EV Digest 4887
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) RE: Battery chargers in series
by "Claudio Natoli" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: Yet another HighPower, Fast Recharge 10X lifespam Lithium-ion battery
announcement.
by Ben Apollonio <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) EVs on Globe Trekker
by John David <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Re: Potential source for heavy duty motors
by James Massey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) RE: Battery chargers in series
by "Robert Chew" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Re: "Fall" Power of DC race results
by "BadFishRacing" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Re: Electric mower update/part 1
by John David <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) Re: multimeter
by Neon John <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) Re: multimeter
by John <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: multimeter
by "Paul G." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Re: Those "low end" surplus starter generator kits that several people are
selling
by "John Westlund" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) DCP DC/DC Converter
by "OhNoJoe" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) unsubscribe
by Marv Pickering <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Re: multimeter
by Neon John <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) Re: OT: Is this nonsense?/moon power
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) Re: DCP DC/DC Converter
by Ben Apollonio <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Re: Those "low end" surplus starter generator kits that several people are
selling
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Re: Those "low end" surplus starter generator kits that several people are
selling
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Electricity vs Hydrogen
by Allan Alessio <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) Re: multimeter
by Eric Poulsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) Re: Battery chargers in series
by Eric Poulsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) 2006, The Year of Tesla
by "Roderick Wilde" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) Re: multimeter
by "Dale Curren" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
24) Re: "Fall" Power of DC race results
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
25) Re: multimeter
by "Roland Wiench" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
26) Front End
by "Mark Hanson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
27) Re: DCP DC/DC Converter
by Bob Bath <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
28) Re: multimeter
by "Joe Strubhar" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
Hello Robert,
> Only thing is, that the chargers do not output
> any voltage at all unless there is a battery connected to it.
Then hook them up to some batteries! :-)
Take some cables out of your 72 V string of batteries to turn it into 3
separate "strings" of 24 V. Put the chargers across each now-separated string.
Then follow Mark Fowler's advice.
Cheers,
Claudio
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--- Begin Message ---
I'm not at liberty to say much, but don't be so sure these guys are
quite as full of it as most of the companies we've seen claiming
superior li-ions. My money's on this one actually going somewhere over
the next few years. Too bad they're only sampling to "qualified
OEM's," though. Maybe someone with a fast, light EV could talk them
into some sort of sponsorship?
-Ben
On Nov 3, 2005, at 8:29 AM, Lightning Ryan wrote:
A123Systems Launches New Higher-Power, Faster Recharging Li-Ion
Battery Systems
http://www.a123systems.com/html/news/articles/051102_news.html
http://www.greencarcongress.com/2005/11/a123systems_lau.html#more
http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/gridable-hybrids/message/2099
I know, I know, when can we BUY one.
L8r
Ryan
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I just saw a show called Globe Trekker and they driefly spotlighted EVs. Was
that EV guy someone from the list? As they were segueing to the story, just
before the narrator started talking about EVs I saw that the Ford Escort
they were filming had a cord coming out out of it, then they started talking
about the cool EV parked there, what looked to be a Fiat. Pretty decent
coverage if too brief for me ;-)
John David
www.maxmpg.org <http://www.maxmpg.org>
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--- Begin Message ---
At 06:34 AM 5/11/05 -0800, Jeff Shanab wrote:
I was looking on ebay and was wondering if servo motors from big cnc's
would be a good source for heavy duty motors.
item # 7558428122 caught my eye
being a servo, we know it is balanced
seeing 6000rpm on the name-plate assures it has a good commutator
440V tells me it has good insulation
so the main question is about the torque avail and the current it can
take, it seems to be not using much of it's commbar area at all.
Hi Jeff - and All
I have been eyeing off CNC servos as well (one of the things I get to fix)
- the high voltage is potentially an issue, since that probably means a
long battery string. One advantage is a lot of the servo drives are DC
input already - they are often fed from a seperate power supply module that
feeds the rack. Regen is usually built-in, too. These motors are often not
built to be light, although some are (designed to be on bits that move).
The one listed is a shunt motor - up to 300V @ 2.2A on the field, so that
needs to be controlled, too. Their starting bid (0 bids) is now only $325,
cheap for what that motor is, but there would be challenges to using it. If
there is a servo controller off the machine available at a similar price
that is DC input it may be a good buy.
There would need to be thought given to gearing/low RPM high-current
conditions - maybe big brushes to improve brush life? If I 'fall over' a
suitable motor I'd probably consider all of the options and possibilities.
At first glance I'd bring up a list of issues to be considered (but not
insurmountable):
Max amp capability - relatively small brush area (gets its' power by
voltage rather than current)
similar re wire sizes.
High voltage (battery string issues)
Designed for regen
tacho-generator often designed-in
position encoder often designed-in (resolver or encoder)
It may be possible to have a string of super caps kept charged with a big
DC/DC converter boosting up a 144V (etc) string to 600ish volts - but there
is another bit (get one from a wrecked Prius?)
James
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hey Clauddio
Yeah i tried hooking them chargers in series. The chargers just turned off
the charging circuit. But i did try them across two 12 volt batteries
connected in series, one charger for each battery, and all was good.
Got an article on Blacktown Sun coming out tommorow. Look out for it. It is
a bit exaggereated. But oh well, should be good, or a good laugh
Cheers
From: "Claudio Natoli" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: [email protected]
To: <[email protected]>
Subject: RE: Battery chargers in series
Date: Mon, 7 Nov 2005 09:31:33 +1100
Hello Robert,
> Only thing is, that the chargers do not output
> any voltage at all unless there is a battery connected to it.
Then hook them up to some batteries! :-)
Take some cables out of your 72 V string of batteries to turn it into 3
separate "strings" of 24 V. Put the chargers across each now-separated
string. Then follow Mark Fowler's advice.
Cheers,
Claudio
_________________________________________________________________
Search the Web for a new car
http://search.ninemsn.com.au/results.aspx?rf=1&q=new+car&FORM=HM
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--- Begin Message ---
Hello all,
The Fall Power of DC was just a good a time for me as it was for Shawn and
his crew.
For starters, just getting to hang out in Shawn Lawless' EV shop was a
treat. The professional toys, tools, parts, gadgets and machinery at
Lawless Industries explains why he produces such clean professional looking
rides.
I warmed up with a soft run as I like to see what the bike will do
mechanically without full power on tap. Oh yeah, SHAWN, the turbo Hayabusa
ONLY turned a 1.581 60' time to your 1.5-.
Then it's time to hit it with a stiff charge. I managed to turn my 30amp
charging inline fuse holder into a wet noodle. The fuse never blew, but
once the holder turned to mush, kinda lost connectivity. Guess the lesson
here is don't use automotive rated parts for EVs?
Second run was a bust. Driver error shut me down early in the run.
Third run the bike pulled really nice, but didn't really get up to speed.
Launch was hard, S/P shifting pulled hard, trans seemed to pull in. But the
1/8th mile was only 9.928s @63.81 MPH.
Back to the pits and the motors were pretty warm. Motors are sucking amps,
but I don't know where the power is going? This time I hooked up the
modular 15V chargers. One battery definately showed up being weaker than
the rest. But not much we could do about it.
Fourth run was like the previous. No surprises. 9.838s @ 64.24MPH. About
0.3seconds better than the Summer Power of DC, but not as good as we should
be running with all the fancy hardware I've added?
All in all it was a great day for a great race. A bad day racing always
beats a good day working. And I'd say we had a fair day racing.
After just unloading and soaking up the timeslips, the results look better.
I turned a 2.093 60' time. Nearly my best. The bike is hooking up fine,
launching clean, but the power is disappearing where after that? Further
investigation tonite revealed that there is a mechanical problem in the 2nd
gear clutch. I knew we were making power, just didn't know where it was
going. Definately not all to the asphalt. Now to figure out a
solution......
Thanks to Chip for coming out and helping, officiating, etc.
Congratulations to latest OJ driver Brian for not turning left until the end
of the track. All those dirt track habits are hard to break.
If anyone else has an itch to hit the track, post to the list. You never
know who might show up.
Darin Gilbert
BadFishRacing
----- Original Message -----
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Sunday, November 06, 2005 8:22 AM
Subject: "Fall" Power of DC race results
> All,
>
> Yesterday in Hagerstown may have been the most beautiful day of the
> year.
> Almost 80 degrees, sunny, and the incredible view of the mountains in
> full fall color.
> Everyone else in Maryland must have thought so too because Mason Dixon
> Dragway was PACKED.
> We headed down from Youngstown with a car that had never been over 50
> mph, a driver that had never been in the car and a trailer we had never
> used before. 1 1/2 hrs later a loud bang let us know it was time for a
> new tire. Thankfully Darin Gilbert was following our rig with Piranha
> and a decent spare. We limped over to Wally World and a couple of new
> Uniroyals later we were back on the road. When we got to MD it was
> already 12pm and the place was jammed. Finally got set up, through
> tech, and staged by about 1:00. Made a first low power pass with OJ-2
> at 12.4 @ 90 mph. Car and first time driver Brian Carothers performed
> flawlessly. Nice burnout and excellent 1.6 - 60 ft. It was clear from
> run 1 however that we had some tune and adjust to do. In search of a
> happy medium for launch torque and finish line speed I had error ed on
> the side of torque and it showed. Brian said the car hit a wall at mid
> track and was like driving a 90 mph golf cart the rest of the way.
> Charged the car up minus the regulators we had trashed back in Ohio and
> tried again. We waited in line until after 2:30 for another chance.
> Cranked up the Zilla and ran a 12.1 @ 92 mph. 1.55 - 60 ft. Another
> rock steady launch and run. The little 4-wheel drive setup works better
> than I ever thought would and doesn't seem to be showing any traction
> or handling limitations. Since it was clear we were out of motor
> voltage by mid track I had 2 options. 1. Spend ALOT of time rewiring
> the 12 motors at higher motor voltage or 2. simply pull out 12 of the
> 40 Hawkers and run 336 single string battery pack I chose the latter.
> Waited in line until 4:30 for our chance to run. 11.55 @ 105 with 1.5 -
> 60 ft time. We were heading in the right direction. Once again a
> perfect run with a .002 reaction time as a bonus. After 3 runs in June
> the motors and batteries were steaming. This time around neither was
> even warm to the touch! Back to the pits with hopes of stuffing every
> amp into pack and making our last best shot of the day. Those hopes
> were dashed at 5:15pm when the announcer let us know the staging lanes
> were closed for the day. Finished the day disapointed we didn't get a
> final chance at the 10's but very satisfied that we can be ready for
> Florida in January. Trimming another second with this chassis and motor
> setup is very do-able. The car is rock steady and the motors are asking
> for ALOT more power The batteries don't seem to be getting hit very
> hard either. We packed up and talked with Chip Gribben and Darin
> about the virtues of contactors and the performance possibilities of a
> 40 battery - 480 volt pack with series parallel pack shifting. We all
> then went to UNO ate pizza, and watched a data acquisition seminar by
> Darin and his laptop. They must have thought we were NUTS. Six
> motorheads in a booth huddled around a laptop full of charts and
> graphs, talking at the same time. Thanks to Chip, Darin, and the
> Carothers boys for making it one of our best racing days ever.
>
>
> Shawn Lawless
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Great post Steve, can't wait to read more.
John David
On 11/6/05, STEVE CLUNN <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> My lawn biss is starting to slow down and last Wednesday looked like a
> light
> day . I have been using the electric mower to cut yards around my house
> one
> at a time , but didn't have a set up for charging from my work truck . The
> PFC 50 charger was sitting in the box and as I looked at my old gas mower
> ,
> and though about how much fun using the electric would be , I decided to
> take some time that morning setting up the truck to charge the mower. Lots
> of little details but my 1:00 I was off . My first yard was not far but
> one
> of my big ones . The grass was thick , as the Hurricane has put me behind
> a
> bit. I'm watching my e meter and using just enough power to get the job
> done
> which ended up pulling 23 ah for the 6 orbitals . This is great as %80 of
> my
> yards will be smaller and easier , I'm starting to feel like this could
> work. Of course my customer is impressed , but as I've been doing her yard
> for 20 years 10 of which with some kind of electric truck, they tell me
> what
> I've been hearing allot lately , " I was wondering when your where going
> to
> convert your lawn mower to electric,,,,," . I had a lot of reasons for not
> doing it , just like people have a lot of reasons they think they can't
> drive an electric car , . " I need it to work , I can't be playing around
> with a tool the isn't going to do the job" . I have been looking back and
> trying to figure when or what made to take this next step , . I often
> thing
> when talking to people over the phone or e mail , who have never
> experienced
> the trill of being in a " real " electric car/ truck , If they could just
> get a ride in one it would set that ev fire going . That's what happened
> to
> me after the test run on the first ev mower ( and yes 10 years ago with my
> first electric tuck) . So after the grass cutting I put the mower on the
> trailer , plugged it in , set the amps at 35 ( somewhere I saw where rich
> said not to run pfc chargers on full when running on dc) and the e meter
> in
> the truck say 18 amps , which makes sense as my truck is 150v lawn mower
> 72v
> . I can see this is going to take about 40 minutes to charge , but I still
> have weed wacking and have to blow off the drive , then a 20 minute drive
> to
> the next yard , 10 miles away where most of my work is . My customer cuts
> hair out of her house and had just put her customer under the hair dryer .
> "
> Come in and let me give you a hair cut " . She started telling her
> customer
> about my electric truck , and I answered all the usual questions , I have
> that big ev grin going from the lawn mower project , but I controlled
> myself
> and let them do most of the talking , as I've seen how others with EV
> madness can turn people off by being JUST TO DAM HAPPY about the whole
> thing. It is not easy being so excited about something but one thing my
> wife
> has thought me through the years is , at some point people just don't want
> to hear about it any more and its best not to get to that point . As hard
> as
> this might be to believe I have not said one word about my electric mower
> to
> my wife . NOT ONE WORD. soooo after my hair cut and the drive to Port
> Saint
> Lucie the mower was all charged up . My 2nd yard was a easy one , with the
> grass not to long and I would say about the same as %75 of the yards I
> have
> . I again ran the mower using just enough to get the job done , and cut
> the
> whole thing using just 15 ah ! good thing as no 3 was just around the
> corner
> and I was at -10 ah when I pulled up to it . Another easy one and I was
> at -25 ah when done ( used 15 ah again ) . The neighbor was working in the
> back dealing with some hurricane clean up and I stopped and asked if he
> wanted me to grind up that pile he was working on , "ya , please" .. The
> electric made short work of the pile and of course he was blown away by
> the
> whole thing .
> to be continued ,
> steve clunn
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
You're welcome. If you're going to bolt together commercially made
parts, all you need in the beginning is the good DVM (and maybe a
couple lesser DVMs) and a Tong Tester or equiv ammeter. You can
acquire the other stuff as you go along.
The strongest advice for a beginner is this. Don't weaken and go for
cheap instruments. You'll chase your *ss trying to figure out if the
anomalous readings ARE anomalous or if you just don't understand what
you're seeing. When the cheap meter is generating the readings.....
Like with tools, if you buy good you only buy once.
John
On Sun, 6 Nov 2005 14:28:08 -0800 (PST), Ken Albright
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>John,
>
>Thanks for all the good info. Not only is my
>pocketbook straining, but my understanding as well.
>I'm a newbie to this whole field and hope I can
>acquire parts that will more or less let me 'plug and
>play'. However, as I discover the need for these
>instruments, I'll know what to look for.
>
>Thanks
>
>Ken
---
John De Armond
See my website for my current email address
http://www.johngsbbq.com
Cleveland, Occupied TN
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
What is the benefit of having multiple lesser DVMs in addition to a
good DVM?
On Sunday, November 6, 2005, at 09:03 PM, Neon John wrote:
You're welcome. If you're going to bolt together commercially made
parts, all you need in the beginning is the good DVM (and maybe a
couple lesser DVMs) and a Tong Tester or equiv ammeter. You can
acquire the other stuff as you go along.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Nov 6, 2005, at 6:03 PM, Neon John wrote:
The strongest advice for a beginner is this. Don't weaken and go for
cheap instruments. You'll chase your *ss trying to figure out if the
anomalous readings ARE anomalous or if you just don't understand what
you're seeing. When the cheap meter is generating the readings.....
Like with tools, if you buy good you only buy once.
I have to second this. I don't have nearly all the good stuff that John
pointed out, but those items I have are good ones.
I find the first and best interment I have for working on my EV is my
Fluke DMM. Its a *must* - 90% of what an EV needs can be determined
with a quality DMM. If you want to build an EV, or just work with
electricity, you need this.
I've also used cheap crud. It's caused me more confusion than any
lacking in hardware.
Paul "neon" G.
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--- Begin Message ---
I'm about 1/4 the way to having the cash to build a car like
this to get my hands dirty. I'm expecting to spend $2-3k on
a bare conversion and minor restoration of my Triumph GT6.
Thinking of perhaps a 96V setup that would allow 60-65 mph
or more top speed and 30 miles range at 50 mph. The GT6 is
very light(1,793 pounds, with 650 or so pounds of things to
remove) and reasonably aerodynamic(.32 Cd, 14.9 square foot
frontal area), so I may have better results, but so long as
I have 30 miles range and about a 50 mph top speed I'll be
happy, for a first conversion. If I have 50 miles range and
80 mph top speed from the above? That would kick ass, but
I'm not going to count on it.
I don't intend to keep it this way when finished though, by
no means. I originally wanted to duplicate the best
characteristics of Cocconi's CRX and Wayland's Blue Meanie
in the same car by going for a huge amount of battery
weight(40-50%) PLUS a good finish and nice stereo system in
a car that is both light and aero. Given my financial
situation(struggling college student with parent not capable
of working), that Hi Pro conversion is just not going to
happen while I'm still in school. After it's initially on
the road, I will keep upgrading it as I gather the cash for
each improvement, so it may be quite fast 1 or 2 years after
it's initially on the road.
I hope what will start as a humble conversion with an
aircraft starter motor/generator, Curtis, floodies, and bad
boy charger will be a tire smoker with a Jim Husted modified
WarP 9'' motor, Zilla 1k, PFC charger, regs, and a 300V pack
of Orbitals or Optimas. The tire smoker may have 80-100
miles range, 0-60 in 6 seconds, and 140 mph top speed. At
least that's what the simulations show.
In the meantime, that initial cheap conversion will at least
have me driving an EV, instead of waiting a few years to
amass the $10-12k to make it a tire smoker. Best of all,
each upgrade I make will improve the performance, bringing
it one step closer to my goal, and I'll learn a hell of a
lot in the meantime so that I don't destroy something
expensive. I'll also be able to show it to a few friends
that are interested in this car. As possible in theory
building that long range and fast covnersion may be for
cheap, in practice it's not likely for a first conversion.
Errors do get made and they can cost thousands of dollars.
I enjoyed seeing Lee's and John's descriptions of their
first conversions. Lets me know what to expect. In fact,
given Wayland's description of his car, I may start off with
a contactor setup(as opposed to a squealing Curtis) just to
have some fun with the 0-30 mph launches. I just wouldn't be
able to let others drive it unless I was in the car with
them, in case they'd floor it from a stop...
No adaptor is made for my car, thus I will be making my own.
My machining skills are limited, but I can learn and I could
also get access to my University's machine shop(Or even
better yet, a CNC machine). That will take care of at least
one adaptor plate, if not also the one for the future WarP
9'' after I change out the initial motor.
I intend for this car to impress so that others may consider
EVs as a viable option in the future, but I don't expect it
to initially(Especially not the local ricers that I'd like
to embarass when it becomes a tire smoker). Even so, there
are a certain number of people that will appreciate it for
what it is after it's first on the road, especially the next
time gas prices jump again.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Does any one know how to set the LV and HV limits on a DCP DC/DC Converter.
Or does any one have a manual they can email me?
Thanks in advance
Joe
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unsubscribe
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--- Begin Message ---
You'll typically need several. Monitoring voltage and current at the
same time. Your best DVM can be designated your shop standard and the
others compared to it. By "lesser", I don't mean the ChiCom junk. I
refer to the lower end Flukes or maybe Beckmans.
Precision voltage reference chips are available. If they're mounted
in small ovens, they provide extremely stable voltages. The absolute
value is specified typically to 0.5% but the stability in a constant
temperature environment is at least an order of magnitude better. That
reference can be used to check all your meters. Use the high quality
meter to establish the value of the voltage and compare that to the
lesser meters.
Though considered obsolete commercially, standard cells are still
quite useful to the hobbyist. I still see them pop up on Ebay. I see
several there now. Item 7558986489 is at $10 and expires in a few
hours and is a very nice unit. I particularly like these old cells
because they've aged in already.
The output of a standard cell is 1.01800 volts. The cell cannot supply
any current but DVMs with a 10Mohm input impedance will work. If
current is drawn from a cell, it takes several days to settle down
again. Likewise after shipping. I'd give a recently received cell a
month to settle before using it. The output varies a little with
temperature so keep it at about room temperature.
These things have mercury AND cadmium in 'em so if you're a
chemophobe, pass 'em on by. For everyone else, standard cells are a
poor man's calibration standard.
I recommend having a standard resistor on hand to check shunts and
ammeters with. A General Radio oil filled resistor is about as good
as they come. Typically specified with a 0.02% tolerance, they serve
as the shop standard. Resistors in the range of 1 to 0.01 ohm are
commonly available inexpensively. I can't find one on sleazebay right
now but they pop up.
A slightly less tightly spec'd resistor is item 7555889489. This is
an air-cooled resistor and isn't as stable as the oil-filled ones.
This price is high. I've never paid more than about $20 for the
oil-filled ones (over a kilobuck new). I just post the number for
reference.
With a voltage and resistance standard on hand, other DC values can be
derived.
John
On Sun, 6 Nov 2005 21:45:03 -0500, John <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
>What is the benefit of having multiple lesser DVMs in addition to a
>good DVM?
>
>On Sunday, November 6, 2005, at 09:03 PM, Neon John wrote:
>
>> You're welcome. If you're going to bolt together commercially made
>> parts, all you need in the beginning is the good DVM (and maybe a
>> couple lesser DVMs) and a Tong Tester or equiv ammeter. You can
>> acquire the other stuff as you go along.
>>
>
---
John De Armond
See my website for my current email address
http://www.johngsbbq.com
Cleveland, Occupied TN
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--- Begin Message ---
Works quite well for sailors & surfers. While going with the tide in the
bay you can experience 5 or 6 knots of speed for free. Yes there should be
turbines in the bay. However with salt water as the enviroment it is a very
tough on machines. Lots of maintanance. But there is more power in the San
Francisco bay than Hetch Hetchy. You just have to build the collector.
Lawrence Rhodes.....
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--- Begin Message ---
On Nov 6, 2005, at 10:30 PM, OhNoJoe wrote:
Does any one know how to set the LV and HV limits on a DCP DC/DC
Converter.
Yes. There are trim pots on the unit, right next to the fuse, if I
remember correctly. At any rate, they're in line with all the output
spade connectors. They should be labeled. You'll need a small
screwdriver to turn them, though I'm not sure whether it's flathead or
phillips.
Or does any one have a manual they can email me?
Not in PDF form, and not handy enough to scan/photograph, I'm afraid.
Someone else might, if you really need a picture.
-Ben
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--- Begin Message ---
I like the idea of a shunt wound motor and regen for San Francisco hills.
Seems to me a light 72v EV aught to climb the hills slow and come down slow.
I would be better than an NEV. I have no experience with these motors but
I'd like to build one to find out. The regen is a safety factor to me.
LR.....
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
48V Meanie ran 52 miles on just 8 golf car
batteries, though admittedly, we went a tepid 35 mph for the test loop
This is the max speed for cars in San Francisco with no freeway use. I
suspect the shunt motor will be about the same performance and with 12
batteries more speed and range. If it did just 20 miles it would be plenty.
Am I right that the shunt motor is about the type of motor as your generator
motor????? Again the regen is a major plus for hilly areas with stop signs.
Lawrence Rhodes...
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hello all,
I was wondering if anyone has any studies or papers in regard to the questions
below. I submitted my questions to Fran Pavley. A copy of the email is below.
Dear Fran Pavley,
I am writing to you in hopes of getting an answer to my question. I have been
a follower alternative fuels for a number of years. In all my studies and
numerous papers I read, I have yet to find an argument that supports a hydrogen
infrastructure over an electric infrastructure. To put it in simpler terms,
why have a fuel cell car over an electric car? Seems like the only hurdle with
an electric car is range. This problem is far closer to a solution verses all
the hurdles that need to be conquered with hydrogen. Some say the cost of
hydrogen fueled car will never be cheaper than an electric car.
Another question that will clearly point this out. Let's say we have two equal
amounts of energy, it can be solar or fossil fuel. One amount is used to
generate electricity to power an electric car. The other equal amount is used
to generate hydrogen. With both cars being equal in weight and other
parameters being equal, how far would each car travel? My guess would be that
the electric car would travel significantly further.
I hope you can help me find the answer to my questions because as of now, I am
not convinced that a hydrogen infrastructure is the way to go.
Sincerely, Allan Alessio
AB 740 - Clean Air, Clean Water, and Coastal Protection Act
On February 19th, 2003, Fran Pavley officially introduced AB 740, The Clean
Air, Clean Water, and Coastal Protection Act of 2004. This piece of
legislation, if approved by the Legislature, would put a bond measure on the
ballot (most likely the March 2004 ballot) for $2.9 billion worth of general
obligation bonds for the financing of an air and water quality and coastal
protection program. Specifically, $500 million of the $2.9 billion would go
towards hydrogen fueling infrastructure and consumer incentives for the
purchase of fuel cell vehicles. This legislation would also set the stage for
additional hydrogen financing by requiring a plan to be submitted to the
Legislature that authorizes the financing of subsequent fueling infrastructure
development through revenue bonds supported by a tax on hydrogen. EIN has
provided, and will continue to provide when asked, technical and educational
support to legislators and their staffs.
AB 740 was brought to committee on February 2, 2004. Despite receiving
overwhelming committee bipartisan support, it was put on suspense because of
the California budget crisis. The bill is expected to be reintroduced in
January 2005.
---------------------------------
Yahoo! FareChase - Search multiple travel sites in one click.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Neon John wrote:
On Sat, 5 Nov 2005 11:58:40 -0800 (PST), Ken Albright
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
I beginning to collect tools for my conversion project
(the whole reason for any project, right?). One is the
multimeter. Besides DCV to 2 or 3 decimal places, what
else do I need? Any recommended brands/models?
There is basically Fluke and the rest of the random data generators.
yeah, they're expensive but worth every penny.
I have to agree with John. I'm in the market for a new multimeter, as
half the functions on my (15-year-old-was-used-when-I-got-it) Fluke 77
don't work, including the Amps and the 300mV (fuses are good -- thing is
just borked).
I spent years repairing test equipment. Most of it was Fluke,
Tektronics and HP. Guess what I own now? Fluke multimeter, Tektronics
scope. Haven't (yet) had a need for a counter, wave gen, but when I do,
it will be one of those brands. Don't bother with the $20 meter you see
at Sears -- get good equipment.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Typically, if isolated, there's no problem. Best bet is to check the
manual / contact the company.
A transformer doesn't necessarily mean it's isolated. Nor does an ohm
check, for that matter.
Robert Chew wrote:
Hi All,
Possible to hook up three 24 volt battery chargers in series to obtain the
72volt nominal voltage for my 72 volt battery pack?/ Provided that they are
all isolated. Also, my charger's are transformed type. Just like to find out
another method of testing to be sure that they are isolated besides testing
the negative of the output with the earth or the neutral of the AC.
Cheers
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
For anyone interested, Croatia has declared 2006 as the year of Tesla. I
visited his place of birth recently. Here is the article from the Croatia
government pages. It is in English:
http://www.vlada.hr/default.asp?gl=200511030000015
Roderick
Roderick Wilde, President, EV Parts Inc.
Your Online EV Superstore
www.evparts.com
1-360-385-7082
Phone: 360-582-1270 Fax: 360-582-1272
PO Box 834, Carlsborg, WA 98324
108-B Business Park Loop, Sequim, WA 98382
--
Internal Virus Database is out-of-date.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.344 / Virus Database: 267.12.4/146 - Release Date: 10/21/2005
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
** Reply to message from Eric Poulsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> on Sun, 06 Nov 2005
22:44:54 -0800
> Don't bother with the $20 meter you see
> at Sears -- get good equipment.
I just checked out Flukes. Wow!
Is there nothing that doesn't cost a weeks pay?
Dale Curren
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
In a message dated 11/6/05 5:05:45 PM Pacific Standard Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
<< Subj: Re: "Fall" Power of DC race results
Date: 11/6/05 5:05:45 PM Pacific Standard Time
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (BadFishRacing)
Sender: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-to: [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Hello all,
The Fall Power of DC was just a good a time for me as it was for Shawn and
his crew.
For starters, just getting to hang out in Shawn Lawless' EV shop was a
treat. The professional toys, tools, parts, gadgets and machinery at
Lawless Industries explains why he produces such clean professional looking
rides.
I warmed up with a soft run as I like to see what the bike will do
mechanically without full power on tap. Oh yeah, SHAWN, the turbo Hayabusa
ONLY turned a 1.581 60' time to your 1.5-.
Then it's time to hit it with a stiff charge. I managed to turn my 30amp
charging inline fuse holder into a wet noodle. The fuse never blew, but
once the holder turned to mush, kinda lost connectivity. Guess the lesson
here is don't use automotive rated parts for EVs?
Second run was a bust. Driver error shut me down early in the run.
Third run the bike pulled really nice, but didn't really get up to speed.
Launch was hard, S/P shifting pulled hard, trans seemed to pull in. But the
1/8th mile was only 9.928s @63.81 MPH.
Back to the pits and the motors were pretty warm. Motors are sucking amps,
but I don't know where the power is going? This time I hooked up the
modular 15V chargers. One battery definately showed up being weaker than
the rest. But not much we could do about it.
Fourth run was like the previous. No surprises. 9.838s @ 64.24MPH. About
0.3seconds better than the Summer Power of DC, but not as good as we should
be running with all the fancy hardware I've added?
All in all it was a great day for a great race. A bad day racing always
beats a good day working. And I'd say we had a fair day racing.
After just unloading and soaking up the timeslips, the results look better.
I turned a 2.093 60' time. Nearly my best. The bike is hooking up fine,
launching clean, but the power is disappearing where after that? Further
investigation tonite revealed that there is a mechanical problem in the 2nd
gear clutch. I knew we were making power, just didn't know where it was
going. Definately not all to the asphalt. Now to figure out a
solution......
Thanks to Chip for coming out and helping, officiating, etc.
Congratulations to latest OJ driver Brian for not turning left until the end
of the track. All those dirt track habits are hard to break.
If anyone else has an itch to hit the track, post to the list. You never
know who might show up.
Darin Gilbert
BadFishRacing >>
>>Its good to see the word fun written here.Glad to see you both doing so
well.Darin .2 seconds are huge in drag racing.I wish I could now shave off.2
seconds from CEs best times on every outing.Shawn your car is amazing me.
Dennis Berube Current Eliminator Dragster
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
----- Original Message -----
From: Dale Curren<mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, November 07, 2005 4:52 AM
Subject: Re: multimeter
** Reply to message from Eric Poulsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]<mailto:[EMAIL
PROTECTED]>> on Sun, 06 Nov 2005
22:44:54 -0800
> Don't bother with the $20 meter you see
> at Sears -- get good equipment.
I just checked out Flukes. Wow!
Is there nothing that doesn't cost a weeks pay?
Dale Curren
Try your local electronics repair and supply shops. There are normally the
ones in industrial parks. Also while you are there in the area, visit the
electric motor repair shops too. Find out what equipment they have and used.
Also, another source of supply, is a local wholesale electrical supplier.
Some of these suppliers, will sell to a Electrical Vehicle Research Systems
which you are.
I am known as EV Systems.
Roland
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi,
I have King Pins on this Bombardier 99' EV and was curious if anyone is
familiar with putting another vehicle ball joint type front end or modifying
king pins to remove the slop. Apparently the small king pins used introduce
steering instability. Do any normal vehicles use king pins? I thought all
were ball joints with upper & lower control arms.
I added an anti-sway bar from a Mazda B2000 pickup to help the cheesey
wishbone suspension. Peacockltd, the distributor said 10K bomb's were made but
now I think it's more like 10 since I havn't heard any others on the list with
one. I got all the electrical stuff working now since I replaced everything.
Thanks, Mark
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Send me your address off list. I've got a manual.
peace,
--- Ben Apollonio <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> On Nov 6, 2005, at 10:30 PM, OhNoJoe wrote:
>
> > Does any one know how to set the LV and HV limits
> on a DCP DC/DC
> > Converter.
> Yes. There are trim pots on the unit, right next to
> the fuse, if I
> remember correctly. At any rate, they're in line
> with all the output
> spade connectors. They should be labeled. You'll
> need a small
> screwdriver to turn them, though I'm not sure
> whether it's flathead or
> phillips.
>
> > Or does any one have a manual they can email me?
> Not in PDF form, and not handy enough to
> scan/photograph, I'm afraid.
> Someone else might, if you really need a picture.
>
> -Ben
>
>
'92 Honda Civic sedan, 144V (video or DVD available)!
www.budget.net/~bbath/CivicWithACord.html
____
__/__|__\ __
=D-------/ - - \
'O'-----'O'-'
Would you still drive your car if the tailpipe came out of the steering wheel?
Are you saving any gas for your kids?
__________________________________
Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Those Fluke 77's are lifetime warrantied - if it's gone belly-up. you should
be able to get it repaired for free!
Joseph H. Strubhar
E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Web: www.gremcoinc.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "Eric Poulsen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Sunday, November 06, 2005 10:44 PM
Subject: Re: multimeter
> Neon John wrote:
>
> >On Sat, 5 Nov 2005 11:58:40 -0800 (PST), Ken Albright
> ><[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> >>I beginning to collect tools for my conversion project
> >>(the whole reason for any project, right?). One is the
> >>multimeter. Besides DCV to 2 or 3 decimal places, what
> >>else do I need? Any recommended brands/models?
> >>
> >>
> >
> >There is basically Fluke and the rest of the random data generators.
> >yeah, they're expensive but worth every penny.
> >
> >
> >
> I have to agree with John. I'm in the market for a new multimeter, as
> half the functions on my (15-year-old-was-used-when-I-got-it) Fluke 77
> don't work, including the Amps and the 300mV (fuses are good -- thing is
> just borked).
>
> I spent years repairing test equipment. Most of it was Fluke,
> Tektronics and HP. Guess what I own now? Fluke multimeter, Tektronics
> scope. Haven't (yet) had a need for a counter, wave gen, but when I do,
> it will be one of those brands. Don't bother with the $20 meter you see
> at Sears -- get good equipment.
>
>
--- End Message ---
