EV Digest 4405
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: Slashdot article on "New Electric Motor Design"
by "Andre' Blanchard" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) NO ATTACHMENTS please!
by Marvin Campbell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Re: Alfa Romeo EV Conversion
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) RE: Selling scooters, Cal Law change
by "Rodriguez, Jennifer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: FW: Alfa Romeo EV Conversion
by "Tim Humphrey" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Re: Alfa Romeo Conversion
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Re: Selling scooters, Cal Law change
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) Re: Blue Meanie Amazes V8 Owner. Gear oil problem.
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) Re: Evercels - What to do with them?
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: Slashdot article on "New Electric Motor Design"
by John Lussmyer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Re: Blue Meanie Amazes V8 Owner. Gear oil problem.
by Ryan Stotts <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Re: Motor abuse? (was: RE: 9" Warp motor for drag racing)
by "Philippe Borges" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Re: Kokams BMS
by "ProEV" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) opinions needed a bit quick
by reb <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) opinion needed quick
by reb <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) EVLN(Toyota's closed-end leases prevent RAV4 EV purchases)-LONG
by bruce parmenter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) EVLN(Cool Electric Ride Gets Top Prize)
by bruce parmenter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) EVLN(St. Mark's earns multiple honors at Tour de Sol)
by bruce parmenter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) EVLN(Welsh car team pioneer electric dream)
by bruce parmenter <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
May be funny that is how electric motors were first built.
Here are some interesting pages on old electric motor ideas.
http://www.sparkmuseum.com/MOTORS.HTM
http://physics.kenyon.edu/EarlyApparatus/Electric_Motors/Reciprocating_Motor/Reciprocating_Motor.html
All kinds of neat stuff available from the home page of that site.
http://www.dself.dsl.pipex.com/MUSEUM/POWER/eleceng/eleceng.htm
____________
Andre' B.
At 01:33 PM 6/2/2005, you wrote:
Sounds almost like coils drive solenoids linked
to a crank shaft much line cylinders arranged
in I4 or V6 engine, just solenoids instead
of cylinders... That would be funny motor...
If coils arranged in circle and activated
by polyphase sequence, the rotation can be
quite smooth. 400% torque? Sure, all depends
on the crank size!
Victor
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Come on, John. Shoulders down, man!
Your inadvertent post simply coincided with a time that David chose to
review list traffic. He saw it, and acted accordingly, just as he has done
when I posted bestiality-themed MPEGS.
I know for a fact that actual minutes and hours, (days! weeks!:^O) sometimes
go by without David checking the list.
BTW, I'm coming down to get me some of that BBQ. When's the all-you-can-eat
special?
EV-Related Stuff: I heard a rumor Gadget might be converting a '37 Plymouth.
Can you say, "stately acceleration"?
Marv
> From: Neon John <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Date: Thu, 02 Jun 2005 01:46:27 -0400
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: Re: NO ATTACHMENTS please!
>
> On Thu, 02 Jun 2005 01:25:31 -0400, "David Roden" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
>
>> Please DO NOT send file attachments to the EV list.
>>
>> DEFINITELY don't send large ones!
>
> You know, you really are a jerk. I meant that to go directly to Stu,
> screwed up and sent it to the list by mistake. Before I could even
> get an appology out, you jump in with this crap. I know you're
> sitting there with a hair trigger waiting to scold me and a few others
> but geez, this is ridiculous.
>
> To everyone else, my appologies for sending that attachment to the
> list. Pure wasted bandwidth since the picture was of low quality.
>
> John
> ---
> John De Armond
> See my website for my current email address
> http://www.johngsbbq.com
> Cleveland, Occupied TN
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Lee writes:
>>> - The huge battery cables are excessive for 12v batteries.
>> What size would you recommend? It has 2/0 now.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> I'd certainly not go to the trouble to replace them. If you replace
> them with SAE lugs (recommended), just lop off the ring terminals
> and crimp on the lugs.
I agree. Since you already have them, there's no need to replace the
cables. But I would change the ends to automotive post connectors (I
think your batteries have both automotive posts and 5/16" studs). I'm
worried that the 5/16" studs won't hold up.
--
If you would not be forgotten
When your body's dead and rotten
Then write of great deeds worth the reading
Or do the great deeds worth repeating
-- Ben Franklin, Poor Richard's Almanac
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Cowtown wrote:
"In addition, you're worse off than NEVs, which can't go faster than
25mph on
anything posted faster than 35mph:
-- Infraction per Section 21235(b): Operating a motorized scooter on
a
highway with a posted speed limit in excess of 25 miles per hour unless
the
motorized scooter is operated within a bicycle lane.
-- Infraction per Section 22411: No person shall operate a motorized
scooter
at a speed in excess of 15 miles per hour."
Unless you have bike plenty of lanes around, in which case, you're a lot
better off than an NEV because they are not allowed in bike lanes. This
is why I got a moped-class scooter, instead of an NEV. I commute to
work on a 45mph expressway, but I ride in the bike lane. Works great!
Jenn
Yellow EVT 4000e
Santa Clara, CA
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
And, don't use a grinder or anything else with a flame or sparks to remove
those studs. (BTDT)
The sawzall worked good. The grinder was...well... explosively fast.
John's suggestion to "lop off" is a good one. Implying of course, to use bolt
cutters.
--
Stay Charged!
Hump
"Ignorance is treatable, with a good prognosis. However, if left untreated, it
develops into Arrogance, which is often
fatal. :-)" -- Lee Hart
Get your own FREE evgrin.com email address;
send a request to ryan at evsourcecom
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
> Behalf Of Lee Hart
> Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2005 4:23 PM
> To: [email protected]
> Subject: Re: Alfa Romeo EV Conversion
>
> Lee writes:
>>>> - The huge battery cables are excessive for 12v batteries.
>>> What size would you recommend? It has 2/0 now.
>
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
>> I'd certainly not go to the trouble to replace them. If you replace
>> them with SAE lugs (recommended), just lop off the ring terminals and
>> crimp on the lugs.
>
> I agree. Since you already have them, there's no need to replace the cables.
> But I would change the ends to automotive post connectors (I think your
> batteries have both automotive posts and 5/16" studs). I'm worried that the
> 5/16" studs won't hold up.
> --
> If you would not be forgotten
> When your body's dead and rotten
> Then write of great deeds worth the reading Or do the great deeds worth
> repeating
> -- Ben Franklin, Poor Richard's Almanac
> --
> Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Lee Hart wrote:
>> good pots are expensive. A good one that's sealed and has a high
>> rotational life will cost you $10-$20.
Victor Tikhonov wrote:
> How about $150 for special Bosch one (which practically never fails)?
I assume that includes all the mounting hardware and packaging (which
probably costs more than the pot inside).
> BTW, what exactly is meant by "rotational life?
They have a concise definition. Basically, it means that the resistance
will still be within some percentage accuracy after X mechanical
rotation cycles. The pot fails if the wiper contact's resistance goes
out of spec.
Pots don't usually fail due the bearing wearing out. They fail because
the moving wiper contact wears off particles of the resistance element.
This either changes the resistance too much, or causes momentary "open
circuits" as the wiper bumps over the bits of debris on the resistance
element.
In audio equipment, this causes scratchy noises as the control is
rotated. In an EV, it causes abrupt lurches and speed changes for tiny
throttle movements.
--
If you would not be forgotten
When your body's dead and rotten
Then write of great deeds worth the reading
Or do the great deeds worth repeating
-- Ben Franklin, Poor Richard's Almanac
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I also think the protection given was overly protective. The orginal law
was fine. It treated scooters 18mph and less as a bicycle. Now my kids
can't legally ride on the street. These scooters are slower than bicycles
half the time. What a waste and now I have to part with them. Lawrence
Rhodes........
----- Original Message -----
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "EV Discussion List" <[email protected]>
Sent: Wednesday, June 01, 2005 10:53 PM
Subject: Re: Selling scooters, Cal Law change
<<< When all these low powered vehicles came out the cops didn't know what
to do
as the Zappys were considered bicycles. They did like 9mph. In the old
book motor assist bikes could go 18 mph with no problem. PROBLEM. Every
single class of scooter was modable and now because of the carnage you
must
be licensed. LR>>>
Here's what is listed now in the CA Drivers' Handbook:
-- Class M1: You may operate any 2-wheel motorcycle or motor driven
cycle.
-- Class M2: You may operate any motorized bicycle, or moped, or any
bicycle
with an attached motor.
-- NOTE: Class M1 or M2 is added to any other class license after
passing law
and skill tests.
-- NOTE: Starting January 1, 2005, a Class C license is required to
operate a
motorized scooter.]
In addition, you're worse off than NEVs, which can't go faster than 25mph
on
anything posted faster than 35mph:
-- Infraction per Section 21235(b): Operating a motorized scooter on a
highway with a posted speed limit in excess of 25 miles per hour unless
the
motorized scooter is operated within a bicycle lane.
-- Infraction per Section 22411: No person shall operate a motorized
scooter
at a speed in excess of 15 miles per hour.
Of course, whether a cop will know all this stuff is kind of a crapshoot;
my
town has cracked down on pocket bikes, so *they* keep up to date. Stock
stuff
will fly under their radar, and at least you don't have to license
scooters or
e-bikes, so the new CA laws keep these away from the unlicensed (kids and
those
who won't or can't get one) - not really draconian, more like overly
protective.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
The diff. is smallish to start with and has very little drag, plus, it
has synthetic lighter gear oil in it that really reduced the drag. The wheel
bearings are
all in top shape. The tranny also has Royal Purple synthetic gear oil to
reduce drag
My Courier/Mazda 1980 tranny specifies 90 weight with E. P. I was told by
Ames Oil that they can't meet this spec. Anybody know what to replace this
oil with if you go synthetic? There is an oil recommended for the
differential. LR........
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I remember someone on the list was using them with some success. Lawrence
Rhodes....
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
At 11:03 AM 6/2/2005, you wrote:
From IC Wales, "the national website of Wales"
http://tinyurl.com/av555
And here is the (probable) patent on the idea:
http://v3.espacenet.com/textdoc?DB=EPODOC&IDX=WO0156140&F=0&QPN=WO0156140
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Lawrence wrote:
>
> My Courier/Mazda 1980 tranny specifies 90 weight with E. P. I was told by
> AMSOIL that they can't meet this spec. Anybody know what to replace this
> oil with if you go synthetic? There is an oil recommended for the
> differential.
Here's some EP spec synthetic:
http://www.royalpurple.com/prodsi/syner.html
http://www.royalpurple.com/pdfsi/synerps.pdf
You should be able to get it locally:
http://www.royalpurple.com/dealers/caa.html
Also, this pdf mentions "ShockProof EP Gear Oil"
http://www.redlineoil.com/whitePaper/10.pdf
http://www.redlineoil.com/products_gearlubricants.asp?subcatID=20
You should be able to get either brand at most auto parts stores.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
We are talking about motorbike, their aerodynamic are crapy !
Speed will kill your range increasing consumption to levels where lead can't
give usable range, though drag race is ok :^)
I use 37V50Ah nicad (65kg):
at 80km/h speed my scooter eat his 1850Wh reserve in 40km, this give about
46Wh/km > 4600Wh/100km YES its not a typo !
to go 40km at 160km/h i will need 4 time this reserve
to go 20km, 2 times
make calculation, speed on a motorbike is possible but not long.
Here start the obligation to go lithium, take less space, less weight, more
energy...
Philippe
Et si le pot d'�chappement sortait au centre du volant ?
quel carburant choisiriez-vous ?
http://vehiculeselectriques.free.fr
Forum de discussion sur les v�hicules �lectriques
http://vehiculeselectriques.free.fr/Forum/index.php
----- Original Message -----
From: "Chris Tromley" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2005 7:45 PM
Subject: RE: Motor abuse? (was: RE: 9" Warp motor for drag racing)
> Philippe Borges wrote:
>
> > I'm a 140kg scooter user and trust me an heavy 2 wheels is not something
i
> > would accept if my design was not so powerfull (aircraft type nicad with
> > 450amp controller) at a cheap price (i don't pay a lot for nicad here
;^)
> >
> > you can try fiting 13 X 26ah hawker but if you succed C.G. and weight is
> > going to be awful.
> >
> > this bike don't have enough room for your purpose !
> >
> > use 1100ZZR size.
> >
> > EX500 would be ok with 60V optima, alltrax, A89 motor on 1/4 gear ratio,
> > not
> > a race bike but fun...
> > look on the EV album you will see that there is no small EMB upper
100V...
> > the best setup is gadget EMB, a lot of small batteries though lead acid
so
> > still low range.
>
> I did a rough cg height calculation (working from an enlarged photo and
> paper cutouts). I can't calculate the cg of the EX500 glider, but the 13
> Hawkers, A00 motor and Zilla alone (as I plan to position them in the
bike)
> have a cg height of just under 17". That's not bad.
>
> In fact, my gut feel looking at the rest of the bike is that overall cg
> height will be placed very well. Granted it will have a total weight of
> around 600 lb., which is far from petite. My thinking is that the weight
> will be so concentrated around the cg (far tighter than is possible in any
> ICE motorcycle) that it will feel and respond more like a 500 lb. bike. I
> can live with that. Especially knowing the Hawkers can put out over 100
hp.
>
> A bigger frame would be a possibility. But it would weigh even more, cost
> more and would likely be in shorter supply. The EX500 has a lot to
> recommend it in terms of getting the most people on an EM.
>
> The EV album shows quite a few low-voltage EMs. They are all slow. Fine
if
> that's what you want, but I want a real motorcycle, fully highway capable.
> If this kit actually comes to be, you could easily use 12 Hawkers, wire
them
> for 72V and use an Alltrax controller. If there was sufficient demand for
a
> 6-Optima version, that could be done as well. (With a somewhat higher
cg -
> the bigger batteries don't pack as well in the frame.)
>
> The biggest failing of EMs in general is range. Not enough people will
> spring for lithium to make it worthwhile to make the kit, so lead is the
> only game in town for now. Decent range means lots of lead. No way
around
> that. I figure 300 lb. of lead in a 600 lb. EM (without rider) should
give
> decent range. As a WAG, maybe 35 miles? You can be certain that as soon
as
> lithium is ready for prime time I would be all over it.
>
> Roger Stockton wrote:
>
> > > The motorcycle I have in mind is a conversion kit for a
> > > Kawasaki EX500.
> >
> > Perhaps you had mentioned this model before, because it is exactly what
> > came to my mind when you started this thread...
>
> Actually I hadn't mentioned it. You've just demonstrated that great minds
> think alike. :-)
>
> > > There is also the possibility of using 6 Orbital/Optimas and
> > > an Alltrax controller to lower both the cost and performance.
> >
> > It might not be as much of a performance hit as you think... you're only
> > shedding about 40lbs of battery weight, and with the right gearing and
> > 72V on a 36V motor, top speed shouldn't be a huge issue. The larger
> > batteries, especially the Orbitals, can dish out way more current than
> > the 26Ah Hawkers, and if you stick with a big enough controller
> > (possibly still a Z1K), you ought to be able to have plenty of low speed
> > power/torque (which is far more important to the enjoyment of city
> > driving ;^).
>
> I'm not worried about low-speed grunt at any reasonable voltage. I'm more
> concerned with having some grunt left at highway speed. Being able to
just
> reach 70 mph with no acceleration left is not my idea of fun (or safe). I
> picked a 90 mph limit assuming that would still allow me to climb a modest
> grade at 80 mph or be able to get around traffic at 70 mph. I really have
> no idea if that's a good assumption.
>
> > > I've read that over-volting a motor can be hard on brushes,
> > > but I thought amps were the brushes' biggest enemy - and more
> > > volts means *less* amps while bopping around town.
> >
> > I'll throw my 2 cents in while waiting for the real motor gurus to
> > uncloak...
> >
> > More amps = more heat, which is bad. However, more voltage equals a
> > greater likelihood of arcing and flashover/fireballing the commutator.
> > It is not just the voltage, but the current at that voltage; that is you
> > cannot apply high current and high voltage at the same time without
> > flirting with disaster (applogies to Molly Hatchet ;^). The higher the
> > voltage, the less current you can safely apply. Problem is that at low
> > motor speeds (low voltage) you want the controller to allow high current
> > for good torque/low speed power but that current limit needs to reduce
> > as motor speed/voltage increases. As far as I know, even the mighty
> > 'Zilla does not (yet?) offer the ability to program such a current limit
> > profile; you can set a current limit, and a voltage limit, but not
> > something that varies.
>
> I believe Reverend Gadget said his A89-powered EMW has plenty of low-end
> grunt, and that's with a 400 amp(?) controller. Perhaps the answer here
is
> to dial up the motor amps limit, but turn down the battery amps to
something
> fairly low. Wouldn't that have the effect of starting strong, but
reducing
> the amps available to the motor as speed increases?
>
> > > And I've also read that an over-volted motor is hard on its
> > > controller because it keeps it in current limit longer.
> > > Again, in around-town use, is that a concern?
> >
> > I don't know that this is an absolute; it depends on how big the
> > controller is and how fast the motor builds back EMF (i.e. how fast the
> > current it sucks falls off as RPM build). Certainly, running a battery
> > pack significantly higher in voltage than the motor's nameplate will
> > allow the controller to pump more current into the motor at higher RPM
> > (i.e. for longer after a standing start), but on such a light vehicle it
> > may be that an over-volted small motor simply can't pull the full 1000A
> > that a Z1K can deliver for long enough to be any harder on the
> > controller than a less-over-volted motor in a heavier typical
> > conversion. That is, normal operation in a converted on-road car might
> > be just as hard on the controller.
>
> This is one reason I chose a Zilla for my LeSled EV. A 3000 lb. car using
a
> 48V motor at 120V is rather harsh treatment. Otmar is pretty confident it
> won't be a problem. (I have a 96V motor I still have to install
sometime.)
>
> An 800 lb. EM (bike and rider) is a pretty light load. I'm thinking
> (hoping) that controller abuse is not an issue.
>
> > > And finally, a Zilla Z1k would allow me to dial in any
> > > maximum motor voltage I'd like. Might there be a happy
> > > medium that would allow it to spin up to maybe 6500 rpm
> > > (mechanical limit is 7500) at 90 mph on level ground?
> >
> > Maybe. You need to figure out how much HP you need to hit 90MPH on
> > level ground, then how much torque that is at 6500RPM, and how much
> > current it takes to make that torque. Finally, you would have to figure
> > out how much voltage you need to hit the motor with to make it draw that
> > much current at that speed. If all the planets align, you might find
> > that the voltage required is physically possible to pack on a bike
> > frame, and that the current required is low enough to be out of the
> > fireball risk zone.
>
> Here's a thought. How hard would it be to make a commutator arc detector?
> Seems to me it could be as simple as a photodiode with a little
calibration
> circuitry. You could have it light a big red light to tell you to back
off,
> or it could directly limit controller output much like a thermal cutback.
> Doable?
>
> > My gut feel is that 6500RPM is too high to expect real power at, and
> > that you might have better luck considering lugging the motor down to a
> > lower RPM where it will draw (and you can safely apply) greater current,
> > and then rely on a controller with a beefy current limit to restore the
> > low speed performance. I think Paul "Neon" Gooch has posted some good
> > information along the lines of RPM/torque behaviour and tradeoffs in the
> > past, with particular emphasis on his buggy's Prestolite motor.
>
> Yeah. It's all the experimentation, and the possibility of finding *no*
> acceptable combination of gearing, motor voltage, motor current and
battery
> current that gives me pause. That, and the need to get my other EV
running
> first. ;^)
>
> Still thinking....
>
> Chris
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Gadget,
I have a potential client who wants to have me do a
conversion for him with Kokam cells. I'm curious to
find out what the group's recomendations would be for
a battery management system.
Gadget
visit my website at www.reverendgadget.com
I do not know of any off-the-shelf systems available now.
I think Victor's (www.metricmind.com) system is the closes to being ready.
There was talk about modifing Rudman Regulators to work at low voltages. I
don't know if anyone is pursuing this.
A Lee Hart balancer is an option but you need to build your own and modify
the design for 4.2 volts. Details at
http://www.geocities.com/sorefeets/balancerland/.
There is a yahoo group discussion group which has more info.
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/EVBMS
These are the things a BMS for Kokam battery must do:
While being charged: Keep each battery from going over 4.2 volts.
While being discharged: Keep each battery from going below 3.5 volts (no
load)-2.8 volts (10C load)
These are things it would be useful for the BMS to do:
While being charged: Allow all batteries to reach 4.2 volts (Equalize).
These are things it might be useful for the BMS to do:
Under discharge, Allow all batteries to reach minimum voltage at the same
time (active balancing).
We are running a version of the Lee Hart Balancer built from parts from
http://www.eeci.com/. We equalize but have not implemented active balancing.
So far, the pack does not seem to need it.
Cliff
www.ProEV.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
does any one have any experience of these things ?
http://www.goingreen.co.uk/?PageID=AboutGWiz
they are made in south india called ravea ?
i might buy one tomorrow which has come up for sale second hand
all info welcome
thanks in anticipation
reb
---------------------------------
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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
sorry reva
http://www.revaindia.com/design/evworking.htm
reb
rich ball
abergavenny
south wales
---------------------------------
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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
EVLN(Toyota's closed-end leases prevent RAV4 EV purchases)-LONG
[The Internet Electric Vehicle List News. For Public EV
informational purposes. Contact publication for reprint rights.]
--- {EVangel}
http://www.dailybreeze.com/business/articles/1597231.html
Thursday, June 02, 2005
Electric car drivers protest at Toyota's Torrance headquarters
Lessees complain that closed-end leases are keeping them from
buying their vehicles, taken off the market in 2003.
By Scott Martindale Daily Breeze
Electric-vehicle owner Howard Stein took off a day of work to
protest Toyota Motor Co.'s refusal to sell him the RAV4 EV model
that his wife drives.
As Stein stood in front of Toyota's U.S. sales headquarters in
Torrance Wednesday morning, he and about a dozen fellow
electric-vehicle owners demanded that the company allow
leaseholders to buy their RAV4 EVs.
Toyota plans to reclaim 462 RAV4 EVs issued under a closed-end
lease, which blocks the lessee from buying the vehicle. Toyota
says the vehicles were prototype models leased in bulk to
corporate clients such as Southern California Edison through a
"fleet-leasing" program, with the intention that they would
return to Toyota for a re-evaluation.
But a few ended up in the hands of drivers like Stein, 69, of
Anaheim Hills, who had an open-end lease and was able to purchase
his, and his wife, Linda Nicholes, who leased a RAV4 EV in 2001
-- a year before consumers could purchase the vehicle outright.
"Read my lips: 'I am not giving up the car,' " said Stein, who
plans to fight Toyota for the right to buy the vehicle, which he
leased through his optometry business.
Many owners and lessees are passionate about their RAV4 EVs,
which Toyota took off the market in 2003, citing declining sales
and low consumer interest. The organization DontCrush.com, which
sponsored Wednesday's protest, was formed to advocate
environmentally friendly vehicles.
"We're not going to let the electric vehicle be quietly
destroyed," said Bud Raymond, 24, of Ladera Heights, who plans to
join fellow DontCrush.com members for more protests at local
Toyota dealerships.
In January, Raymond traveled to Sacramento to protest the Ford
Motor Co.'s decision not to sell its electric-powered Ranger
pickup trucks to drivers with leases. After staging a sit-in at a
local Ford dealership, the company agreed to sell the trucks.
Raymond purchased his for $1.
Nevertheless, Ford dismantled its electric vehicle program,
citing a lack of consumer sales, and said it intended to focus on
hybrid gas-electric vehicles and hydrogen-powered cars.
General Motors Co. also experimented with electric-powered
vehicles, introducing the Saturn EV1 in 1996. That model was
taken off the market in 2004 because it lacked "commercial
viability," the company said.
Toyota began producing the RAV4 EV in 1998 to comply with
California's now-defunct "zero-emission vehicles" law, which
mandated that 5 percent of vehicles sold in the state be
emissions-free.
About 1,500 models were sold during the six-year campaign -- not
nearly enough to support the continued production of the SUV,
Toyota said. The 462 under closed-end leases must be returned,
while the rest can be kept by their owners. However, Toyota says
it may eventually become too costly to keep maintenance and parts
support for the vehicle.
Mike Michels, a spokesman for Toyota, said the cost of replacing
a battery on the RAV4 exceeds the value of the vehicle itself,
and keeping the model is no longer profitable.
He emphasized that Toyota does not plan to actually crush the
vehicles, but will salvage many of the parts and recycle the
metal. Critics say the RAV4 was insufficiently marketed to
consumers and waiting lists were prohibitively long.
Protester Marvin Campbell, 44, of Culver City said he believed
that Toyota did not want to disrupt sales of its gasoline-powered
vehicles.
"It's all about self-protection," said Campbell, who drives a
2003 Toyota RAV4 EV.
"It's 19th-century technology, and they're not in the business of
changing it."
State Sen. Sheila Kuehl (D-Santa Monica) has endorsed
DontCrush.com's campaign.
"We have to wonder whether a similar destruction of fuel-cell
vehicles is in our future," she said in a statement, referring to
an even newer technology still in the research stage.
Sandy Kapteyn, 39, of Pasadena bought her RAV4 model two weeks
ago after leasing it. She says she loves the perks that come with
driving an electric vehicle: no oil changes, no tune-ups, low
maintenance costs, use of freeway carpool lanes, preferred
parking and no gasoline bills.
"I'm going to go to the Costco down the street and recharge for
free," said Kapteyn as she stood in front of the Toyota facility
in Torrance. "Free fuel!"
�2005 Copley Press, Inc.
===
http://abclocal.go.com/kabc/news/060105_nw_toyota_protest.html
Electric-Car Advocates Protest Toyota
TORRANCE (CNS) � Electric-car advocates will demonstrate outside
Toyota's North American headquarters today to demand that the
company, instead of crushing its RAV4-EV electrical vehicles,
allow people who leased them to buy them.
Sen. Sheila Kuehl, D-Santa Monica, will join members of
DontCrush.com at the protest, Paul Scott of DontCrush.com said.
A letter Kuehl wrote to Toyota, in which she "most respectfully
requests ... Toyota re-evaluate the systematic destruction of
existing electrical vehicles," will be read at the protest, Scott
said.
Kuehl wants Toyota to "decide to alter" its decision to crush
what she calls the cleanest cars on the road.
Toyota, the Japanese carmaker behind the popular Prius hybrid
vehicle, says it is doing away with the electric version of the
RAV4 because the batteries are running out and, given the current
state of the technology, would be prohibitively expensive to
replace.
"The cost to replace the battery is more than the value of the
vehicle," according to a Toyota statement.
Thousands of the all-electric, no-emission cars were manufactured
to comply with California's Zero Emission Vehicle mandate, Scott
said.
Dozens of RAV4 EV leaseholders have repeatedly requested the
right to purchase their cars and Toyota has flatly refused every
request, even though consumers leased every RAV4 Toyota put on
the market, Scott said.
Earlier this year, the same group protested General Motors'
decision to crush its electric cars.
The Sierra Club and American Lung Association of California are
scheduled to participate in today's protest.
According to Toyota, the electric version of the RAV4 never
caught on with the public.
"Although a significant marketing effort was undertaken for the
RAV4-EV, we only sold about 300 vehicles a year," according to a
company statement.
In contrast, it says it has sold more than 100,000 hybrid
vehicles worldwide, including 52,000 Prius hybrids in the United
States.
Copyright � 2005 KABC-TV and the CNS. All rights reserved.
-
Bruce {EVangel} Parmenter
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--- Begin Message ---
EVLN(Cool Electric Ride Gets Top Prize)
[The Internet Electric Vehicle List News. For Public EV
informational purposes. Contact publication for reprint rights.]
--- {EVangel}
http://www.philly1.com/story9060105.html
In the winner's circle: West Philadelphia Automotive Academy
scores big UC Review By Sheryl P. Simons
It's graduation season and celebratory banquets abound. Truly
deserving of recognition is the West Philadelphia Automotive
Academy, whose eightmember Electric Vehicle Team brought home the
top prize in the 17th Annual "Tour de Sol" tournament, sponsored
by the Northeast Sustainable Energy Association. Held this May in
Albany, New York, our hometown celebrities beat teams fielded by
Toyota, Honda, MIT, and the much-favored Western Washington
University, over whom they excelled by one gram. Previously, in
2002, they won the coveted "Honda: Power of Dreams Award."
Eightmember Electric Vehicle Team brought home the top prize in
the 17th Annual "Tour de Sol" tournament.
Excitement was in the air as 150 parents, classmates, teachers,
and school district officials gathered at the Sheraton Hotel on
May 25th for an honors banquet. But most of all, there was
appreciation for what the program, founded in 1997 at West
Philadelphia High School, has meant to the students.
"It has taught me how to use my hands to work and to work out
problems rather than to get upset," said Victor Webster, a 10th
grader who is excited about returning to this voluntary
after-school program next fall. "It teaches you how to think," he
exclaimed, "because you have to apply the math and geometry you
learn in class as well as the English needed to read
instructions."
Tyson Drummond, an 11th grader from Southwest, recalled that the
car started as a K-1 Attack kit and "took two years to build."
Each team- member became skilled in every aspect through the
tutelage of Simon Hauger, a math, science, and auto instructor.
"From this experience," Tyson said, "anything is possible. I had
only worked on bikes before but never with cars." Now, he proudly
noted, "I am about to get my drivers license."
"Mr. Hauger has been a Godsend," Mrs. Carolyn Knight said
gratefully, "and he has taken the time to help Devereaux develop.
Mr. Hauger saw something in my son: keen problem solving
abilities and leadership skills that may eventually propel him
into the boardroom." Mrs. Knight, a 1975 West Philly High
graduate, is the very proud mom of Devereaux Knight, the team's
captain. "My son is carrying on the family torch," she adds, "and
he will attend the Automotive Training Center in Exton PA," which
sent Lee Gaskins, an admissions representative, to the banquet.
Captain Knight, the graduating senior who led his crew to
victory, is every bit a future diplomat, citing the important
contributions of his teammates Arnold Carroll, who helped
accentuate the car with decorative flair, and Jacques
Jean-Baptiste, whose technical skills earned him a place at
Kutzstown College. Rounding out the winner's circle were Dauwell
Sterling (12th grade); David Epps (10th grade); and Christopher
Newell (11th grade).
Hauger noted that "our car is the world's only super hybrid
vehicle. It gets 50 mpg, creates very little pollution, and is
super-fast. It is also unique because of who built it." One
student from Penn worked with eight students and three teachers
from West Philly High School over two years to make this amazing
car.
Over the past seven years, the Electric Vehicle Program has
enjoyed the support of corporate sponsors such as Sunoco,
Michelin, AAA, PECO, Green Mountain Energy, Rohm and Haas, Pep
Boys, Garry Barbara Dodge, and Saturn of Trevose.
Lawrence Brinkley, Transportation Career Coordinator in the
Office of Education believes that the district has discovered a
niche in the employment marketplace. "There is a shortfall of
about 35,000 trained auto mechanics," Brinkley noted, "and with
this many vacant positions we have an excellent opportunity to
fill the gap by preparing our graduates for meaningful,
wellpaying jobs." Currently, there are five school-based
automotive programs and for the first time this summer, a
six-week mentorship will be launched. "I am very pleased with the
interest that local car dealerships have taken in our mentorship
program," Brinkley stated. "Even Jay Dunphy of Dunphy Ford has
volunteered to actively train the students at his site."
Participating students will be paid for their efforts and can
look forward to significant career opportunities as a result.
Ray Jones, National President of Penn's Black Alumni Society and
longtime West Philadelphia resident, considers the students'
innovative use of soy as "tantamount to what George Washington
Carver achieved with the peanut." With headlines touting "The
World's First Hybrid Supercar," the national press has recognized
this achievement with features on CNN and the Auto Channel as
well as front-page coverage in the Philadelphia Daily News.
"This is a true discovery," Jones added, "and along with the rest
of the city, I wish them all success!"
� Philly1.Com & The Weekly Press
-
Bruce {EVangel} Parmenter
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. EV List Editor, RE & AFV newswires
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===== Undo Petroleum Everywhere
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Discover Yahoo!
Find restaurants, movies, travel and more fun for the weekend. Check it out!
http://discover.yahoo.com/weekend.html
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EVLN(St. Mark's earns multiple honors at Tour de Sol)
[The Internet Electric Vehicle List News. For Public EV
informational purposes. Contact publication for reprint rights.]
--- {EVangel}
http://www2.townonline.com/hopkinton/artsLifestyle/view.bg?articleid=256234
St. Mark's earns multiple honors at Tour de Sol
Friday, May 27, 2005
Longtime St. Mark's School science instructor Ken Wells led a
team of his students to New York from May 13 -16 to take part in
the Tour de Sol, a car show and road rally trumpeting the
development and use of environmentally friendly vehicles.
This is the fourth straight year Wells and a group of St. Mark's
students participated in the event, and for the fourth straight
year, they brought with them Woodstock, a bright yellow 1994 Ford
Ranger converted by students to run on electric power.
In 2003, Woodstock and the SM Electric Vehicle Club won the Tour
de Sol's Renewability Award, and they did so again this year. In
2005, St. Mark's also captured first-place honors in the student
division for a two-person solar vehicle. Moreover, the St.
Markers captured first place in the Reliability and Range event
by completing more circuits of the hilly, rain-soaked rally
course in three hours than any other competitor.
This year, St. Markers improved Woodstock, formerly a
low-emission electric vehicle, to run on zero-emission
electricity. Now the pickup's batteries recharge overnight with
pollution-free electricity generated by wind turbines. Woodstock
also gathers 'free' energy from the sun via the 300-watt solar
panels located over its cargo bed. The panels were provided
graciously by Evergreen Solar, Inc., of Marlboro (Educational
materials and displays were created with support from Sun Power
Electric, a not-for-profit energy conservation organization based
in Westboro).
"The car performed so well," Wells said, "because the team really
did their homework in making sure it was well-prepped and ready
for the inspections and grueling hill-climbing course in the
foothills of the Adirondacks outside of Saratoga Springs, New
York. When time ran out, Woodstock was the only vehicle still
running at the posted speed limits without a serious
electro-mechanical failure."
Woodstock was the fourth most efficient vehicle in the whole
Tour. The little yellow truck used energy at a rate equivalent to
90 mpg! The St. Mark's entry was fourth in overall points,
beating several commercial production teams, as well as some
entrants from colleges and universities.
Attending the event from St. Mark's were the following students:
sixth-former (senior) Catherine Klem of Lincoln, fifth-formers
(juniors) Carole Lemos-Wade of Hopkinton, and Carlin Treco of
London, England; and fourth-formers (sophomores) Matt Flagg of
Marlboro and Mfon Umoh of North Providence, R.I. (Sixth-former
Doug Flood of Southborough and fourth-former Nick Generous of
Bethesda, Md., were unable to attend the Tour but were invaluable
in preparing Woodstock for the event.)
Also on hand was Lincoln resident Eric Klem, a member of the St.
Mark's Class of 2003, a former EV Club member, and currently an
engineering student at Dartmouth.
Subtitled the Great American Green Transportation Festival, the
Tour de Sol is the culmination of a unique year-round public
education campaign sponsored by the Northeast Sustainable Energy
Association of Greenfield. Each May, the Tour encourages the use
of vehicular transportation that does not rely on fossil fuels.
This year's event was held in Saratoga and Albany, New York.
>From the Tour de Sol website: "This high-tech, high-touch
'traveling festival' and competition is America's longest running
event of its kind. For 16 years, the Tour de Sol has brought
together students, manufacturers, energy suppliers, press,
government representatives, and consumers for a celebration and
display of Yankee ingenuity working toward sustainable energy and
mobility for the world."
Affiliated with the Episcopal Church, St. Mark's was founded in
1865 as a boarding school for boys. In 1977, the high school
became coeducational and now serves day students from the
immediate area, as well as boarders from throughout the world.
St. Mark's is accredited by the New England Association of
Schools and Colleges.
-
Bruce {EVangel} Parmenter
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. EV List Editor, RE & AFV newswires
. (originator of the above ASCII art)
===== Undo Petroleum Everywhere
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--- Begin Message ---
EVLN(Welsh car team pioneer electric dream)
[The Internet Electric Vehicle List News. For Public EV
informational purposes. Contact publication for reprint rights.]
--- {EVangel}
http://icwales.icnetwork.co.uk/1300icmotors/0100news/tm_objectid=15580050%26method=full%26siteid=50082-name_page.html
Welsh car team pioneer electric dream Jun 1 2005 icWales
Imagine an electric car that produces hardly any noise, no air
pollution, and is as fast as a Ferrari.
It might become a reality in the near future, thanks to a
revolutionary new motor designed by an enterprising team in
Wales.
If the IMP motor meets expectations, it could usher in a new age
of rapid, clean, electric transport.
As well as high performance vehicles, there are plans for a
battery-powered family car with a range of hundreds of miles.
Electric cars to date have been more reminiscent of milk floats
than Formula One.
It is hard not to laugh when recalling Sir Clive Sinclair's C5
electric three-wheeler, which was supposed to be the ideal urban
runabout, but proved a catastrophic flop.
However the new motor being developed by IMP Ltd, a Welsh
engineering company based in Neath, really could put electric
vehicles in the fast lane.
The motor is revolutionary in that it contains no bulky permanent
magnets.
Instead it relies on transmitting electric pulses across up to
seven rotors, arranged in different phases. These are "fired up"
in turn, much like the pistons of an internal combustion engine.
There are no gears - the motor provides enough torque at one
revolution per minute to put a vehicle into motion - and it spins
at up to 2,500rpm.
"Size for size, we can provide 400% more torque than any type of
motor currently available," says managing director John Bryant.
He is now hoping to team up with a sports car manufacturer, such
as Lotus or TVR.
Theoretically an electric racing car driven by four of the motors
- one for each wheel - could hold its own in Formula One.
"Electric vehicles still carry the stigma of the Sinclair," says
Mr Bryant. "Forget it. This will outstrip a Ferrari."
At present, providing enough battery life is a problem. But
battery technology is improving all the time, and Mr Bryant does
not see it as a major obstacle.
If he finds the right automotive partner, a prototype electric
car that would put a smile on Michael Schumacher's face could be
ready within two years.
� owned by or licensed to Trinity Mirror Plc 2005
-
Bruce {EVangel} Parmenter
' ____
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. http://geocities.com/brucedp/
. EV List Editor, RE & AFV newswires
. (originator of the above ASCII art)
===== Undo Petroleum Everywhere
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