistic.
Ford canceled plans for a hybrid version of its Explorer SUV, but
Chairman and Chief Executive Bill Ford Jr. has said the automaker
was committed to building more hybrid models.
Such systems have garnered much attention from automakers and
governments for their potential to improve fuel economy at a
reasonable cost. Toyota Motor has been the leader in the market so
far and has set a target of selling 300,000 hybrid vehicles by
2005.
Domestic automakers say that Toyota and Honda Motor sell their
hybrid models at a loss in the United States and that the costs of
the hybrid systems have limited their rollout.
Patil and other Ford executives working on the program declined to
give estimates of the hybrid Escape's price, Ford's cost of building
the system or the number of hybrid Escapes Ford plans to build.
Other automakers have estimated the cost of a hybrid system at
anywhere from $1,000 to $5,000 per vehicle.
Standard versions of the Escape on sale in the United States today
have price tags ranging between $19,000 and $27,000.
Patil said several factors would determine how much Ford charges for
the hybrid system. Those include whether customers could get federal
tax credits for the vehicle, in what parts of the country Ford will
sell the models and how much hybrid sales could improve Ford's
corporate fuel economy averages.
The hybrid Escape may get a boost from gasoline prices that now
average nearly $2 per gallon around the United States. The fuel
savings from current hybrid models such as the Toyota Prius and
Honda Civic typically don't cover their extra cost, but Patil said
hybrid buyers don't necessarily expect their investment to pay off.
"Most people are willing to pay a small premium to do the right
thing," Patil said. "But it has to be a small premium."
Patil said Ford would make a profit on the system if it could halve
its costs. Ford engineers said the cost of the system could drop
quickly if volumes rise and more automakers rely on similar parts.
The first hybrid Escapes will be sold to fleet customers, while a
version for retail buyers won't be available until the middle of
next year. Ford executives say outside of a small "Hybrid" badge on
the rear tailgate, there will be no exterior differences between a
hybrid Escape and a regular model. Copyright 2003 Reuters Limited.
[ http://www.fordvehicles.com/escapehybrid/frameset.asp
http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/escape_hybrid/ ] -
-
=====
' ____
~/__|o\__
'@----- @'---(=
. http://geocities.com/brucedp/
. EV List Editor & RE newswires
. (originator of the above ASCII art)
=====
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File online. File on time.
http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
The hybrid Escape, the first such vehicle to hit the market from a
Detroit automaker, will boast a combined fuel economy of 35 to 40 miles
per gallon in city driving and 30 mpg in highway driving. The
four-cylinder base model Escape averages 23 mpg in city and 28 mpg
on the highway.
Great. So for all their massive investment in hybrid tech, they are
gaining a mere 2 mpg in highway driving. Those hybrid numbers are
completely unimpressive. They can easily exceed those fuel efficiency
numbers without any hybrid tech at all. Sure wish they'd invest some of
that much needed $$ into the most promising battery technology....
-Ken Trough
Publisher - V is for Voltage Magazine
http://visforvoltage.com
24 hour AIM - ktrough
24 hour message center - 866-872-8901
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Let's see, ten 60Ah batteries starting at $300 -- wow, great deal!
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=6755&item=2470853805
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
--- Ken Trough <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> numbers without any hybrid tech at all. Sure wish they'd invest some
> of
> that much needed $$ into the most promising battery technology....
Yeah. Anyway they still have to buy batteries (albeit in smaller
quantities) and their demand will drive prices down. Seems most of the
automakers are using more advanced batteries in their hybrids rather
than lead-acid. Which means, those batteries (NiMH and/or
lithium-basd) won't be unobtanium for much longer... and there will be
nothing stopping the rest of us from buying them and building real EVs.
And then when the batteries get cheap enough maybe there will be more
commercial EVs too.
=====
. _______ Shawn T. Rutledge / KB7PWD [EMAIL PROTECTED]
(_ | |_) http://ecloud.org/ [EMAIL PROTECTED]
__) | | \______________________________________________
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File online. File on time.
http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Tue, 30 Mar 2004, Ken Trough wrote:
> > The hybrid Escape, the first such vehicle to hit the market from a
> > Detroit automaker, will boast a combined fuel economy of 35 to 40 miles
> > per gallon in city driving and 30 mpg in highway driving. The
> > four-cylinder base model Escape averages 23 mpg in city and 28 mpg
> > on the highway.
>
> Great. So for all their massive investment in hybrid tech, they are
> gaining a mere 2 mpg in highway driving. Those hybrid numbers are
and 12 to 17 city. i don't think that can be so trivially overlooked.
i rented a 2004 prius last week
(http://www.dementia.org/~shadow/Prius/Prius.html if you want to see the
pictures I took of/in it) and I noticed the same thing: the day i drove to
Livermore the mileage dropped. When I was using it closer to Palo Alto,
the mileage went back up.
i put my money where my mouth is and bought electric, but I think the
investment in hybrids is probably better spent than that on fuel cells.
> completely unimpressive. They can easily exceed those fuel efficiency
> numbers without any hybrid tech at all. Sure wish they'd invest some of
> that much needed $$ into the most promising battery technology....
but yeah, i'd rather see it on batteries. if evercel is really gone, i'm
sad.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
> That's true, but not entirely. If you have a car with 75,000
> (arbitrary) miles on it then it's obviously not new, however if
> you convert it to electric and then apply for a new title as
> a "new" electric vehicle, then by the IRS rules it is new and you
> can take the credit.
>
Can you point to an IRS source for this "rule"?
As I recall this was just an assumption made by members of the list, I'd
like to see a source where the IRS confirms that this is their
interpretation of the law.
> New Title(VIN) == New Car. It might not seem exactly right, but
> it's allowed.
Can you cite an example of where someone who tried this was audited and
the IRS agreed that it was "allowed"?
>
> If you do the conversion and "register" it as an electric car, but
> still retain the original VIN, then it is simply a used car that
> underwent conversion. But the VIN would be innacurate, because in
> most cars today the engine size/type is included as a code in the
> VIN.
>
Now I know you're wrong. The VIN might indicate which engine was
originally included with the car (and what color it was painted, what
size wheels it had, etc.) Changing the cars paint color or replacing
the engine does NOT make the VIN wrong or inaccurate. It's still the
vehicles VIN.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Jorg Brown & T Humphrey & Victor Tikhonov wrote:
One thing that makes the ACP drive a little more interesting is that
there's an insulation issue - something about the case of the motor
should not make electrical contact with the car chassis.
Yikes!!! Making a custom adapter from good steel would be a daunting but
potentially doable challenge... making such from some strong but
insulating material would be a bit over the top. If the case needs to be
isolated, I'd assume the shaft also needs to be isolated. And even if it
could be done, would that mean the motor frame is always floating 'hot'
(electrically)? Seems like a rather hazardous situation, even if the
body was plastic.
> How long were you thinking of driving around with your foot to the
> floor? 150kW == 200HP gets the tZero to 90mph in something like 9
> seconds. The continuous power output is 50kW.
...
> The same applies to any system, Siemens included.
> You can sustain 50 kW for 5135 motor for as long as you need -
> just pump the water in. The same for ACP, just instead of silent
> water pump you got hurricane blowers for motor and inverter.
This is the odd part for continuos power- the ACP motor weighs 50 kg, so
about the size of the Siemens 5105 (49 kg) which is rated 18 KW
continuos. The 5135 is 91 kg, so almost double the size and it's water
cooled. That must be some huge "hurricane" fan ACP uses.
As for the peak power, yes I realize that the controller and batteries
are the major limiting factors. The 2 tons, 70 mph uphill is right, for
about 1.5 minutes. I have to go measure the actual grade someday soon.
> I don't think ACProp will let one of their babies sit around broke
> for long. Especially not when a list member owns it.
If I can afford their repair rates. Is anyone from ACP on this list? Now
might be a good time to de-cloak :-) Having Otmar & Victor active on the
list and answering unending questions certainly helps me to like their
respective controllers.
> Don't you always need to make a custom motor adapter?
No, well at least only quasi-custom. If I stay with something tried and
true like an S-10 with an 8 or 9" motor then can just order up the
adapter pre-made from an EV supplier. Not as easy as walking into the
local McMegaMart Auto Store for spark plugs but way easier then
measuring everything and designing the adapter from scratch.
_________
Jim Coate
1970's Elec-Trak
1992 Chevy S-10 BEV
1997 Chevy S-10 NGV
http://www.eeevee.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Question: Does anyone implement Region E type float charging on AGM
batteries as per the Hawker literature? Basically it's holding the pack
at a temp compensated 13.62 vpb for an extended period of time to help
equalize the pack.
Does this work? I've re-programmed my MC to try this; current draw by
the pack is in the range of .1 to .2 amps (this after the normal charge
at full blast to 15vpb, then taper off till current is under .5 amps,
then take it to 15.6 vpb for 50 minutes with a limit of .5 amps)
My cutoffs are stop charging if battery temp goes above 50 degrees C
(with appropriate temp comp to lower the voltage anyway) a limit of 12
hours, and a limit of 10 ah since this is going to happen while I sleep.
Chris
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
After reading Jim Coate's response I realized
I have a S10 adapter plate in the basement.
If anybody is interested I'll sell.
I need to finance more EV projects, and the wife
is not real happy about this money coming from the
main account!! (I think Steve Clunn is familiar
with this!, maybe I need to sell some windmills :-)
Rod
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
> Internet holds lots of garbage. You can find information from late 1990's
> which has long since died, but still comes up on searches. This is old
> news.... let it die.
Yeah, no kidding. Every now and then I google my name. The last time I
did I found a message I posted to a BBS (remember those? Back BEFORE the
Internet went public.) back in 1991.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
The problem with the world is stupidity. Not saying there should be a
capital punishment for stupidity, but why don't we just take the
safety labels off of everything and let the problem solve itself?
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Jeff Shanab wrote:
I like amp-hrs cause I can compare series strings of batteries say a
50ah 120V vs a 80 ah 120V pack. I think I would have to divide wh by
voltage than multiply back by pack voltage a lot if , for example, one
pack was made of 6 volters, one of 12 volters or even 8 volters. oh,
and then there are the 1.2volters and the 3.6 volters(did I leave
anyone out?)
I don't quite follow, but you have to say [EMAIL PROTECTED] vs [EMAIL PROTECTED];
*then* I can tell how far these packs will get you. You can't compare
just 50Ah pack to 80Ah pack without specifying voltage -
it makes no sense. And, the voltage changes as you drive.
>> Agree, I meant I like batteries rated in ah so I can take a string
and quickly calculate wh of pack
The cells are "x" amp hrs reguardless of chemistry or how many are in
the box.
Ah are more useful when you talk and compare just batteries
and packs; Wh - when you talk and compare cars you actually drive.
So both units are useful, just the purpose is different.
If you just say you have 20 kWh pack, everyone
knows how far it will get you - 96V system or 336V,
also regardless of chemistry.
>> tatally agree.
> BTW is it amp * hrs or amp / hrs ?
Ah is Amps * Hours.
>> thanks, I thought so, just saw some conflicting info on an EV site.
Joules make physics calculations easy and are how Ultra caps are rated. :-)
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
What about a divide and conqure stratagy
get 2 meters and start with one on top half and one on bottom half of
pack, you can probably watch these 2 meters safely if mounted on dash.
each run out, put the meters on the top and bottom halfs of the sagging
half from the last run.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I can honestly say I've checked all the FAQs, archives, and wikis. I've
got an Advanced DC 9" (FB1-4001A) that I'm about to move from an
Oldsmobile to a Honda. I know I have to reverse the timing advance of
the brushes (because the Honda engine spins in the opposite direction).
But *how*? Do I need to drill my own holes? Just rotate the brush bell
housing? Send it somewhere, and if so, where?
Is there an easy way I could make this manually modifiable? Like a
manual choke?
Enough questions. Thanks in advance for the help.
Judebert
EVirgin
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Rod;
What are you asking for the adapter, and what transmission is it for?
Thanks;
Bob
Rod Hower wrote:
After reading Jim Coate's response I realized
I have a S10 adapter plate in the basement.
If anybody is interested I'll sell.
I need to finance more EV projects, and the wife
is not real happy about this money coming from the
main account!! (I think Steve Clunn is familiar
with this!, maybe I need to sell some windmills :-)
Rod
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Jorg Brown wrote:
>> One thing that makes the ACP drive a little more interesting is that
>> there's an insulation issue - something about the case of the motor
>> should not make electrical contact with the car chassis.
Victor Tikhonov wrote:
> It is not a problem for tzero with plastic body.
> But it will be for you if a regular car is used.
Most large motors (AC or DC) have a fairly large capacitance between
their windings and their case. With the fast rise/fall times applied by
the inverter, this capacitance creates a considerable amount of ground
current. If you have a non-isolated charger (like AC Propulsion), this
ground current makes it impossible to keep a GFCI from tripping.
AC Propulsion's solution was to unground the motor case. The motor has
to be mounted on electrically isolated mounts, and its shaft has to
likewise have some kind of non-conductive coupler. These isolated
mountings also need to have protective guards and shrouds, so water,
mud, snow, etc, cannot bridge the isolation, and so a person cannot
touch the motor casing while charging.
Meeting these requirements can be quite a challenge!
--
"Never doubt that a small group of committed people can change the
world. Indeed, it's the only thing that ever has!" -- Margaret Meade
--
Lee A. Hart 814 8th Ave N Sartell MN 56377 leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Green VW wrote:
>
> Has anyone had any luck bringing Concorde AGM's back to life. My batteries
> (4-D's) would charge up to 13.1 volts when new, but won't make it past 12.6
> now. All 10 batteries are in similar condition, no weak ones. They are 2
> years old with 150 cycles. Most cycles less than 60%. I am using a smart
> charger with powercheq regs. The charger checks out ok. Any help would be
> appreciated.
It's hard to recommend corrective actions without knowing what sort of
abuse the batteries have suffered from. Can you tell us a little more
about how they have been charged and discharged? If they only have 150
cycles in 2 years, that implies that they have been left idle for almost
all of their life. Were they sitting no-load, or on a float charger? If
a charger, at what voltage?
I have a set of Concordes in my EV. They are just over 6 years old now,
and I have only had one failure. However, I have had a pretty aggressive
battery management system for most of that time.
--
"Never doubt that a small group of committed people can change the
world. Indeed, it's the only thing that ever has!" -- Margaret Meade
--
Lee A. Hart 814 8th Ave N Sartell MN 56377 leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Christopher Zach wrote:
> Question: I need to install a 50 pin waterproof (small flexible
> conduit) connector on the front of my battery pack to measure
> voltages. The wires will have up to a 390 volt differential
> between them.
>
> What is the best source for AMP connectors like this?
Yeow! I don't think I would put all these wires into one connector! I
can't think of any single connector that has a reasonable physical size
and yet has enough insulation to safely handle 390 volts.
If you really want to do this, I would suggest something like a PC edge
connector. A 50-pin double-sided edge connector with 0.156" spacing
would be about 4" wide. Mount it about 2" deep in a slot, with a
spring-loaded door to close it. The mating connector would be a printed
circuit board, with a thick fiberglass insulator over its top and bottom
sides to prevent shorts. The fingers on this mating connector would have
to be completely inside the slot before they would touch the edge
connector contacts.
--
"Never doubt that a small group of committed people can change the
world. Indeed, it's the only thing that ever has!" -- Margaret Meade
--
Lee A. Hart 814 8th Ave N Sartell MN 56377 leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Lee Hart wrote:
Yeow! I don't think I would put all these wires into one connector! I
can't think of any single connector that has a reasonable physical size
and yet has enough insulation to safely handle 390 volts.
Will these work?
http://www.amphenol-aerospace.com/catalogs/12-020/lo/3.pdf
--
Victor
'91 ACRX - something different
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Here's the thread on the gridable-hybrid list,
http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/gridable-hybrids/message/558
and my reply:
http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/gridable-hybrids/message/577
and a similar reply (out of the thread)
http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/gridable-hybrids/message/589
Similar, here's the Ethanol Prius thread.
http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/gridable-hybrids/message/580
My point was that rather than spending millions to convert Prii
to run on Hydrogen, it would be far more practical to make them
run on Ethanol, or even LPG or CNG. But even more functional
and practical simply leave the ICE alone and add more batteries
and grid charging. This would make for a far more versitile
and potentialy clean Prius.
L8r
Ryan
PS. Some very capable people are already working on making their
Prius gridable, I expect to read about their success very soon!
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I was just looking at the EV1 maintenance manual and they use a 32 pin
connector (about .5x2 inches). It has two rows of pins. These
connectors are similar to the ones used to connect to a Magnecharger
control unit. I think Chris will know what I'm talking about, since he
can look at his MC connector.
Each of the 26 batteries is tapped with a 30.9K resistor and the wires
(which appear as a ribbon cable in the diagrams) are brought to this
connector that then plugs into the BMS. The BMS is in the battery pack
and communicates to the rest of the car serially.
The BMS has a "switch" network that charges a capacitor with each
battery. The battery voltage is measured for each battery and the
entire battery pack is scanned every 1.5 seconds.
Alex Karahalios
On Mar 30, 2004, at 10:56 PM, Lee Hart wrote:
Yeow! I don't think I would put all these wires into one connector! I
can't think of any single connector that has a reasonable physical size
and yet has enough insulation to safely handle 390 volts.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Rich Rudman has a mechanism to do that. There are photos at
http://www.manzanitamicro.com/advanced.jpg
http://www.manzanitamicro.com/retard.jpg
showing it in the advanced and retarded positions for a normal rotation.
Your rotation will be inverted from these photos. He should be able to give
you the name of the place where he got it done.
This setup should be applicable to your motor as well.
I have advised him to put a turnbuckle on it to hold it in place and make
the movement more precise. It now jumps about 5 degrees when someone pushes
on it and it tends to move on its own when subjected to extreme vibration.
His goal is to move it with a stepper motor when he gets time.
Joe Smalley
Rural Kitsap County WA
Fiesta 48 volts
NEDRA 48 volt street conversion record holder
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jude Anthony" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2004 7:41 PM
Subject: Brush timing for Hondas
> I can honestly say I've checked all the FAQs, archives, and wikis. I've
> got an Advanced DC 9" (FB1-4001A) that I'm about to move from an
> Oldsmobile to a Honda. I know I have to reverse the timing advance of
> the brushes (because the Honda engine spins in the opposite direction).
> But *how*? Do I need to drill my own holes? Just rotate the brush bell
> housing? Send it somewhere, and if so, where?
>
> Is there an easy way I could make this manually modifiable? Like a
> manual choke?
>
> Enough questions. Thanks in advance for the help.
> Judebert
> EVirgin
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Look in the November 1999 archives for any messages with "Concorde" in the
title. Lee Hart and I had some significant discussions about reviving
Concordes that month. I still have one of those batteries and it still
works. The others went when I sold my RV. My neighbor is currently using the
last one for remagnitizing his model T alternator magnets. You might call it
the neighborhood loaner.
Joe Smalley
Rural Kitsap County WA
Fiesta 48 volts
NEDRA 48 volt street conversion record holder
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
----- Original Message -----
From: "Green VW" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2004 4:42 PM
Subject: Seeking Concorde AGM advice
> Has anyone had any luck bringing Concorde AGM's back to life. My
batteries
> (4-D's) would charge up to 13.1 volts when new, but won't make it past
12.6
> now. All 10 batteries are in similar condition, no weak ones. They are 2
> years old with 150 cycles. Most cycles less than 60%. I am using a smart
> charger with powercheq regs. The charger checks out ok. Any help would be
> appreciated.
>
> Ben
>
>
> > http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/384.html
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hey Jude,
CivicWithACord here. What year and model is your
rig? I have a ton of notes on my Civic. if it is 5th
gen. (92-95) I have a video and notes that could help
IMMENSELY.
Anyway, you'll see 4 black hex head screws that you
need to pull off the bell end.
In my 8" motor (ADC), the holes were already
drilled. But there were ADDITIONAL hex head bolts (or
more properly, studs) that needed to be removed. I
couldn't see them in the dark, and stripped them out.
Not a fun experience to drill and do threaded
inserts...
Anyway, because Hondas rotate opposite, you will
rotate the silver bell housing CLOCKWISE. Stick in
the hex bolts, and you're good to go.
If you want a half-a---d diagram, get one from ADC,
or Ken Koch, but IMHO, it was only partially helpful
to a novice.
Best of success to you!
--- Joe Smalley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Rich Rudman has a mechanism to do that. There are
> photos at
> http://www.manzanitamicro.com/advanced.jpg
> http://www.manzanitamicro.com/retard.jpg
> showing it in the advanced and retarded positions
> for a normal rotation.
> Your rotation will be inverted from these photos. He
> should be able to give
> you the name of the place where he got it done.
>
> This setup should be applicable to your motor as
> well.
>
> I have advised him to put a turnbuckle on it to hold
> it in place and make
> the movement more precise. It now jumps about 5
> degrees when someone pushes
> on it and it tends to move on its own when subjected
> to extreme vibration.
> His goal is to move it with a stepper motor when he
> gets time.
>
> Joe Smalley
> Rural Kitsap County WA
> Fiesta 48 volts
> NEDRA 48 volt street conversion record holder
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Jude Anthony" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2004 7:41 PM
> Subject: Brush timing for Hondas
>
>
> > I can honestly say I've checked all the FAQs,
> archives, and wikis. I've
> > got an Advanced DC 9" (FB1-4001A) that I'm about
> to move from an
> > Oldsmobile to a Honda. I know I have to reverse
> the timing advance of
> > the brushes (because the Honda engine spins in the
> opposite direction).
> > But *how*? Do I need to drill my own holes? Just
> rotate the brush bell
> > housing? Send it somewhere, and if so, where?
> >
> > Is there an easy way I could make this manually
> modifiable? Like a
> > manual choke?
> >
> > Enough questions. Thanks in advance for the help.
> > Judebert
> > EVirgin
> >
>
=====
'92 Honda Civic sedan, 144V
(in progress)! ____
__/__|__\ __
=D-------/ - - \
'O'-----'O'-'
Would you still drive your car if the tailpipe came out of the steering wheel? Are you
saving any gas for your kids?
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance Tax Center - File online. File on time.
http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I charge AGMs (Optimas, Hawkers, SVRs, Orbitals, Concordes) at C/50 until
the voltage stops rising or two hours (whichever comes first) and then do a
discharge on them. After many cycles the capacity can come up remarkably.
My tests were not done in a series string. They were just individual
batteries.
I expect similar results for a series string. The discharge should be
shallower with a series string to avoid reversing any cells. It would be
best if you had individual battery monitoring during discharge to stop when
the first cell goes under 10.5 volts.
Joe Smalley
Rural Kitsap County WA
Fiesta 48 volts
NEDRA 48 volt street conversion record holder
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
----- Original Message -----
From: "Chris Zach" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2004 6:51 PM
Subject: Slow overcharge/float: Any thoughts?
> Question: Does anyone implement Region E type float charging on AGM
> batteries as per the Hawker literature? Basically it's holding the pack
> at a temp compensated 13.62 vpb for an extended period of time to help
> equalize the pack.
>
> Does this work? I've re-programmed my MC to try this; current draw by
> the pack is in the range of .1 to .2 amps (this after the normal charge
> at full blast to 15vpb, then taper off till current is under .5 amps,
> then take it to 15.6 vpb for 50 minutes with a limit of .5 amps)
>
> My cutoffs are stop charging if battery temp goes above 50 degrees C
> (with appropriate temp comp to lower the voltage anyway) a limit of 12
> hours, and a limit of 10 ah since this is going to happen while I sleep.
>
> Chris
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Yes, that is one symptom.
Another symptom would be a hot (or boiling) battery.
If your batteries are well hidden, it is hard to check for hot ones.
Joe Smalley
Rural Kitsap County WA
Fiesta 48 volts
NEDRA 48 volt street conversion record holder
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
----- Original Message -----
From: "Christopher Zach" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2004 9:43 AM
Subject: Symptoms of a bad battery in a string
> Question: What are the typical symptoms of a bad battery in a string?
> Does the whole pack poop out at once, or is it a plateau of downed
> performance?
>
> The Prizm pack (300 volts, 52ah) is currently down to 20ah max. As in it
> will stay above 300 [EMAIL PROTECTED] till about 15-16ah. Once it passes the
> 300 volt at 60ampp draw, the performance literally falls like a
> proverbial rock. By 20ah, the pack is dragging 260 volts at 60amps.
> However at 1ah load the pack's voltage is around 308-310 volts.
>
> Can a single bad battery in a string sink the string that much, that
> fast? Would one hear it hissing and foaming (I don't) or would it do
> something else?
>
> Chris
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Is there any problem with using a step up transformer with a zivan to
enable charging at work?
elaine
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi!
This is somewhat of a wacky question, but I've heard of farmers that
have stole power by inducing a current in large coils under the power
lines. Could a similar concept be put in place by sticking a
high-voltage, high current line under a road, and having the coils
(somewhere) in an EV? It would never happen, but the concept intrigues me.
-Ryan
--
For the best price on Zillas, visit http://www.evsource.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
As long as the transformer, wiring, and circuit breakers are rated to put
out what the charger requires, there should be no problems.
Joe Smalley
Rural Kitsap County WA
Fiesta 48 volts
NEDRA 48 volt street conversion record holder
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
----- Original Message -----
From: "elaine chiu" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2004 10:25 PM
Subject: step up transformer and zivans?
> Is there any problem with using a step up transformer with a zivan to
> enable charging at work?
>
> elaine
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
The voltage is irrelevant to an inductive pickup. It is the current in the
source wire that makes the magnetism you are exploiting. The power you get
will vary with the load on the transmission line.
Other people have used the electric field caused by the voltage to pick up
some power. The voltage is more stable and provides a more regulated power
source.
Both of them fall off quickly as the distance from source to pickup
increases.
What would you want to do with this power and how much would you want to
harvest?
Joe Smalley
Rural Kitsap County WA
Fiesta 48 volts
NEDRA 48 volt street conversion record holder
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
----- Original Message -----
From: "Ryan Bohm" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Tuesday, March 30, 2004 11:15 PM
Subject: Power lines under roads
> Hi!
>
> This is somewhat of a wacky question, but I've heard of farmers that
> have stole power by inducing a current in large coils under the power
> lines. Could a similar concept be put in place by sticking a
> high-voltage, high current line under a road, and having the coils
> (somewhere) in an EV? It would never happen, but the concept intrigues
me.
>
> -Ryan
> --
> For the best price on Zillas, visit http://www.evsource.com
>
--- End Message ---
