EV Digest 4389
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Cryogenic EVs?
by James Jarrett <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: Is there a prize....
by "Bob Rice" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Re: What conversion kits would you be interested in? (long)
by "ProEV" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Looking for Digital Pictures of Zombie Burnout.
by John Wayland <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) So Cal Tour de Sol, was Veggy oil not so off topic
by Marvin Campbell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Re: You need a welder
by Eric Poulsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) conversion platform
by Carl Clifford <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) Re: Seeking Controller for '98 Renault Express
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
9) Re: help....where can i find data about ev
by "Marco Gentilini" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: What conversion kits would you be interested in? (long)
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Re: What conversion kits would you be interested in? Gadget's proposed
new conversion shop
by Paul Wallace <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Veggy oil into electricity
by "Jeremy Longworth T L C Orchids" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Re: AC gen head off of aux shaft
by Mark Farver <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Re: You need a welder
by Reverend Gadget <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) Re: conversion platform
by "Dave" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) Re: AC gen head off of aux shaft
by Reverend Gadget <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Letter to Toyota RE: Comments to SacTo Bee- 5/24
by Marvin Campbell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Re: So Cal Tour de Sol, was Veggy oil not so off topic now toyota ev
by "darren" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Re: You need a welder
by David Dymaxion <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) Text on Motors/Controllers
by David Murphy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) Re: Seeking Controller for '98 Renault Express
by David Dymaxion <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) RE: What conversion kits would you be interested in? (long)
by David Dymaxion <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) What Kind Of Conversion Kit Would You Like To See?
by Marvin Campbell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
24) Re: What conversion kits would you be interested in? (long)
by "Alaric G. Weigle" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
25) Re: You need a welder
by Evan Tuer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
26) Re: AC gen head off of aux shaft
by "Rich Rudman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
27) Re: You need a welder
by Eric Poulsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
Stumbled across this article about a guy who is using cryogenic
processes to drastically improve the life and efficiency of automotive
parts.
I've heard a lot about this in the past, and it has mostly been positive
information.
Would any of these techniques apply to EV's? I know making the brake
drums/disks last longer is a big plus in an EV as, without regen, you
wear your brakes out a lot faster, but could there be other areas that
this would be helpful?
http://www.kfor.com/Global/story.asp?S=3390503&nav=6uy5aHLq
James
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hey Tony!
Good show! Not easy getting folks at work to go EV. In 30 years at the RR
may have gotten to guyz going, 2 other Engineers, THEY run EV's too, of the
hundreds of tons stuff. One bombed out at the welding thing, and pulling out
the dirty greasy ICE in the truck he bought to do.I sed that I'd do all THAT
for him, but he didn't want to stick me with that. That was back in my bad
old married daze, it woulda been WW3 if I brought someone ELSES truck home
to work on<g>!
That, people SEE me driving EV EVeryday, both on the turnpike" I saw ya
the other day on I-95" comments ya get alot.As well as locker room chatter
that one of ours built his own car, bla bla bla.With the RR spread all over
the coast, of course guyz interested are 300 miles away. Guyz that live 3
miles from home could giva shit less. so it's logistics, again. I think I
hava guy interested, trying to get him to sign up on the List.NOBODY should
do EVing unListed! Any OTHER Amtrakers out there, like the Left Coast, crew
guyz on the Coast Starlight or Empire Builder? Or just a good old BNFS
Freight train?Cool to see folks all over the world chiming in.With gas at
5or6 bux a gal in Norway and England, sorta surprised that this isn't a
European thing, most listers from Over There!
To bring it back home, Tony, that's impressive that many guyz in your
outfit into EV's. Maybe 'tis the more progressive mentality of West
coasters. Gees! You folks EVen tried to legislate EV's to life in CA. Long
before Governater Daze<g>!
Seeya at Power of DC.......were TRYING here!
Bob
----- Original Message -----
From: "Tony McCormick" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Thursday, May 26, 2005 1:59 AM
Subject: Is there a prize....
> Is there a prize for convincing the most people at a single employer to
> convert to EV driving, a third person at Credence, in portland, just
> bought his first EV today. Hurray!
>
> So now we have myself with a Renault Lectric Leopard I call "Lektron"
> and two of my employees, Dan, with a Cloud Geo Metro conversion
> and Tim with a pickup called "MegaVolt" ...
>
> We would have two in our California office as well, but one was a EV-1
> victim. Now he drives a Natural Gas Civic and the other drove a 'Smart"
> (I think) as a timeshare from the train station, another dead program.
>
> --
> Tony
> "Welcome to the dawn of a new error"
> http://www.notebene.net/philosophy.html
> http://www.notebene.net/ev/lektron.html
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Gadget,
Running AC motors, 280 amps (total) max regen we use 15-20% less energy on
the race track and 7-10% less energy on the street. The street driving is in
Miami which means no hills but some sudden braking for enthusiastic but
unpredictable traffic.
On the street, we use regen almost exclusively. On the track, we mix
friction braking with regen.
280 amps working through four wheels slows the car rapidly but in dry
conditions can not lock the street tires. This is about 150 ft-lbs of
negative torque.
Our set up, a motor to the front diff and a motor to the rear diff does not
have much friction drag penalty. Most people do not need the power of two
large motors so from a dollar standpoint on a street car, I would think
people could get more range for less by investing the extra money in better
batteries than using our set up. If you could find two small inexpensive
motors and controllers then it might be worth it.
Another approach. To minimize the efficiency cost of AWD, most Subarus are
front wheel cars which change to AWD when they sense wheel slip. A center
adjustable slip differential controls how much torque goes to the rear
wheels. On some Subarus, the center diff is electronically controlled. It
might not be too difficult to rig it so that it locks in AWD whenever the
brake pedal is pushed. That would be a way to get the advantages of 4 wheel
regen with one motor and minimize the drag penalty.
Cliff
www.ProEV.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Reverend Gadget" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, May 26, 2005 1:31 AM
Subject: RE: What conversion kits would you be interested in? (long)
All Subaru's are 4 wheel drive. Would the benifit of 4
wheel regen offset the added drag of 4 wheel drive?
I'd like to know. I suppose it would in performance
driving, but not on the highway.
Gadget
--- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
What about all those great Subaru vehicles being
made today? They make some
pretty good style and comfort in a compact sturdy
mold. I know that most
don't look at Subaru with much enthusiasm, but
they've come a long way in
the last few years and most are relatively small and
compact as well as
lightweight.
Jeff
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hello to All,
I'm finally setting up a Plasma Boy Racing web page, with lots of help from
willing
volunteers. Once it's all done, there will be lots of pictures of the entire
build of the
new Siamese 8 Zombie motor, as well as the entire build of the 'Yellow Beast',
Purple
Phaze's new 13 inch variable timing motor...that motor is being delivered to me
today!
There will also be a complete history of the chronological development of White
Zombie,
from the '94 Portland street drags shoot-out with Maniac Mazda (well, it was
supposed to
be a shoot-out), through the road trip races stretching from Sacramento to
Denver to Las
Vegas, to the ongoing PIR street legal drags and this summer's attempt to get
into the
mid 12's and the 107-110 mph area.
We need a fresh front angle Zombie burnout picture for the opening page, as
opposed to a
side or rear view shot like so many are. The best I've seen, is from the 2004
Woodburn
burnout I did, but it's in Bob Rice's video he sent me....great footage,
awesome looking,
and it will be included in the download-able video section we're working on,
but we need a
higher rez. still shot. I'm wondering if anyone other than Bob, captured that
scene with
digital snap shots, or, captured past burnouts from more of a front angle?
See Ya...John 'Plasma Boy' Wayland
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I'm up for it, and I know a shiat-gobload of folks over on that RAV4 EV list
that are just crazy about joining and organizing.
Their latest deal is:
www.dontcrush.org
Trying to shame Toyota into not crushing the lease return RAV4 EVs
Now if we could work chicken and beer into the mix, maybe a little
rock-n-roll...the mainstreamers wouldn't even realize our plans to
indoctrinate them into the electromotive and alternative energy ways...
Be cool if we could goad Neon John into dragging that rib wagon over from
Cleveland...:^O- Otherwise I'll bust out the big pot and fry a bunch of
turkeys for the...well...you know.
Alternative energy: good (but hold the patchouli)
Marv
Culver City
> From: Reverend Gadget <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Date: Wed, 25 May 2005 22:34:57 -0700 (PDT)
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: Re: So Cal Tour de Sol, was Veggy oil not so off topic
>
> I'd love to see some thing like that on the left coast
> here, I wish I had the time right now. I could help
> facilitate and get publicity for an event like this.
> I'll ask around and see who I might know who would
> like to help organize something like this.
>
> Gadget
>
> --- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>> In a message dated 5/25/2005 7:32:39 PM Pacific
>> Standard Time,
>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
>>
>> << >HOW CAN WE GET SOMETHING LIKE THE Tour De Soul
>> out
>> west. anyone interested???
>> lets put our energy toward this
>> if its too off topic we can ove it or just use
>> email
>> untill interest is polled
>> keith
>>>>
>> I think thats a great idea.
>> The only public ev deal we have in San Diego is the
>> Earth Day at Balboa Park.
>> That holds absolutely no interest for my students.
>> They thrive on action and
>> motion and the fair is an idle-fest that bores them
>> to tears and misbehavior.
>> If we had a bonafide event to work towards each
>> year, interest and
>> participation would soar and I *might* be able to
>> keep my ev program alive a while
>> longer.
>> Anyone else from Southern California want to step up
>> and start organizing?
>> Ben
>>
>>
>
> visit my website at www.reverendgadget.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
body of the car or fabricate something (like the battery boxes) from sheet
metal. Stick, flux-core, and gas welding are unsuitable for thin sheet (less
than 1/8 inch.)
Gas welding is certainly NOT unsuitable for thin sheet. When I learned
oxy-acetylene, it was by welding together 18 gauge sheet steel, which is
(nominally) .048" (or .040 for "American" gauge). I could join two
sheets at 90 degrees, and the bead width was only about 1.5 times the
thickness of the sheets, with no burn-through or sagging on the inside
corner.
It's even possible to weld thin sheet to thicker plate, if you're
careful and use the correct technique.
Using the correct tip size and gas flow rate is essential.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I frequently search ebay on "needs engine" looking for donor vehicles. There
is almost always a Dodge Intrepid in the results list. I know this vehicle is
too big and heavy to be a good candidate and they tend to be automatics, but if
there is another recent make that has a similar tendency toward catastrophic
engine failure (or towards teenagers over-revving them), we should look at that
for a conversion kit.
On another topic, does anyone that bought those BB600's have them powering a
vehicle yet? Results?
Thanks
Carl Clifford
Denver
grinless
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
<< I know this would be expensive, but how about a pair of Zilla Z1k
controllers, one for the field, one for the armature? >>
Not just expensive, kind of wasteful! The field current is 8A max, and its
voltage is usually much lower than the armature - my 48V Curtis SepEx put out
15V to the field. Also, the motor itself was marked 21kw max at 108V, or 200A,
and even the lowest output Curtis 36-80V SepEx hits 400A, so Curtis didn't want
him using theirs probably based solely on the operating voltage. Short of the
ZAPI SEM3, couldn't he use one of those motor controller kits for the field?
I've seen 5A/100V kits, so it's just in need of higher value parts. I think Lee
mentioned some control scheme like this for sepex.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Well, thanks James.
I would like to know the energetic efficiency of an electric vehicle.
I don't want to build it, but however I have to plan it!
I need to put together a possible drivetrain and then to find the data
related to the weight, volume, efficiency, power... for each of drivetrain
component.
Which do you hold both to be the good drivetrain?
Induction motor?
Batteries to the litio?
and the change?
If can give me suggestions and information on the data would make indeed me
like!
Sorry for my English!
Ciao
Marco
----- Original Message -----
From: "James Massey" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 4:49 AM
Subject: Re: help....where can i find data about ev
> At 10:05 PM 24/05/05 +0200, you wrote:
> >Hi i'm Marco from Italy,
> >I'm studing ev but i have some matter about finding data!
> >Can you help me?
> >Where can i find data about Ac induction Motor squirrel cage? I need
> >power, weight, cost, torque, rpm, output.....
> >Thanks Marco
>
> Hi Marco
>
> Welcome to the Electric Vehicle Discussion List. There are over 1000
people
> on this list from all over the world, ranging from beginners to very
> experienced, and most are pleased to help where possible.
>
> There are many manufacturers' of induction motors who have data on the
web,
> a search engine should turn up specifications.
>
> More important, perhaps you should be looking at, and asking questions
> about, electric vehicle motors and transmissions (gearboxes and
> drive-lines). The types used and the advantages and disadvantages of the
> different permutations and ways of setting up the systems.
>
> Perhaps you could start by telling us what you are doing relative to
> electric vehicles? Are you planning to build a vehicle? If so, what are
> your intentions as regards to how far do you need it to travel, how fast,
> how many passengers, cargo?
>
> Here to help.
>
> James (in Australia)
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Someone made a Justy hybrid it think. LR.........
----- Original Message -----
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Wednesday, May 25, 2005 10:05 PM
Subject: RE: What conversion kits would you be interested in? (long)
What about all those great Subaru vehicles being made today? They make
some
pretty good style and comfort in a compact sturdy mold. I know that most
don't look at Subaru with much enthusiasm, but they've come a long way in
the last few years and most are relatively small and compact as well as
lightweight.
Jeff
David Dymaxion wrote:
Here is an ad hoc list of cars still in production that I think will
change less rapidly than others:
Trucks
Jeeps
VW Beetle
Audi TT
Ford Mustang
It could be a great thing if you thought towards kitting (or
publishing detailed plans).
--- Mark Farver <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
The topics of conversion over the last few days have got me back to
thinking about conversion kits again. At shows over the last few
years
I have had a dozen or so "checkbook in hand" offers to convert a
vehicle. These people wanted an EV, but were unable to build a
"custom"
conversion (a large percentage were women, interesting enough). I
had
to turn them down, since the several hundred hours of time to
"custom"
convert a vehicle was beyond their budget or patience.
Most of these potential drivers were just interested in having an
EV,
and often even made offers to purchase whatever I was showing.
I've
lost track of the number of "handy" people who have been
interested, but
lacked the metal fabrication and design skills to do a full
conversion.
There are a lot of reason why the Volts/Rabbit/Porsche and S10 kits
are
pretty much all we have. Cars come in much greater varieties
today, and
manufacturers often make radical changes from year to year. Buying
a
car to remove and essentially discard a bunch of stuff is never
going to
be too cost effective.
Still, I remember the fun of assembling kits, or doing "bolt on"
mods to
my car. I know doing custom welding and design are more
challenging and
I should feel proud of "doing it all" when making a good
conversion. In
the end, I think I've generally received more enjoyment out of the
"bolt
in" stuff. Sure it's easier, but it looks good when done, and the
job
finishes quicker and I have a lot less frustrating "do it over" and
"I
should have done it X" moments. Most people you show the car to do
not
really appreciate the extra skill and effort it took to do it from
scratch.
Anyhow I think my next conversion will be the basis for a kit. The
goal
will be a minimal drilling and cutting, bolt in, snap together
wiring,
type kit, that can be installed by someone with average auto repair
skills. My standards for a conversion are not quite John Wayland
"show"
quality, but I come fairly close. The kit will use standard
conversion
components where possible, with mounting adapters and custom
harnesses
wherever need to simplify installation.
So ignoring all the reasons why this will not work, excessive cost,
or
is just plain a dumb idea:
------
From this year's new car models what would you most want as a new
EV?
------
I have been looking to the economy end of the spectrum for the
first
kit. Something with four doors, a low new cost, lightweight with
enough space for hardware and people. The compact trucks are
always a
good choice, but most of manufacturer's do not offer anything more
than
two seats in the less than $17k range. (On the plus side the truck
platforms usually undergo slower changes than cars, and are usually
are
easier to convert) A truck kit would probably be a future project.
Obviously trying to select one car as "perfect" will be nearly
impossible but I'm looking for a good compromise choice to get
going.
My first pick is the Mazda 3, it is fairly roomy for a small car
and is
built in conjunction with Volvo atop an excellent platform.
Available
in an economy sedan trim for about $14k MSRP and power trim sedan
and
wagon versions for about $17k. A/C and electro hydraulic power
steering
are standard in the economy trim (unlike the Honda Civic), as are
few
neat features like power adjustable pedals. Fuel economy is near
the
top of its class, only lagging behind the hybrids and diesels.
Most
auto reviews place it in the top of economy car class for handling,
features and build quality.
Parts availability is moderate, Mazda has been sharing a lot of
parts
with Ford since their partnership. Mazda is not a struggling
company
per se, but they do have one of the lowest sales volumes in the US,
and
hence good incentives (0% financing, rebates, and an easy to get
into
fleet purchase program). The Mazda 3 is about 1 year old, long
enough
to work out the bugs, young enough there should be no major changes
to
the platform for a few years. (The dealer said they have only been
told
that the AC system will change to a R-134 alternative next year.)
Other contenders might be the radical looking but spacious Scion xB
and
xA, the high resale value Honda Civic, Toyota Corolla or from the
American's the Chevy Aveo or Ford Focus.
So let me know your thoughts and feel free to mail me privately if
you'd
like.
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Gadget,
a small suggestion. If you start a shop, how about considering pusher
trailer rentals? You could set up all of your conversions with the
wiring harness and receiver hitch to support bio diesel pushers. Then
build a couple of them and rent them out. You should also consider
battery pack leasing or extended battery warranty plans.
As for the name, great choice!!
Paul Wallace
'91 Chevy S-10 full of SAFT nicads
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
You can charge your EV and produce your own power for your home using veg
oil in a diesel genset
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=11754&item=7518195447&rd=1
http://www.utterpower.com/
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Reverend Gadget wrote:
I have the gen head directly coupled to the motor. I
had originally planned on having the gen controlled by
a big relay but after much thinking I think it would
be better to just have it hooked to the PFC 20
directly and only have it regen by turning up the
current control. That should take care of any big
spikes from switching a relay. In theory the PFC would
be ready to go just waiting for a signal from the
slide pot to up the current. I'm hoping that the
amount of resistance required to power up the PFC
would be more than offset by the amount of power that
I will be able recoup through regen.
Will the PFC be ok with the "wild" frequency coming off the gen head?
While the design is probably pretty tolerate there might be some limits,
and I doubt Rich has tested for anything but 60hz-DC input.
Mark
Gadget
visit my website at www.reverendgadget.com
!DSPAM:42955fd75137140919134!
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
The condition you state, thin sheets at 90 degrees, is
the only one that really works well with a torch. try
butting together two flat panels and the result will
look like a weight lifters stomach. There is no one
correct way to weld anything, and there are acceptions
to every rule.
Gadget
--- Eric Poulsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>
> >body of the car or fabricate something (like the
> battery boxes) from sheet
> >metal. Stick, flux-core, and gas welding are
> unsuitable for thin sheet (less
> >than 1/8 inch.)
> >
>
> Gas welding is certainly NOT unsuitable for thin
> sheet. When I learned
> oxy-acetylene, it was by welding together 18 gauge
> sheet steel, which is
> (nominally) .048" (or .040 for "American" gauge). I
> could join two
> sheets at 90 degrees, and the bead width was only
> about 1.5 times the
> thickness of the sheets, with no burn-through or
> sagging on the inside
> corner.
>
> It's even possible to weld thin sheet to thicker
> plate, if you're
> careful and use the correct technique.
>
> Using the correct tip size and gas flow rate is
> essential.
>
>
visit my website at www.reverendgadget.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Older Hyundais come to mind. The Mitzu engine seemed to be a short-lived
piece at best. And there are, or were, millions.
David C. Wilker Jr. USAF (RET)
Children need love, especially when they do not deserve it.
- Harold S.
Hulbert
----- Original Message -----
From: "Carl Clifford" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, May 26, 2005 8:04 AM
Subject: conversion platform
I frequently search ebay on "needs engine" looking for donor vehicles.
There is almost always a Dodge Intrepid in the results list. I know this
vehicle is too big and heavy to be a good candidate and they tend to be
automatics, but if there is another recent make that has a similar tendency
toward catastrophic engine failure (or towards teenagers over-revving
them), we should look at that for a conversion kit.
On another topic, does anyone that bought those BB600's have them powering
a vehicle yet? Results?
Thanks
Carl Clifford
Denver
grinless
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
The frequency shouldn't be that wild. even at 7000 rpm
the frequency should not be over 120 hz. the gen head
is rated for 60 hz at 3600 rpm. Rich said that the PFC
starts really working at about 100 volts which works
out to about 1500 motor rpm. one of the reasons I'm
doing this is that I have some long hills to drive
down and having regen could make driving a lot safer
and more pleasurable, as well give the brakes a decent
life. riding the brakes on a small overloaded car as a
regular drive is not my idea of fun. really this is
just an experiment, the gen head is cheap and I want
to go AC on the next one.
Gadget
--- Mark Farver <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Reverend Gadget wrote:
>
> > I have the gen head directly coupled to the motor.
> I
> >had originally planned on having the gen controlled
> by
> >a big relay but after much thinking I think it
> would
> >be better to just have it hooked to the PFC 20
> >directly and only have it regen by turning up the
> >current control. That should take care of any big
> >spikes from switching a relay. In theory the PFC
> would
> >be ready to go just waiting for a signal from the
> >slide pot to up the current. I'm hoping that the
> >amount of resistance required to power up the PFC
> >would be more than offset by the amount of power
> that
> >I will be able recoup through regen.
> >
> >
> >
> Will the PFC be ok with the "wild" frequency coming
> off the gen head?
> While the design is probably pretty tolerate there
> might be some limits,
> and I doubt Rich has tested for anything but 60hz-DC
> input.
>
> Mark
>
>
>
> > Gadget
> >
> >visit my website at www.reverendgadget.com
> >
> >
> >!DSPAM:42955fd75137140919134!
> >
> >
> >
>
>
visit my website at www.reverendgadget.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Dear Mr. Funo:
We own two RAV4 EVs, and it is with great sadness that I see your own
spokesperson defame what is undeniably one of the greatest automobiles
designed to date.
Though we, the technically literate, know that electromotive propulsion
technology is here to stay- much to the great chagrin of those trying to
maintain the internal combustion status-quo- it's such a shame that an
entire industry must be dragged, kicking and screaming, into the 21st
century.
It's only a short matter of time before the general population becomes privy
to the knowledge that the technology which propels every modern train in the
world, is the same technology which would allow us the luxury of
zero-emission, energy-efficient vehicles.
And when that time comes, there will be a public backlash against those
companies that have overtly demonstrated a lack of moral fortitude in
pursuit of short-term profit, at the detriment of not only our environment,
but the very security of our nation.
We believe that time will show your abandonment of the all-electric vehicle
program to be a costly mistake for all of us.
Very Sincerely,
J. Marvin Campbell
Mea Combs
4248 Vinton Ave.
Culver City, CA 90232
310.838.0131
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Their latest deal is:
www.dontcrush.org
Trying to shame Toyota into not crushing the lease return RAV4 EVs
didn't toyota just say they are making a pile of new EVs, someone told me
they heard this on the news last week
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Disclaimer: I have only welded a couple times, and poorly at that!
Anyway, a book I have "Performance Welding" claims TIG is easier
(contrary to the Miller site and informed opinions on this list). It
gives some additional reasons I don't recall seeing in the debates so
far:
Flux core MIG tends to splatter more
You have to chip off slag every time you stop flux core MIG,
might be 20 to 30 times on a tube weld
Smoke and the torch design makes MIG harder to see the weld
Once you start MIG you can't change speeds
One off welding (like race cars) tends to be TIG welded, MIG is
faster for production
MIG welds start off cold for the first fraction of an inch
MIG welds are more brittle at the start and stop, since the
shielding gas gets turned on and off with the arc.
Question, do any race bodies restrict using MIG vs. TIG vs. gas
welding?
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Folks,
I'm wondering if anyone would have a suggestion on a book to educate
oneself about the theory and operation of electric motors and their
control. I've read Bob Brant's 'Build your Own Electric Vehicle' which
has a chapter on motors and another on controllers - but I'm looking
for something more detailed and thorough. Any suggestions?
Thanks,
David
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
What about having one controller on both the field and armature in
parallel. Once to 100% duty cycle, connect the armature directly to
the battery, and continue to speed up by decreasing the field with
the controller. You'd have to have some extra control circuitry to do
the switching, increase the current to go faster at first then
decrease to go faster, and to watch for overcurrent and overspeed
(suddenly cutting out the current to the field can overspeed the
motor).
--- James Massey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> At 11:17 AM 26/05/05 +0100, Paul Compton wrote:
> >-- Original message --
> >From: "Evan Tuer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > > http://www.elektrosistem.com/ make a 96V sep-ex control.
> > > It might be OK on a 108V nicad system, if anything will be a
> problem I
> > > think that the field current is a bit lower than this unit
> expects. A
> > > resitive load in parallel might be required.
> >
> >I remember Rob at AVT having this problem with a Zapi controller,
> even
> >after going back to Electrofit Zapi several times for
> re-programming. It'
> >almost certainly possible to reconnect the field coils in parallel
> to
> >better suit the available controllers.
>
> I know this would be expensive, but how about a pair of Zilla Z1k
> controllers, one for the field, one for the armature?
>
> Otmar, I believe that you can run a pair together for dual motors,
> would it
> be horrendous to rewrite the code so that a pair can behave in a
> suitable
> manner for a sepex?
>
> I don't know if the regen current across the armature controller
> would be a
> problem?
>
> Alternatively someone may be game enough to build a unit that
> monitors
> motor RPMs and throttle position and generates two throttle command
>
> voltages for two seperate hairballs.
>
> Just throwing up an idea...
>
> James
>
>
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Good thought, Subaru WRX would be a candidate. Certainly the Mini has
quite a following.
The thing I would fear about most cars is "here today, gone
tomorrow."
How many 1st gen Honda civics do you see? How much do they
mechanically have in common with new Civics?
How many 1st gen Toyota Celicas do you see? How many parts do they
have in common with a new Celica? I think near zero.
Popularity does not equal longevity. I think enthusiast cars are a
better bet if you want to make a kit that is still viable 10 or 20
years from now.
For parts and maintenance, you are probably better off with a
conversion of an old VW bug than the Dodge Omni or Escort
conversions.
So in light of the enthusiast/longevity point of view, I'd think Mini
Coopers, Mustangs, and VW Beetles would be top candidates.
--- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> What about all those great Subaru vehicles being made today? They
> make some
> pretty good style and comfort in a compact sturdy mold. I know
> that most
> don't look at Subaru with much enthusiasm, but they've come a long
> way in
> the last few years and most are relatively small and compact as
> well as
> lightweight.
>
> >David Dymaxion wrote:
> >Here is an ad hoc list of cars still in production that I think
> will
> >change less rapidly than others:
>
> > Trucks
> > Jeeps
> > VW Beetle
> > Audi TT
> > Ford Mustang
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hey Gadget:
Looks like they've been all over the "PT Cruiser-type" idea in Europe for
years. Here's a Citroen "mini-van":
www.tuer.co.uk/evs2/myev.html
(Thanks, Evan!)
And Renault has a similar one too.
The Scion xB looks like it would work well...hey, what up, ACP?
Must be nice cruising the Scottish highlands wearing an EV grin!
Marv (CAMPBELL)
Culver City
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
The Mazda 3 is a decent selection. Of the Scions, I'd actually
recommend the Tc. The Tc is based on the Camry platform, but costs
less, looks nicer, handles well, and doesn't weigh quite as much. It is
also a bit cheaper than the Mazda 3.
Any popular import sedan/hatcback is a good choice given the large
selection of aftermarket upgrades available, including lightening kits.
The Civic series is probably the best choice in that realm.
Stay away from any of the less stylish econo-boxes. That is exactly the
image that EV's are trying to overcome. We want folks to think of
vehicles that have some style and performance well when they think of
EV's. Additionally, most individuals are less willing to pay a premium
for plain looking vehicle, electric or not.
Subaru would be a great idea, if you can handle the jump in up front
cost. And if you feel comfortable moving to a $18-$25K vehicle then a
whole host of other options open up including higher end Toyota cars,
Acura's, the new Saturn Sky and Pontiac Solstice (really nice looking
convertibles for relatively cheap), BMW's Mini, the Mustang, the GTO;
etc. Weight will be an interesting thing to tackle. If you pick a
heavier vehicle, look for ones used in drag racing a lot as they are
more likely to have fiberglass replacement body panels available to help
bring the weight down.
-Alaric
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On 5/26/05, David Dymaxion <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Disclaimer: I have only welded a couple times, and poorly at that!
>
> Anyway, a book I have "Performance Welding" claims TIG is easier
> (contrary to the Miller site and informed opinions on this list). It
> gives some additional reasons I don't recall seeing in the debates so
> far:
>
> Flux core MIG tends to splatter more
>
> You have to chip off slag every time you stop flux core MIG,
> might be 20 to 30 times on a tube weld
Flux core. Never used it, but I don't think these drawbacks apply to
gas-shield MIG.
> Smoke and the torch design makes MIG harder to see the weld
A bit subjective that one, but possible I suppose.
> Once you start MIG you can't change speeds
Why would you want to? You can stop and start at will, and you could
always turn the feed dial with your spare hand if you really wanted!
> One off welding (like race cars) tends to be TIG welded, MIG is
> faster for production
a bit irrelevant this one :)
> MIG welds start off cold for the first fraction of an inch
Operator technique?
> MIG welds are more brittle at the start and stop, since the
> shielding gas gets turned on and off with the arc.
That's not really true, on my Mig at least, gas comes out when you
begin to squeeze the trigger, well before the wire feed cuts in. In
this way you can weld into dodgy corners by squirting a lot of gas in
first.
I'm not a welding expert, and this is getting off-topic, but the
bottom line is that MIG is a very easy technique to pick up, uses
cheap equipment and produces generally OK results even by
non-professionals. If it's not quite as good as TIG in particular
circumstances, fine, but for ease of use it's pretty unbeatable.
I would not hesitate to recommend someone to buy a MIG welder to do an
EV conversion. Learn a new skill, and save money doing it!
Regards
Evan
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
We say 40 to 90 Hz, or lower Even DC. Our PFC circuit locks to the incoming
Grid frequency. This is good to about 100Hz, then things get confused.
What you REALLY need to protect for is the inadvertant greater than 240
spike or over run.
Keeping the 15 volt rail HOT while not having any available Grid is OK...
Then having the PFC see increasing voltages as the regen comes online is a
good control loop.
The PFC20s looks like a 5 ohm load up to about 100 volts then they go
constant power. We can adjust this some if needed. Having the charger set to
full amps and then adding Grid is going to load the Genset really hard and
really fast. This should be just what you want.
How come I get this feeling, a few rebuilds are in the future....???
Stay safe guys, and let me know how it goes.
Rich Rudman
Manzanita Micro
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mark Farver" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, May 26, 2005 9:01 AM
Subject: Re: AC gen head off of aux shaft
> Reverend Gadget wrote:
>
> > I have the gen head directly coupled to the motor. I
> >had originally planned on having the gen controlled by
> >a big relay but after much thinking I think it would
> >be better to just have it hooked to the PFC 20
> >directly and only have it regen by turning up the
> >current control. That should take care of any big
> >spikes from switching a relay. In theory the PFC would
> >be ready to go just waiting for a signal from the
> >slide pot to up the current. I'm hoping that the
> >amount of resistance required to power up the PFC
> >would be more than offset by the amount of power that
> >I will be able recoup through regen.
> >
> >
> >
> Will the PFC be ok with the "wild" frequency coming off the gen head?
> While the design is probably pretty tolerate there might be some limits,
> and I doubt Rich has tested for anything but 60hz-DC input.
>
> Mark
>
>
>
> > Gadget
> >
> >visit my website at www.reverendgadget.com
> >
> >
> >!DSPAM:42955fd75137140919134!
> >
> >
> >
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Well, for battery boxes ... works great! And yes, you can also do thin
section butt, lap and tee welds. I think you're referring to the
tendency of the metal to warp with shrinkage as it cools, but this can
be minimized.
Reverend Gadget wrote:
The condition you state, thin sheets at 90 degrees, is
the only one that really works well with a torch. try
butting together two flat panels and the result will
look like a weight lifters stomach. There is no one
correct way to weld anything, and there are acceptions
to every rule.
Gadget
--- Eric Poulsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
body of the car or fabricate something (like the
battery boxes) from sheet
metal. Stick, flux-core, and gas welding are
unsuitable for thin sheet (less
than 1/8 inch.)
Gas welding is certainly NOT unsuitable for thin
sheet. When I learned
oxy-acetylene, it was by welding together 18 gauge
sheet steel, which is
(nominally) .048" (or .040 for "American" gauge). I
could join two
sheets at 90 degrees, and the bead width was only
about 1.5 times the
thickness of the sheets, with no burn-through or
sagging on the inside
corner.
It's even possible to weld thin sheet to thicker
plate, if you're
careful and use the correct technique.
Using the correct tip size and gas flow rate is
essential.
visit my website at www.reverendgadget.com
--- End Message ---
