EV Digest 4751
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Idea for park
by Jeff Shanab <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: Idea for park
by Evan Tuer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Re: Idea for park
by "Andre' Blanchard" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Re: variac wiring
by "STEVE CLUNN" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: Need help with conceptual math
by "STEVE CLUNN" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Re: EV shipping question
by The Grinster <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Re: Idea for park
by "Dave" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) RE: Idea for park
by "Dewey, Jody R ATC (CVN75 IM3)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) RE: Real world data on 8 Volt Golf Cart Batteries - or 47,000 miles in my
EV
by "Adams, Lynn" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) RE: Real world data on 8 Volt Golf Cart Batteries - or 47,000 mil es in my
EV
by "Adams, Lynn" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Re: Idea for park
by "Peter VanDerWal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Re: Need help with conceptual math
by "Roland Wiench" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Father Time Lazyboy Racer Update
by John Wayland <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Re: Battery shunt
by Ralph Merwin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) Re: Battery shunt/EVILbus
by "John G. Lussmyer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) The E-chairs are REEELY Hummmin !
by Steven Lough <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Re: Idea for park, fix it!
by "Bob Rice" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Re: Battery shunt/EVILbus
by Ralph Merwin <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Re: Idea for park
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
20) Job Openings - Curtis PMC- Livermore, CA
by "Barnes, Brenda" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) Re: Need help with conceptual math
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) RE: Real world data on 8 Volt Golf Cart Batteries - or 47,000 mil
es in my EV
by "Matthew D. Graham" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) Re: Need help with conceptual math
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
24) Re: Battery shunt/EVILbus
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
I have a little slope to my driveway and my emergancy break is yet to be
fixed. It was almost commical me dropping a wheel chock on the ground
and leaning out the car with one foot on the brake pushing it under the
rear wheel with a stick.
Would this work?
Get the reversing contactors for the zilla to create an electric reverse
open up tranny and do something to the reverse idler gear to keep it
from rotating. Bolting in a rack on the back side or adding bolts thru
gear to case.
There is not much danger of putting it in reverse while moving and
it would give the EV a "park" position
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On 9/23/05, Jeff Shanab <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I have a little slope to my driveway and my emergancy break is yet to be
> fixed. It was almost commical me dropping a wheel chock on the ground
> and leaning out the car with one foot on the brake pushing it under the
> rear wheel with a stick.
You should have a working handbrake. A transmission brake is no use
if your hydraulic brakes fail. My EV has all 3: hydraulic brake,
cable operated handbrake and a "P" position on the shifter that locks
the single ratio transmission. Oh, and regen :)
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Sounds like it would be easier to fix the parking brake.
___________
Andre' B.
At 07:28 AM 9/23/2005, you wrote:
I have a little slope to my driveway and my emergancy break is yet to be
fixed. It was almost commical me dropping a wheel chock on the ground and
leaning out the car with one foot on the brake pushing it under the rear
wheel with a stick.
Would this work?
Get the reversing contactors for the zilla to create an electric reverse
open up tranny and do something to the reverse idler gear to keep it
from rotating. Bolting in a rack on the back side or adding bolts thru
gear to case.
There is not much danger of putting it in reverse while moving and
it would give the EV a "park" position
__________
Andre' B. Clear Lake, Wi.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Yes I think this might work but your variac will have to be big enough to
handle the full load amps . another way would be to use the variac to power
a 36 transformer and hook it's out put in series with the one leg , got to
get the polarities right or you get less voltage instead of more ,but your
variac will be under less of a load , your 36v transformer will need to be
able to the load , a golf cart charger transformer would do .
Steve clunn
.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jim Lockwood" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Thursday, September 22, 2005 10:25 PM
Subject: variac wiring
bad boy quick charge...240 volt line, line 1 direct to bridge rectifier.
line 2 run through variac then to bridge rectifier ( fuse each line )
adjust
to 170 to 180 volt watching amp load with clamp on meter...will this
work???
144 volt 85 toyota pick up (almost on road)
jim lockwood
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
At what fuel price point do I actually save money by having this vehicle
be
electric?
This has a lot to do with your driving . I know I save money with my EV
truck pulling the trailer . I do a day's run on $1 electricy and I figure
$1 worth of battery life , driving 30 miles , Lots of yard men get 10 miles
to the gallon becuse of all the slow driving between yards and the starting
up 10 times a day . My 6 cylinder gas truck I had years ago ( around 10
now ) got 10 mpg on the job.
another way to look at it is , at some speed a gas car and an electric
will cost the same ( maybe 75 mph) , but as you slow down the electric
starts to save you money . My truck pulling the trailer at 20 mph uses 30
amps so I could go 75 miles on the same $2 ( ele and bat ) . So your savings
will really depend on how fast you drive .
25 miles there, and 25 back, can't charge there. Nearly all highway.
60, 65, an 70 mph limits.
That not being about to charge ther is going to cost you in battery life .
When you say speed limits what would be the slowest you could go , 55. ? may
only take 5 minits more and save 50 cents worth of ele/bat .
I will do it if the figures show a savings over time. Will this be cost
worthy?
golf cart batts cost about 1/2 the price of orbitals .
steve clunn
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Just completed the shipping of my recently purchased EV from the west
coast to the east. I used Dependable Auto Shippers
(http://www.dasautoshippers.com/). I researched a number of options
on the web. DAS turned out to be about mid-range on price. I chose
them because I had recommendations from two acquaintances who used
them to ship ICE vehicles. When I first talked with them on the
phone, the rep. told me it would be ok to pack some spare parts in the
back seat (even though the web site says not to pack anything in the
car). That conversation influenced my decision, but I failed to note
the person's name. Later (after they had my deposit), I called again
to verify and get a reference name. The person I talked to at that
time advised me not to pack anything in the car. I was rather annoyed
at that point, but we went ahead and packed some things inside anyway,
and they all arrived safely, as did the vehicle.
Vehicle was picked up on a flat bed last Friday (16 September) and
taken to a staging terminal, where it sat until Sunday evening (18
September). It arrived at my local terminal last night (21
September), I got a phone call this morning at 9:30, and the flatbed
was pulling up to the house by 11. Not bad - door to door, coast to
coast, in 6 days. I enjoyed the online tracking feature. Needless to
say I'm thrilled to have my vehicle.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
You could lock 1st and reverse. That would "chock" it. Ask me how I know...
David C. Wilker Jr.
USAF (RET)
"I live in the heavens. I reside on mountain tops. I am at constant vigil
over thee. I monitor thy righteous ways. Thy levels art mine to command.
When thou art in trouble, I will help thee through distorted times. When
thou art low, the touch of my hand shall raise thy spirit to the proper
level. When thou are too high, I shall terminate thee with a swift stroke of
my sword. When thy wires are frayed and broken, my angels shall use solder
and iron to heal thee. Thou art the circuit, I am the chosen one, I am the
TECH CONTROLLER!"
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jeff Shanab" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, September 23, 2005 5:28 AM
Subject: Idea for park
I have a little slope to my driveway and my emergancy break is yet to be
fixed. It was almost commical me dropping a wheel chock on the ground and
leaning out the car with one foot on the brake pushing it under the rear
wheel with a stick.
Would this work?
Get the reversing contactors for the zilla to create an electric
reverse
open up tranny and do something to the reverse idler gear to keep it
from rotating. Bolting in a rack on the back side or adding bolts thru
gear to case.
There is not much danger of putting it in reverse while moving and it
would give the EV a "park" position
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Why not just fix the emergency brake. That way the car will be LEGAL. By
far cheaper to fix the existing system than invent a new one.
-----Original Message-----
From: Dave [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, September 23, 2005 9:50 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Idea for park
You could lock 1st and reverse. That would "chock" it. Ask me how I know...
David C. Wilker Jr.
USAF (RET)
"I live in the heavens. I reside on mountain tops. I am at constant vigil
over thee. I monitor thy righteous ways. Thy levels art mine to command.
When thou art in trouble, I will help thee through distorted times. When
thou art low, the touch of my hand shall raise thy spirit to the proper
level. When thou are too high, I shall terminate thee with a swift stroke of
my sword. When thy wires are frayed and broken, my angels shall use solder
and iron to heal thee. Thou art the circuit, I am the chosen one, I am the
TECH CONTROLLER!"
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jeff Shanab" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, September 23, 2005 5:28 AM
Subject: Idea for park
>I have a little slope to my driveway and my emergancy break is yet to be
>fixed. It was almost commical me dropping a wheel chock on the ground and
>leaning out the car with one foot on the brake pushing it under the rear
>wheel with a stick.
>
> Would this work?
> Get the reversing contactors for the zilla to create an electric
> reverse
> open up tranny and do something to the reverse idler gear to keep it
> from rotating. Bolting in a rack on the back side or adding bolts thru
> gear to case.
>
> There is not much danger of putting it in reverse while moving and it
> would give the EV a "park" position
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Complete details can be seen on the EV album entry 379
http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/379.html
But since then I've updated the batteries as described and replaced the
Raptor with a T-Rex. The 8 inch ADC still working without issue.
Lynn
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Rich
Sent: Thursday, September 22, 2005 3:20 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Real world data on 8 Volt Golf Cart Batteries - or 47,000
miles in my EV
Hello Lynn,
What type motor and controller are you using?
Rich
----- Original Message -----
From: "Adams, Lynn" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Wednesday, September 21, 2005 5:11 PM
Subject: Real world data on 8 Volt Golf Cart Batteries - or 47,000 miles
in my EV
> Well I've been meaning to post my emperical battery data for a while,
> and the recent resurgence of the 8V/6V debate pushed me over the
edge...
>
> I now have over 47,000 miles in my converted Civic. Car normally uses
> 18 8 volt golf cart batteries for 144 volts. My second set was the
US
> 8VGC-HC where I installed two additioal batteries in battery boxes
> behind the front seats, concluded the extra batteries were not worth
it.
> Third set was T875's and the fourth (currrent) set the T890's
>
> Below is a summary from actual data taken on my 43 miles commute to
> work, recharge at work, and 43 miles home. 86 miles a day every day
> speeds from stop and go to 65 mph. Battery pack end of life was
defined
> as "limping into work with barely enough energy and hoping I can get
> home one more time..." Near the end of each pack life, bad batterys
> were removed, leaving a bigger load on the ones remaining, but could
> usually get 300 to 500 more miles by doing this. Of course if I had a
> shorter distance between charges probabally could have gone a lot more
> miles.
>
> Here is the data summary:
>
> Type US8V-GC US8V-GCHC T875 T890
> Year 2002 2003 2004 2005
> miles 12200 14200 16203 5000 so far
> Average WH/M 215 227 224 205
> Range to 80% 51.4 60 54 57.3
> Initial end trip voltage at 15A 142.5 151 143.5 144
> Final end trip voltage at 15A 136.5 144 138 143 so
> far
> Number of batteries 18 20 18 18
> pounds 1161 1380 1134 1242
> cost 940 1098 1168 1494
> miles per pound 10.51 10.29 14.29 ?
> Miles per dollar (US) 12.98 12.93 13.87 ?
> Cents per mile (US) 0.077 0.077 0.072 ?
>
>
> I've been very happy with all the batteries so far except the
> US8V-GC-HC's. The higher level of plates and acid resulted in greater
> acid leaking from the battery during use. They had a significtly
> stonger oder and acid residue than any of the others.
>
>
> When I get to 50,000 miles I'd write a longer piece telling all the
> interesting incidents.
>
> Happy EV'ing
>
>
> Lynn
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> Version: 7.0.344 / Virus Database: 267.11.3/107 - Release Date:
9/20/2005
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Total weight on my car is estimated to be about 3000 pound and should be
good plus or minus 100 pounds. I'm going have to find some scales and
weigh it someday....
Lynn
http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/379.html
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Dewey, Jody R ATC (CVN75 IM3)
Sent: Thursday, September 22, 2005 5:36 PM
To: '[email protected]'
Subject: RE: Real world data on 8 Volt Golf Cart Batteries - or 47,000
mil es in my EV
Thats why I asked Jerry. That can't be the TOTAL weight of the car with
the
batteries. The reason I am interested is because I am in the planning
stage
of building a 1990 Nissan 240SX. Your range is exactly where I want it.
I
am pretty sure I am going with Trojan T105 batteries at 156 volts with a
Zilla controller. I am a speed junkie so I think that will give me the
ooomph I am looking for with the range I need. I am just hoping my car
is
capable of highway speeds for at least 17 miles each way to work. I am
hoping for a 3500 pound total weight with batteries. The Total weight
of
the pack (T105, 62 pounds, 26 batteries) will be 1612 pounds. I am
hoping I
can meet my range, speed, and useability goals with this car and the
components I selected.
Does anyone know of a local distributor in the Virginia Beach, VA area
where
I can buy the Trojan T105s at? I think it would be easier than ordering
them.
-----Original Message-----
From: jerry dycus [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, September 22, 2005 7:27 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: Real world data on 8 Volt Golf Cart Batteries - or 47,000
mil es in my EV
Hi Jody. Lynn and All,
"Dewey, Jody R ATC (CVN75 IM3)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Wow! That is great data to see.
Yes it is some very interesting data, thanks Lynn.
What is your total weight with batteries?
Look under pounds below and you'll see.
HTH's,
Jerry Dycus
-----Original Message-----
From: Rich [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, September 22, 2005 5:20 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Real world data on 8 Volt Golf Cart Batteries - or 47,000
miles in my EV
Hello Lynn,
What type motor and controller are you using?
Rich
----- Original Message -----
From: "Adams, Lynn"
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 21, 2005 5:11 PM
Subject: Real world data on 8 Volt Golf Cart Batteries - or 47,000 miles
in
my EV
> Well I've been meaning to post my emperical battery data for a while,
> and the recent resurgence of the 8V/6V debate pushed me over the
edge...
>
> I now have over 47,000 miles in my converted Civic. Car normally uses
> 18 8 volt golf cart batteries for 144 volts. My second set was the US
> 8VGC-HC where I installed two additioal batteries in battery boxes
> behind the front seats, concluded the extra batteries were not worth
it.
> Third set was T875's and the fourth (currrent) set the T890's
>
> Below is a summary from actual data taken on my 43 miles commute to
> work, recharge at work, and 43 miles home. 86 miles a day every day
> speeds from stop and go to 65 mph. Battery pack end of life was
defined
> as "limping into work with barely enough energy and hoping I can get
> home one more time..." Near the end of each pack life, bad batterys
> were removed, leaving a bigger load on the ones remaining, but could
> usually get 300 to 500 more miles by doing this. Of course if I had a
> shorter distance between charges probabally could have gone a lot more
> miles.
>
> Here is the data summary:
>
> Type US8V-GC US8V-GCHC T875 T890
> Year 2002 2003 2004 2005
> miles 12200 14200 16203 5000 so far
> Average WH/M 215 227 224 205
> Range to 80% 51.4 60 54 57.3
> Initial end trip voltage at 15A 142.5 151 143.5 144
> Final end trip voltage at 15A 136.5 144 138 143 so
> far
> Number of batteries 18 20 18 18
> pounds 1161 1380 1134 1242
> cost 940 1098 1168 1494
> miles per pound 10.51 10.29 14.29 ?
> Miles per dollar (US) 12.98 12.93 13.87 ?
> Cents per mile (US) 0.077 0.077 0.072 ?
>
>
> I've been very happy with all the batteries so far except the
> US8V-GC-HC's. The higher level of plates and acid resulted in greater
> acid leaking from the battery during use. They had a significtly
> stonger oder and acid residue than any of the others.
>
>
> When I get to 50,000 miles I'd write a longer piece telling all the
> interesting incidents.
>
> Happy EV'ing
>
>
> Lynn
---------------------------------
Yahoo! for Good
Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Umm, wouldn't it be a whole lot easier to just fix the parking brake?
> I have a little slope to my driveway and my emergancy break is yet to be
> fixed. It was almost commical me dropping a wheel chock on the ground
> and leaning out the car with one foot on the brake pushing it under the
> rear wheel with a stick.
>
> Would this work?
> Get the reversing contactors for the zilla to create an electric
> reverse
> open up tranny and do something to the reverse idler gear to keep it
> from rotating. Bolting in a rack on the back side or adding bolts thru
> gear to case.
>
> There is not much danger of putting it in reverse while moving and
> it would give the EV a "park" position
>
>
--
If you send email to me, or the EVDL, that has > 4 lines of legalistic
junk at the end; then you are specifically authorizing me to do whatever I
wish with the message. By posting the message you agree that your long
legalistic signature is void.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
----- Original Message -----
From: STEVE CLUNN<mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, September 23, 2005 7:28 AM
Subject: Re: Need help with conceptual math
>
>
> At what fuel price point do I actually save money by having this vehicle
> be
> electric?
This has a lot to do with your driving . I know I save money with my EV
truck pulling the trailer . I do a day's run on $1 electricy and I figure
$1 worth of battery life , driving 30 miles , Lots of yard men get 10 miles
to the gallon becuse of all the slow driving between yards and the starting
up 10 times a day . My 6 cylinder gas truck I had years ago ( around 10
now ) got 10 mpg on the job.
another way to look at it is , at some speed a gas car and an electric
will cost the same ( maybe 75 mph) , but as you slow down the electric
starts to save you money . My truck pulling the trailer at 20 mph uses 30
amps so I could go 75 miles on the same $2 ( ele and bat ) . So your savings
will really depend on how fast you drive .
Steve, you have that absolutely correct. Driving many short trips and many
stops, a ICE will get terrible gas mileage. My ICE also got 5 to 10 mpg.
Replacing it with a EV is about 10 times cheaper even with the cost of the
batteries.
If I drove the EV at 75 mph, it is than equal to a ICE at 20 mpg cause by
shorten battery life.
The short trips and stops carrying heavy loads are ideal for EV's. Look at
the 10 ton Electric buses. They drive a 10 mile route and charge up at the end
of every loop. Roland
>
> 25 miles there, and 25 back, can't charge there. Nearly all highway.
> 60, 65, an 70 mph limits.
>
That not being about to charge ther is going to cost you in battery life .
When you say speed limits what would be the slowest you could go , 55. ? may
only take 5 minits more and save 50 cents worth of ele/bat .
> I will do it if the figures show a savings over time. Will this be cost
> worthy?
>
golf cart batts cost about 1/2 the price of orbitals .
steve clunn
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Roy LeMeur wrote:
Howdy Folks
After bleeding the brakes, finalizing the wiring and immobilizing it
with tie wraps, charging up the batteries, and snappin' a couple of
photos, we were able to take the racin' chair out on it's maiden
voyage this evening.
Don made a couple of passes and appeared to be quite satisfied with
the result.
We did not test the 72V controller bypass, Don intends to save that
one for the actual EVent :^D
The lazyboy road course/drag races are supposed to happen around 12:30
pm and we have 45 scheduled minutes to do our thing.
Thanks for the report. Please, everyone be careful, as going 50+ mph in
a Lazyboy is definitely over the top! I'll be with you guys in spirit,
but can't make the EVent as we are also racing on the same day - night
here in Portland in a more 'normal' form of racing :-) when Tim and I
return to the PIR track to see what we can wring out of White Zombie.
Make sure to get video of this. Good luck to all the crazed chair racers!
See Ya...John Wayland
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Danny,
As Otmar mentioned, I have a description of the protocol I'm using online
at http://www.aracnet.com/~rmerwin/bms/ The node you describe fits into
what I call a "pack node". The only command defined (so far) is the
PackQuery command, which reports the pack voltage and current. More
commands could be used to calibrate the node.
Notes on the protocol: the arbitrary address assignments are likely to go
away, and the format of the returned data may need to change.
How far along is your node? Which CPU are you using?
Ralph
Danny Miller writes:
>
> I'm throwing in a PCB for a digital isolated battery shunt using the
> EVil bus. It takes in 12v but uses an isolated DC/DC so the shunt can
> be placed anywhere on an isolated pack, high or low, or to measure motor
> current. The accuracy is down to a few mA, rejects PWM frequencies, can
> have its address changed so more than one can be on the system, and can
> be calibrated.
>
> Is there any protocol spec though on how the EVil talks to the
> devices? I haven't written the software for the protocol.
>
> Danny
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
At 07:42 AM 9/23/2005, Ralph Merwin wrote:
As Otmar mentioned, I have a description of the protocol I'm using online
at http://www.aracnet.com/~rmerwin/bms/ The node you describe fits into
what I call a "pack node". The only command defined (so far) is the
One thing to note is that the protocol you are using is not a defined
standard. Actually, it's about as far from what Lee was hoping for
as you can get....
I find it interesting that so many people are popping up with
projects like this currently.
I'm doing a low-end Battery monitor, AND I am also working on an
isolated hi-precision Shunt/Volt unit using the EVILbus.
Definitely sounds like a bus protocol needs to be defined.
I wonder how many incompatible ones we can come up with and implement...
--
John G. Lussmyer mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Dragons soar and Tigers prowl while I dream....
http://www.CasaDelGato.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Roy or some one may have already posted this, but I just HAD to let the
rest of the EV World know about this: Here below are two POSTS to our
local SEVA ev-list on our three entries to the Lazy Boy Races.. There
are 5 more that the Gas Guys have created that I have not seen yet:
From Roy:
Howdy Folks
After bleeding the brakes, finalizing the wiring and immobilizing it
with tie wraps, charging up the batteries, and snappin' a couple of
photos, we were able to take the racin' chair out on it's maiden voyage
this evening.
It was right after sunset, but not dark yet, FT checked to see if his
police officer neighbor was home and we decided to do our neighborhood
runs to test the chair in the other direction :^D
Don made a couple of passes and appeared to be quite satisfied with the
result.
I then made a few runs back and forth down the street to get used to it.
On 48V, through the controller, it gets right on up to approx. 50ish mph.
We did not test the 72V controller bypass, Don intends to save that one
for the actual EVent :^D
The thing handles great and is quite stable. In addition to the front
wheel brake, it has a large motorcycle brake on each rear wheel
independently operated by their own master cylinder and foot brake,
sorta like a dune buggy.
The lazyboy road course/drag races are supposed to happen around 12:30
pm and we have 45 scheduled minutes to do our thing.
I will be announcing the lazyboy races from the tower. Should be
interesting :-0
I spoke with Chuck Lyford today and he said his chair is done and on the
trailer.
I hear that Dave Cloud is bringing two chairs.
Blatant Pitch to Get Folks There-
Hobnob with racing legends, see all the vintage racing vehicles owned
and raced by those same racing legends up close, get into the EVent for
free, see EV crazies racing their homespun creations and having too much
fun, see all the racin' of the day with what is essentially a (free) pit
pass, you will be able to tell your grandchildren that you were there,
OK... enough already. BE THERE!
Detailed info for folks that need it-
http://www.seattleeva.org/index.php/Current_events
See y'all there!
and from Bruce Sherry ( Dave Cloud's Driver):
I stopped by Dave's house yesterday. He found some 20 pound lawn mower
batteries. 200 pound battery limit, Curtis 1231 500A controller, 48V
motor. Full go-kart racing slicks. None of the three of us were willing
to see how fast it would go on his short street. I could hold the power
on for about three seconds, and chickened out at about 50MPH. It hadn't
started to slow the acceleration yet. Steve Nash says it pulls about as
hard as this years dragster.
Bruce Sherry...
I will be out at the track by 8:30 am Saturday... BOY I dont think those
vintage gas car race guys are going to know WHAT HIT EM !!!
--
Steven S. Lough, Pres.
Seattle EV Association
6021 32nd Ave. N.E.
Seattle, WA 98115-7230
Day: 206 850-8535
Eve: 206 524-1351
e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
web: http://www.seattleeva.org
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
----- Original Message -----
From: "Evan Tuer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Friday, September 23, 2005 9:06 AM
Subject: Re: Idea for park
> On 9/23/05, Jeff Shanab <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > I have a little slope to my driveway and my emergancy break is yet to be
> > fixed. It was almost commical me dropping a wheel chock on the ground
> > and leaning out the car with one foot on the brake pushing it under the
> > rear wheel with a stick.
>
Ah , Memories<G>! That's how I parked my first, scratch built EV's in
Viet-Nam and Taiwan! One of the luxuries of converting rather than
scratchbuilding them, the parking brake was a break for me, as well as other
stuff folks take for granted, seats, roll up windows, to mention a few,
with store boughts!
Soon realized that I wasn't trying to re-invent the automobile, although
fantisizid about it, but to show off that even a crude Led Sled conversion
could get me flowing with the current, even renewable, at home, alough in CT
this could be a challange as Solar cells will lie there and go "Duh" as
somebody, Neon John? Put it, during CT's grey daze of winter.
So .......Fix the #$%^ handbrake!!! Yeah it's a pain in the ass,
especially on USA Iron, but yul thank yourself when you can park like the
ICE guyz!
Seeya
Bob
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--- Begin Message ---
There is no defined EVILbus protocol standard! I'm just presenting what
I intend to use. The protocol I have online is a couple of years old.
In fact, my posting of this protocol led to some very long and drawn-out
discussions that eventually led to no agreement among the various parties.
"Design by committee" at it's worst.
My project has been on hold for the last year. Just this week I've had
time to drag it back out of boxes and start working on it again. Now that
my car is driveable again I have some motivation to get this working.
The upside of having several parallel projects is that there's good chance
of someone getting something working finally! When someone comes up with
a system that everyone wants to use, *that system* will become the standard,
regardless of any other discussions.
Ralph
John G. Lussmyer writes:
>
> At 07:42 AM 9/23/2005, Ralph Merwin wrote:
> >As Otmar mentioned, I have a description of the protocol I'm using online
> >at http://www.aracnet.com/~rmerwin/bms/ The node you describe fits into
> >what I call a "pack node". The only command defined (so far) is the
>
> One thing to note is that the protocol you are using is not a defined
> standard. Actually, it's about as far from what Lee was hoping for
> as you can get....
>
> I find it interesting that so many people are popping up with
> projects like this currently.
> I'm doing a low-end Battery monitor, AND I am also working on an
> isolated hi-precision Shunt/Volt unit using the EVILbus.
> Definitely sounds like a bus protocol needs to be defined.
> I wonder how many incompatible ones we can come up with and implement...
>
>
> --
> John G. Lussmyer mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> Dragons soar and Tigers prowl while I dream....
> http://www.CasaDelGato.com
>
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--- Begin Message ---
Of course the best answer if to fix the brake but I have a similar problem with
my Tropica. The Tropica only has the emergency brake on 1 wheel and that's not
quite enough on my driveway. I have a 2 x 6 sitting on the driveway that is my
wheel chock. I simply drive over it and slowly roll back to it and apply what
little emergency brake I have. I've always intended to add a brake to the other
rear wheel but...
Steve
-----Original Message-----
From: Jeff Shanab <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <[email protected]>
Sent: Fri, 23 Sep 2005 05:28:33 -0700
Subject: Idea for park
I have a little slope to my driveway and my emergancy break is yet to be fixed.
It was almost commical me dropping a wheel chock on the ground and leaning out
the car with one foot on the brake pushing it under the rear wheel with a
stick.
Would this work?
Get the reversing contactors for the zilla to create an electric reverse
open up tranny and do something to the reverse idler gear to keep it from
rotating. Bolting in a rack on the back side or adding bolts thru gear to case.
There is not much danger of putting it in reverse while moving and it would
give the EV a "park" position
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Curtis PMC in Livermore is currently hiring for a number of engineering
positions.
You can see all positions available at: http://www.curtisinst.com
Or please contact me directly if you have any specific questions. We are
hiring in software, hardware, QA, manufacturing and mechanical engineering,
as well as managerial positions.
Brenda Barnes
Curtis PMC
Recruiting Consultant
925-961-1088 x226
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
This electronic mail transmission including any and all attachments may
contain confidential information and is intended only for the person(s)
named. Any use, copying or disclosure by another person is strictly
prohibited. If you receive this transmission in error, please notify the
sender via e-mail.
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--- Begin Message ---
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> ...My new set of batteries which are T-145's cost $2400.00.
> Distilled water at $0.75 a gallon per month = $90.00
> Ten years = $2400.00+ $90.00 = $2490.00 for batteries.
> Per 50 miles per week = $2490.00/520 = $4.78
^^^^^^^^
> He needs to commute 50 miles *per day*, about 13K mi a year, plus
> around-town driving, and at freeway speeds - the pack would be
> lucky to last 2 years, even if well-tended.
That doesn't change the economics. If you drive more, you replace the
batteries more often, but the cost per mile is the same whether you
drive 50 miles per week, or 50 per day.
If you don't drive much, the fixed cost of vehicle ownership
(registration, insurance, etc.) are divided up over fewer miles, so your
total cost per mile is higher for a little-used vehicle; but these are
the same for EVs or ICEs.
> It would be better to keep the ICE pickup for truck duties, and
> convert something much smaller for commuting
Maybe; you'd have to look at the fixed costs from having two vehicles.
> If you convert a car to electric ONLY to save money, in the end,
> you probably won't - you do it for the environment, for a silent
> drive, because a cartoon engineer like Dilbert does it, or just
> because you can!
Right. As long as people insist on hauling 3000 lbs of car with them
everywhere they go, it's going to cost a lot no matter whether it's
fuelled by oil or electrons. To significantly reduce your cost, you need
to significantly reduce the weight!
--
*BE* the change that you wish to see in the world.
-- Mahatma Gandhi
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Jody,
You are in luck if you're looking for weight data on the 1990 240SX. That's
what I'm nearly done converting. But with 1600 pounds of batteries alone, I
think your 3500 pound goal is a little optimistic. Depending on how
exhaustive your weight removal process is, you can expect a glider in the
range of 1750-1900 pounds. Add in your 1600 pounds of batteries and you're
pretty much there already. With motor, controller, charger, contactors,
cable, etc. you'll be maybe 100-200 pounds over your goal.
Now that I think about it, aren't you using the transmission? Mine is direct
drive, so I didn't include that weight.
I have a spreadsheet that provides the weight of the components and my car
at various stages, if you'd like it.
Matt Graham
Hobe Sound, FL
-----Original Message-----
From: Dewey, Jody R ATC (CVN75 IM3) [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, September 22, 2005 7:36 PM
To: '[email protected]'
Subject: RE: Real world data on 8 Volt Golf Cart Batteries - or 47,000 mil
es in my EV
Thats why I asked Jerry. That can't be the TOTAL weight of the car with the
batteries. The reason I am interested is because I am in the planning stage
of building a 1990 Nissan 240SX. Your range is exactly where I want it. I
am pretty sure I am going with Trojan T105 batteries at 156 volts with a
Zilla controller. I am a speed junkie so I think that will give me the
ooomph I am looking for with the range I need. I am just hoping my car is
capable of highway speeds for at least 17 miles each way to work. I am
hoping for a 3500 pound total weight with batteries. The Total weight of
the pack (T105, 62 pounds, 26 batteries) will be 1612 pounds. I am hoping I
can meet my range, speed, and useability goals with this car and the
components I selected.
Does anyone know of a local distributor in the Virginia Beach, VA area where
I can buy the Trojan T105s at? I think it would be easier than ordering
them.
-----Original Message-----
From: jerry dycus [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, September 22, 2005 7:27 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: Real world data on 8 Volt Golf Cart Batteries - or 47,000 mil
es in my EV
Hi Jody. Lynn and All,
"Dewey, Jody R ATC (CVN75 IM3)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Wow! That is great data to see.
Yes it is some very interesting data, thanks Lynn.
What is your total weight with batteries?
Look under pounds below and you'll see.
HTH's,
Jerry Dycus
-----Original Message-----
From: Rich [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Thursday, September 22, 2005 5:20 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Real world data on 8 Volt Golf Cart Batteries - or 47,000 miles
in my EV
Hello Lynn,
What type motor and controller are you using?
Rich
----- Original Message -----
From: "Adams, Lynn"
To:
Sent: Wednesday, September 21, 2005 5:11 PM
Subject: Real world data on 8 Volt Golf Cart Batteries - or 47,000 miles in
my EV
> Well I've been meaning to post my emperical battery data for a while,
> and the recent resurgence of the 8V/6V debate pushed me over the edge...
>
> I now have over 47,000 miles in my converted Civic. Car normally uses
> 18 8 volt golf cart batteries for 144 volts. My second set was the US
> 8VGC-HC where I installed two additioal batteries in battery boxes
> behind the front seats, concluded the extra batteries were not worth it.
> Third set was T875's and the fourth (currrent) set the T890's
>
> Below is a summary from actual data taken on my 43 miles commute to
> work, recharge at work, and 43 miles home. 86 miles a day every day
> speeds from stop and go to 65 mph. Battery pack end of life was defined
> as "limping into work with barely enough energy and hoping I can get
> home one more time..." Near the end of each pack life, bad batterys
> were removed, leaving a bigger load on the ones remaining, but could
> usually get 300 to 500 more miles by doing this. Of course if I had a
> shorter distance between charges probabally could have gone a lot more
> miles.
>
> Here is the data summary:
>
> Type US8V-GC US8V-GCHC T875 T890
> Year 2002 2003 2004 2005
> miles 12200 14200 16203 5000 so far
> Average WH/M 215 227 224 205
> Range to 80% 51.4 60 54 57.3
> Initial end trip voltage at 15A 142.5 151 143.5 144
> Final end trip voltage at 15A 136.5 144 138 143 so
> far
> Number of batteries 18 20 18 18
> pounds 1161 1380 1134 1242
> cost 940 1098 1168 1494
> miles per pound 10.51 10.29 14.29 ?
> Miles per dollar (US) 12.98 12.93 13.87 ?
> Cents per mile (US) 0.077 0.077 0.072 ?
>
>
> I've been very happy with all the batteries so far except the
> US8V-GC-HC's. The higher level of plates and acid resulted in greater
> acid leaking from the battery during use. They had a significtly
> stonger oder and acid residue than any of the others.
>
>
> When I get to 50,000 miles I'd write a longer piece telling all the
> interesting incidents.
>
> Happy EV'ing
>
>
> Lynn
---------------------------------
Yahoo! for Good
Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
>>
>> He needs to commute 50 miles *per day*, about 13K mi a year, plus
>> around-town driving, and at freeway speeds - the pack would be
>> lucky to last 2 years, even if well-tended.
>
>That doesn't change the economics. If you drive more, you replace the
>batteries more often, but the cost per mile is the same whether you
>drive 50 miles per week, or 50 per day.
Certainly, but it does affect the design envelope and cost/complexity of the
end-product - 50 miles a week on surface streets could be done with an NEV or a
resurrected C-car, but 50 miles a day on the freeway will take a more expensive
design to begin with.
The NiMH Ranger could do it with miles left over, but that was a plug-and-play
EV, needing practically no care to keep running well. I'm still p!ssed at Ford
for taking it away more than 2 years ago! I am *not* an engineer or mechanic,
and I don't want to have dozens of meters and switches in my car, or worry that
I've waited too long between battery waterings.
Even if EVs work out to cost more per mile than the ICE equivalent, I'd be
driving one if it had a support system locally and could make the same 50mi/day
commute (and I *do* drive under 60mph to keep my mpg up). I can't even get my
son's high school auto shop interested in working on my NiCd-powered Kewet,
something I haven't worked up to courage to do myself since frying the motor of
another Kewet experimenting with a Curtis SepEx controller.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Ralph Merwin wrote:
> There is no defined EVILbus protocol standard! I'm just presenting
> what I intend to use. The protocol I have online is a couple of
> years old. In fact, my posting of this protocol led to some very
> long and drawn-out discussions that eventually led to no agreement
> among the various parties. "Design by committee" at it's worst.
Yes! It was like herding cats. We couldn't establish a common goal, so
everyone went off in their own direction.
It's time to try it again, folks. But I suspect these negotiations will
be as contentious as before, so we should move it off the EVlist to the
EVtech list ([EMAIL PROTECTED] where the last debate was held).
FIRST we have to define the goals. THEN we can usefully discuss a
protocol that can efficiently meet them.
--
*BE* the change that you wish to see in the world.
-- Mahatma Gandhi
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
