EV Digest 5098
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Battery Beach Burnout and , Who an' Where?
by "Bob Rice" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: Volksrabbit issues
by "Roland Wiench" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Re: Do/Did Edison Batteries emit Hydrogen gas?
by "Roland Wiench" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Re: Page 36 in the Harbor Freight catalog.
by Doug Weathers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Link to EV article in Burlington, Iowa newspaper, The Hawk Eye
by "David (Battery Boy) Hawkins" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Re: MR2 Power steering pump
by Ryan Bohm <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Re: Volksrabbit issues
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) RE: Solar/battery setup, recommended electronics?
by Mike & Paula Willmon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) Re: Solar/battery setup, recommended electronics?
by Marc Breitman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) RE: Solar/battery setup, recommended electronics?
by Mike & Paula Willmon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Re: Volksrabbit issues
by "Paul G." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Why no switching in the controller??-
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
13) Re: Gliders
by Mike Ellis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Re: Vacuum assist for brakes... was Re: Page 36 in the Harbor Freight
catalog.
by Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) Re: OT - 7.2 volt NiCad Pack - Source Wanted
by Evan Tuer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) Re: battery confusion abounds was Re: Bad floodies??
by M Bianchi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) 72Volt charger
by Jeff Shanab <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Direct Drive, Rubber Poochies & Flabulation
by "Mark Hanson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Electric Caravan on eBay
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
20) Re: OT - 7.2 volt NiCad Pack - Source Wanted
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
21) Re: OT - 7.2 volt NiCad Pack - Source Wanted
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
22) Re: Solar/battery setup, recommended electronics?
by Marc Breitman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) Currie Folder: opinions?
by Tim Clevenger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
24) Re: Gliders - Terminology Check
by "STEVE CLUNN" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
25) Re: Solar/battery setup, recommended electronics?
by MIKE & PAULA WILLMON <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
26) RE: Why no switching in the controller??-
by Cor van de Water <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
27) RE: Vacuum assist for brakes... was Re: Page 36 in the Harbor Fre
ight catalog.
by Cor van de Water <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
28) RE: power steering
by Cor van de Water <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
29) Re: Kostov
by "Rich Rudman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
Hi EVerybody;
Whose going to BBB? Just curious, like where will folks be staying?Would
imagine there are cheepo motels around in West Palm?Will be Jet Bluing in
Fri.
Seeya?
Bob
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hello Mike,
The taper lock motor adapter and transmission adapter you made up for me, for
the Warp 9 motor works great. The pattern for a 1994 C10 V-6 engine fits the
1975 350 cu.in. engine pattern press steel bell housing and Saginaw
transmission.
The Warp 9 motor is 5/8 inch longer than the GE motor that I having
remanufacture by a GE motor shop. The transmission adapters which is a full
pattern that covers the entire bell-housing, I was able to leave off the
bell-housing cover plate, which gain me 1/4 inch. The bell housing which is
deeper than the C-10 transmission bell housing, I position the flywheel another
0.125 out further. I was able to adjust the throw-out bearing to work just
right.
Now, when I get my GE motor back, which has a built in transmission adapter
right into the motor bell housing, I am going to use a Circlematic auto
transmission that will bolt right up to the GE end bell. There will no torque
converter in it, rather a front pump drive shaft that will connect directly to
the taper lock motor adapter that will plug right into the front pump on the
transmission.
The flange pattern on this shaft fits all TH-350/400 Chevy crank shafts. When I
get this pump shaft, I will see if it matches the existing set screw motor
adapter, and if it does, than I will send that adapter to you for you to make a
taper lock one.
This automatic are normally design for racing, but the valve body on these have
a pressure release that you control with a clutch pedal so you can have a soft
start like a standard clutch type transmission.
Have you even work on this type of units?
Roland
----- Original Message -----
From: Electro Automotive<mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, January 16, 2006 8:00 PM
Subject: Re: Volksrabbit issues
At 04:04 PM 1/16/06 -0800, you wrote:
>The motor is actually under the motor mount on the body of the car. Is a
>piece of sheet metal enough to hold it in place?
The mount we use is 3/16" steel, and mounts to the original factory bracket
on the chassis with a rubber bushing. Yours looks much thinner. Too thin.
> There is a gap of an eighth of an inch between the adapter plate and
> the 9 inch ADC.
Why is there a gap between the adaptor and the motor? The adaptor should
mount flush against the motor face.
> This baby is stuffed in there.
Yes, it is.
> I don't know if I want to spend the 300 plus bucks for an
> Electroautomotive adapter or do it myself.
You mean motor mount, not adaptor.
>I'm also worried about the motor unloaded spin. It seems to stop much
>quicker than other electric motors I have used in my other cars. About 15
>seconds of spin compared to what seems like a minute on other motors.
The gap in the adaptor, combined with the quick rundown, suggests to me
that there is a problem in your adaptor, and the mainshaft of the
transmission is pressed up against the motor shaft, or the adaptor hub,
effectively locking them together. This would also make it very hard to
shift, because the clutch can't work.
Mike Brown
Electro Automotive POB 1113 Felton CA 95018-1113 Telephone 831-429-1989
http://www.electroauto.com<http://www.electroauto.com/> [EMAIL
PROTECTED]<mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Electric Car Conversion Kits * Components * Books * Videos * Since 1979
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
----- Original Message -----
From: Mark Freidberg<mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, January 16, 2006 9:22 PM
Subject: Do/Did Edison Batteries emit Hydrogen gas?
Do/Did Edison Batteries emit Hydrogen gas?
Mark Freidberg
EAA member
Hello Mark,
I am looking in my battery hand book and its states that the
nickel-iron-alkaline cell is known in the U.S. as the Edison Cell.
The active materials of the Edison battery consist of nickel hydrate for the
positive plate and iron oxide for the negative plate. The electrolyte is 1.200
sg of potassium hydroxide in water.
The chemical reactions which take place in the nickel-iron-alkaline cells
differ in one important respect from the reactions which take place in the
lead-acid type cells, in that the electrolyte does not enter into the chemical
reactions which occur at the plates.
On discharge oxygen is transferred from the positive (nickel) to the negative
(iron) plates, Its serves merely as a carrier of oxygen between the plates.
On charge the transfer is in the opposite direction.
Therefore there is no hydrogen release.
The liberation of oxygen accounts for the gassing of a nickel-iron-alkaline
cell during charge.
If you goggle by typing in your search engine: Alkaline Storage Batteries or
Nickel-iron-alkaline cells or Edison battery you may fine more data on this
type of battery.
Roland
---------------------------------
Yahoo! Photos
Got holiday prints? See all the ways to get quality prints in your hands
ASAP.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Jan 16, 2006, at 12:56 PM, Neon John wrote:
I happened to have been in the local HF store yesterday and saw these
"specials". The battery tester is a toy, probably a one use affair.
It looks like the ~8ga leads form a large part of the load resistor.
I bought one of the HF battery load testers with the nifty digital
display and the heating elements in it. Got a great deal on it, too.
Until I tried to use it to test some batteries and melted the switch.
Then I read the directions and you're supposed to wait five minutes
between tests. Not too bad if you only have one battery...
--
Doug Weathers
Bend, OR, USA
<http://learn-something.blogsite.org/>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
All,
This article first appeared in our local paper, the Old Lyons Recorder, on 12-22-05, and was slightly modified and shortened for the Iowa newspaper linked below. By shortened, it looks like the author dropped the paragraph describing an EV as an electric vehicle, among other things. Keep in mind that this article was based on a quick interview and some stories that were done by local newspapers around 1999 and 2003. Also, I wasn't able to proof read it and the following quotes jumped out at me:
"dedicated environmentalist and conservationist."
I prefer progressive redneck, and I'm sure I mentioned that!
"a trip to Boulder and back, about 70 miles or so"
A round trip to The Peoples Republic of Boulder is around 30 miles, and 70 miles was the truck's range with new batteries.
The "bystander" in the article is actually the author, Bob.
"The clutch is gone."
It still has a clutch and clutch pedal, but you obviously don't need it to start out. For shifting I use a switch on the shifter that toggles the poor man's regenerative braking, an alternator on the tail shaft of the traction motor, between the brake light switch, or manually for shifting and descending steep hills.
Enjoy...
http://www.thehawkeye.com/columns/saar/Saar_0115.html
Dave (B.B.) Hawkins
Member of the Denver Electric Vehicle Council:
http://www.devc.org/
Card carrying member and former racer with The National Electric Drag Racing Association:
http://www.nedra.com/
Lyons, CO
1979 Mazda RX-7 EV (192V of Orbs for the teenagers)
1989 GM (General Murderers of the EV-1!) S10 (144V of floodies, for Pa only!)
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi yall,
I'm about to mount an MR2 pump in my Cabriolet, hope it's not too
loud... Funny that MR2 owners don't complain :)
I've been using the MR2 pump for a happy year now. The noisest
component in my conversion is the vacuum pump. Next would probably be
the Dayton blower for the motor. Then comes the power steering pump.
With these other noises going, I sometimes wonder if the PS pump is
actually running. None of the noises are that loud. It's still much
quieter than the original ICE configuration. I really love the MR2
pump. Probably because I drove without it for a few weeks. I was
planning on using the original belt run off of an accessory electric
motor. But it was too cumbersome and (as I found out later) much
noisier than the MR2 getup.
Even though a silent EV would be awesome, I've had an experience where I
was glad I was making *some* noise. A jogger was about to cross the
road, and was smart enough to look before crossing. Had he just trusted
sound (yeah, granted most people are smart enough to look), I would have
had splattered jogger on the 200sx. Now that would have ruined my
day...not to mention the jogger's!
-Ryan
--
- EV Source <http://www.evsource.com> -
Selling names like Zilla, PFC Chargers, and WarP Motors
E-mail: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Toll-free: 1-877-215-6781
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I may have to tear the whole thing down. A newbie put this together. I
can't understand why the motor is shimmed away from the adapter plate. Also
some bolts are missing. I may try to find them. Possibly the misalignment
is caused by that I noticed a slight opening between the adapter plate and
the transmission where no bolts were. It might only have two bolts holding
it together. LR>..............
----- Original Message -----
From: "Electro Automotive" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, January 16, 2006 7:00 PM
Subject: Re: Volksrabbit issues
At 04:04 PM 1/16/06 -0800, you wrote:
The motor is actually under the motor mount on the body of the car. Is a
piece of sheet metal enough to hold it in place?
The mount we use is 3/16" steel, and mounts to the original factory
bracket on the chassis with a rubber bushing. Yours looks much thinner.
Too thin.
There is a gap of an eighth of an inch between the adapter plate and
the 9 inch ADC.
Why is there a gap between the adaptor and the motor? The adaptor should
mount flush against the motor face.
This baby is stuffed in there.
Yes, it is.
I don't know if I want to spend the 300 plus bucks for an
Electroautomotive adapter or do it myself.
You mean motor mount, not adaptor.
I'm also worried about the motor unloaded spin. It seems to stop much
quicker than other electric motors I have used in my other cars. About 15
seconds of spin compared to what seems like a minute on other motors.
The gap in the adaptor, combined with the quick rundown, suggests to me
that there is a problem in your adaptor, and the mainshaft of the
transmission is pressed up against the motor shaft, or the adaptor hub,
effectively locking them together. This would also make it very hard to
shift, because the clutch can't work.
Mike Brown
Electro Automotive POB 1113 Felton CA 95018-1113 Telephone 831-429-1989
http://www.electroauto.com [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Electric Car Conversion Kits * Components * Books * Videos * Since 1979
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Marc,
you could get a Trace (now Xantrex) C-40 (or C-30 or C-20) charge
controller for ~$130 new. Maybe cheaper used.
http://www.oksolar.com/solar_controllers/xantrex_c40.html They'll do 12V,
24V or 48V by changing user adjustable jumpers inside. They aren't fancy
like the newer MPPT (Maximum Power Point Tracking) controllers but they are
bullet proof. They ar as close to a commercial product as you can get in a
consumer product. Morningstar makes a 48V charger too that I've looked at
but never bought.
Mike
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of Marc Breitman
Sent: Monday, January 16, 2006 7:15 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Solar/battery setup, recommended electronics?
The regulations for the particular race im entering has a maximum of 32kg of
battery weight. (70.5lbs approx)
We are running an etek motor and an alltrax controller and want to run at
48v. The best setup looks like 2 optima red top batteries (listed here:
http://www.batteryweb.com/optima.cfm) since they are the seemingly the best
quality and highest output (44ah) batteries available (32lbs a piece
supposedly). The solar panels i got, (by following a good lead someone on
this listserv gave me) are a combination of (95) 5"x5" small squares each
rated at 5.6v and 1.5watts. If I can't find (4) 12v batteries which will
output just as much as the optima red tops, I would like to setup the solar
panels in series with the batteries to obtain 48v. I was originally going to
buy a solar pv charge controller to charge the batteries at 24v, however, to
get 48v i need to do something different. I am guessing any old step up
controller won't be applicable since it won't be able to handle the enormous
flux in the solar panels' current and voltage.
questions are
1. Batteries a good idea?
2. 48v everything in series going to last longer and be more efficient then
24v with a solar pv charge controller? (etek graph shows efficiency curve
nearly doubles in rpm from 24v to 48v)
3. What should i look for specifically to handle the solar panels and set
the output at 24v. (includes how to group and wire the solar panels)
~Marc
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Don..."Battery:
= 32 kg SEALED Pb-acid batteries.
= 12 kg of NiMH battery (includes charge controllers)
= 20 kg of NiCad battery
= 06 kg of Li Ion / Li Ion Polymer / Li Ion Alloy battery (includes charge
controllers). Lithium batteries require submission of sample cell and spec
sheet
to HQ by March 15th, 2005.
(This weight will be determined using scales provided by the organizers)."
soooo no..
Mike, the product looks interesting however I think all it does is charge at
12 24 or 48 which doesn't help me make a 48v system. If the batteries are
running at 24v, hooking this thing up at 48 is just going to cause problems.
I think I essentially need a reliable ~~ to 24v step up controller and then
put it in series with the (2) 12vbatteries.
~Marc
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
You'll lose more efficiency in the step up controller than you will lashing
the solar cells to run 24 volts native, I think.
Here's how you can get an extra 96 Watt hours running 48V with the exact
same battery weight and $3.50 cheaper.
First lets look at your proposal so we have something to compare to. The
Optima Red 25's have an energy density of 12V X 44AH / 32 lbs = 16.5 WH/lb.
2 in series gives you 24V X 44AH = 1056 WH at 64 lbs for a cost of $187.50.
Now look a either the TOP 12120 or UBC12120 batteries
http://www.batterywholesale.com/battery-store/proddetail.html?prodID=507.
These babies are 12V X 12AH / 8.0 lbs each = 18WH/lb. Four buddie pairs in
series will give you 48V X 24AH = 1152 WH at 64 lbs for a cost of $184.
Now this give you 96 WH more energy for the same weight and cost.
But your are still 6.5 lbs shy of your limit. If you were to just add 6.5lb
X 18WH/lb = you could potentially add another 117 WH to your energy pack.
You would have to do a little more searching to find a combination of 6V or
12V batteries with the highest WH/lb rating that you could put even
multiples of their weight into 70.5 lbs. Typically bigger batteries have
more energy density than their smaller counterparts. However sometimes you
find one with specs that compete with the big boys. Ideally you'd find
four 12V batteries with the highest AH rating that weigh 17.625 lbs each. If
you're competing you might as well go for every Amp Hour :-)
Mike
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of Marc Breitman
Sent: Monday, January 16, 2006 10:24 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Solar/battery setup, recommended electronics?
Don..."Battery:
= 32 kg SEALED Pb-acid batteries.
= 12 kg of NiMH battery (includes charge controllers)
= 20 kg of NiCad battery
= 06 kg of Li Ion / Li Ion Polymer / Li Ion Alloy battery (includes charge
controllers). Lithium batteries require submission of sample cell and spec
sheet
to HQ by March 15th, 2005.
(This weight will be determined using scales provided by the organizers)."
soooo no..
Mike, the product looks interesting however I think all it does is charge at
12 24 or 48 which doesn't help me make a 48v system. If the batteries are
running at 24v, hooking this thing up at 48 is just going to cause problems.
I think I essentially need a reliable ~~ to 24v step up controller and then
put it in series with the (2) 12vbatteries.
~Marc
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
In response to Lawrence Rhodes,
On Jan 16, 2006, at 4:52 PM, Roger Stockton wrote:
Danger Will Robinson, DANGER! ;^>
The torque reaction of the VW transaxle will force the tailshaft end of
the motor *downwards* with considerable force when accelerating
forwards, and *upwards* when accelerating in reverse.
Looking at your pictures, it seems the adapter plate is plenty beefy to
support the motor (i.e. 5/8"-3/4" aluminum plate); I believe Paul
"Neon"
Gooch's buggy has survived just fine with a Prestolite hanging off his
adapter plate with no rear mount. The bit of sheet metal I think you
are referring to appears bolted between the endbell and the body; I
expect this to break in relatively short order due to the torque
reaction forcing the endbell up and down 1/2"-1" under acceleration.
Yup, the buggy is plenty happy with the motor hanging off the
transaxle. The vehicle (old VW Beetle according to the frame) was
designed to mount the stock engine that way. Look at the large steel
tube that is the case of most electric motors - I see no reason that
needs supporting at both ends (provided the PTO end bell is also up to
the task, and most seem to be.)
Some VW busses
used a rear mount that supported the (Beetle) engine from the oil
pump/cover bolts and this apparently resulted in case related failures
that simply don't happen with the same engine in a Beetle (no rear
mount).
That is a cheesy adapter (and common.) The correct cases had proper
rear engine mounts. Universal replacement cases have them too (though
the holes may not be tapped.) Please don't put a Bug engine in a Bus!
I also built a VW Rabbit Pickup without a motor mount. Most of the
older Rabbit books refer to some early Rabbits not having a motor mount
(I have yet to see a Rabbit without one - except my conversion.) I
replaced the 3 mounts I kept (front, rear, and transaxle) with Urethane
mounts and did not have any problem (a bit more road noise is
transfered into the vehicle.) I even moved one of the 'over the motor'
battery hold down points from in front of that group of batteries to
front left side
(http://paul-g.home.comcast.net/FrameRpup/UnderHood.html shows my
modified Electro-Auto battery rack.) This places the end of the
threaded rod quite close to the adapter plate. I couldn't get enough
motion in the motor/transaxle to make contact. I never noticed any wear
or damage to the 3 remaining mounts or any vibrations that suggested
half shaft alignment issues.
HOWEVER, Roger is right. Some rubber mounts and that wimpy sheet metal
mount are not a good combination. This reminds me of the stunt of using
a solid front mount to adapt a full syncro transaxle into an older
Beetle that was built with a splitcase transaxle. When the rubber
mounts where retained at the rear the result could be a broken nose
cone (front mount attach point on the transaxle.) Similarly, it looks
like you have a setup designed to torque that wimpy motor mount with
natural motion in the rubber mounts until the poor little thing fails.
Even attaching that mount in rubber at the body wouldn't keep the sheet
metal from being the flex point. I would promptly replace it or toss it
in the trash and replace the other 3 mounts with Urethane mounts. I do
not recommend the 3 mount stunt for more than about 650 peak motor amps
(because that is all I tested to.)
Paul "neon" G.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
After some limited reading on the subject I realized that the typical DC
controllers didn't provide for internal switching for reverse. Why not?
Please keep the reply to one this novice would understand. I'm not an ee so
I'd be better understanding the 1,000 ft view vs. the finite details but
from a simplistic view why can't you "switch" internally with a controller
for the reverse?? (say a curtis brand)
There are no dumb questions only dumb questioners!
Pedroman
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
The Aveo is built for Chevy buy the Korean Daewoo. So, I suppose China has
some catching up to do, but Korea's the low ball man.
-Mike
On 1/16/06, Tim <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> How about the Chevy Aveo? The list price is $9890. A local Dealer in
> LaCrosse WI said that recently they been going for $7990. China can't
> beat that!
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Wanted to let new people know that I have MES-DEA pumps which cost
less than GM ones ($292) and meant for the job in an EV. 2 models are
now available.
Victor
Jeff Shanab wrote:
Sadly, yes. I looked for weeks in wrecking yards and online and couldn't
find this obsolete part. Excepton ebay at an infalted price, might as
well get the Bosch or ...
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
7.2V pack of sub-C cells is a standard radio-control model thing. It
is often possible to buy these packs (of high amp-hour, good quality
Sanyo cells) for far less than what the cells are available for
seperately.
for example ebay 6009859100 etc
Lower capacity ones can be had for around $10 I think.
They come with tags spot welded into a "stick" configuration, but it
is easy to reconfigure them by snipping the tags in the centre of the
join and soldering the tags together in the layout you want (OK for
low current applications) - a lot easier than trying to solder
directly to the cell, which requires a big soldering iron and is prone
to melt the seal if you're not careful.
Regards
Evan
On 1/16/06, Steven Lough <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Seems I remember some one talking about assembled Packs of Sub-C NiCad
> batteries, with tabs... Been Googling for hours, cant seem to find a
> supplier. Lots of places to buy individual cells, with tabs...but would
> rather buy an assembled pack.. Like the Picture Below...
> ( see picture at:
> http://home.comcast.net/~stevenslough/NiCad7.2Pack.JPG )
>
> This is out of one of those "Swiffer" hardwood floor vaccum/duster
> thingies... And the origional Pack pre-matuely failed... it was a
> Chinese pack with a 1500mAhr rating
>
> Any one know a good source for assembled 7.2v Packs.
> I could spend a few more bucks for a pack around 2 or 2.5 ahr.
> --
> Steven S. Lough, Pres.
> Seattle EV Association
> 6021 32nd Ave. N.E.
> Seattle, WA 98115-7230
> Day: 206 850-8535
> Eve: 206 524-1351
> e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> web: http://www.seattleeva.org
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
> mike golub wrote:
> who sells the BMS?
My BADICHEQ was made by Mentzer Electronic GmbH. I don't know if they have any
representation in the US.
http://Mentzer.de
Click on english
Battery-Management
There are 3 models of BADICHEQ. Also useful:
http://www.mentzer.de/Sample_Battery_Management.117.0.html?&L=1
http://www.mentzer.de/uploads/media/General_Description_BADICHEQ3000_EN.pdf
The good news here is that it is 10 years old and continues to work.
And if you ask Google about "battery management system" you'll find many
variations on the theme.
The PowerCheq from PowerDesigners.com looks like a very scalable balancing
technology. They also make chargers.
http://www.powerdesigners.com/
And this looks interesting ...
http://www.acpropulsion.com/Products/Battery_mgt.htm
Basically, the message is "study up" before making any decision.
--
Mike Bianchi
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
ebay has a 72Volt ?? charger 1kw with pfc
item # 4605500072
Just thought i remember someone talking about 72V systems recently
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi,
I got my SepEx motor in the Cushman last night and was curious from the
mechanical engineers here what would the implication be of not having a slip
yoke or slide spline on the drive shaft. The motor is mounted on 4 rubber
poochies (engine mounts) which allows the motor to flabulate ( move for and
aft) +- 1/4". I have a 1" hex shaft going into a slide drive on the
differential but it makes a clacking noise so I'm going to tap, set screw and
lock-tite it. I was curious if there is any pre-loading bearing worm gear
problems associated with direct driving from a differential to a motor which
when the rear wheels bounce up and down the motor would move about an 1/8" of
an inch it appears. The drive shaft is fairly long about 4 feet and in direct
line with the rear of 5 leaf springs, a fairly stiff rear end about +-1" of up
* down travel.
Thanks, Mark (next week at Synchrony)
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=4605088397
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I haven't ordered from these guys but their prices seem pretty good. They have
tabbed cells and assembled packs. They even list a sale item 7.2V Nicad pack at
around $13.
Rick
-----Original Message-----
From: Steven Lough <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List RCVR <[email protected]>
Sent: Mon, 16 Jan 2006 14:33:24 -0800
Subject: OT - 7.2 volt NiCad Pack - Source Wanted
Seems I remember some one talking about assembled Packs of Sub-C NiCad
batteries, with tabs... Been Googling for hours, cant seem to find a supplier.
Lots of places to buy individual cells, with tabs...but would rather buy an
assembled pack.. Like the Picture Below...
( see picture at: http://home.comcast.net/~stevenslough/NiCad7.2Pack.JPG )
This is out of one of those "Swiffer" hardwood floor vaccum/duster thingies...
And the origional Pack pre-matuely failed... it was a Chinese pack with a
1500mAhr rating
Any one know a good source for assembled 7.2v Packs.
I could spend a few more bucks for a pack around 2 or 2.5 ahr.
-- Steven S. Lough, Pres.
Seattle EV Association
6021 32nd Ave. N.E.
Seattle, WA 98115-7230
Day: 206 850-8535
Eve: 206 524-1351
e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
web: http://www.seattleeva.org
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
OOPs I forgot the link info. Http://www.batteryspace.com
Rick
-----Original Message-----
From: Steven Lough <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List RCVR <[email protected]>
Sent: Mon, 16 Jan 2006 14:33:24 -0800
Subject: OT - 7.2 volt NiCad Pack - Source Wanted
Seems I remember some one talking about assembled Packs of Sub-C NiCad
batteries, with tabs... Been Googling for hours, cant seem to find a supplier.
Lots of places to buy individual cells, with tabs...but would rather buy an
assembled pack.. Like the Picture Below...
( see picture at: http://home.comcast.net/~stevenslough/NiCad7.2Pack.JPG )
This is out of one of those "Swiffer" hardwood floor vaccum/duster thingies...
And the origional Pack pre-matuely failed... it was a Chinese pack with a
1500mAhr rating
Any one know a good source for assembled 7.2v Packs.
I could spend a few more bucks for a pack around 2 or 2.5 ahr.
-- Steven S. Lough, Pres.
Seattle EV Association
6021 32nd Ave. N.E.
Seattle, WA 98115-7230
Day: 206 850-8535
Eve: 206 524-1351
e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
web: http://www.seattleeva.org
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Im going to half to disagree with using UBC batteries, or any type of
"generic battery" which comes in all shapes and sizes. Last year the school
team (im working with a partner) tried this method (on both cars) against
our recommendations and killed the batteries in about 15 minutes (one of
them even had a solar panel on it). The discharge capacity is rated way
lower then the larger batteries, has enormously less CCA and far less
reserve capacity. The reason I chose optima is because of the extremly large
surface area of the lead plates, high discharge capacity and high CCA as
well as resistance to vibration and "hard wear."
one car at 24v and one at 48, both failed.
Fortunately for us our car was running two deep cycle odyssey batteries and
went through with flying colors. This year, we can't use those batteries
because they are too heavy, deep cycle (not as much output) and also seem to
have serious charge sustaining issues due to some mishandling.
~Marc
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi guys,
I'm looking to buy a Currie folding bicycle for about a 5 mile round-trip
commute. I require a folding bike to carry on the train, and I prefer one
with fenders to reduce puddle splashup. Does anybody have any experience
with the Currie folding bike?
Thanks.
Tim
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
----- Original Message -----
From: "Electro Automotive"
Small point of terminology here. A "glider" is a rolling chassis acquired
without engine, exhaust, fuel, and cooling systems. Manufacturers almost
NEVER supply these for conversion. Even Solectria was buying new Metros
from a dealer to make Forces.
I have 2 russen trucks that are glider's ( shipping weight was 1300 lbs I
was told) , never had a engine in , all new sun baked interrer. I would let
one go for $400 and a title for the other or best offer. they can be seen
at http://www.grassrootsev.com/convcan.htm
steve clunn 772 971 0533
What is generally being discussed on this list is a "donor" chassis, which
was once a fully functional ICE vehicle, and will be stripped of the ICE
components for conversion.
Shari Prange
Electro Automotive POB 1113 Felton CA 95018-1113 Telephone 831-429-1989
http://www.electroauto.com [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Electric Car Conversion Kits * Components * Books * Videos * Since 1979
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I can't argue with experience. Come to think of it I don't reallly know the
discharge they rate of those generics at. It seems for their intended purpose
it would be at a low amp draw. Which brings about a question. What rate did
you discharge your odyssey 's? If it is between the 1 to 5 hr rate then what
would the cooresponding capacity of your Optima's be at that rate? I think the
44AH is a C20 rate. I note that the Deka AGM's have slightly higher charge
density than the Optima's, however finding one with the block size low enough
that you could fit two in under your weight limit is your stated problem. I
hope you can find the right combo. From the little time I spent browsing it
looks as if you are on the best solution so far.
Mike
***********************************************************************************
Marc wrote:
Im going to half to disagree with using UBC batteries, or any type of
"generic battery" which comes in all shapes and sizes. Last year the school
team (im working with a partner) tried this method (on both cars) against
our recommendations and killed the batteries in about 15 minutes (one of
them even had a solar panel on it). The discharge capacity is rated way
lower then the larger batteries, has enormously less CCA and far less
reserve capacity. The reason I chose optima is because of the extremly large
surface area of the lead plates, high discharge capacity and high CCA as
well as resistance to vibration and "hard wear."
one car at 24v and one at 48, both failed.
Fortunately for us our car was running two deep cycle odyssey batteries and
went through with flying colors. This year, we can't use those batteries
because they are too heavy, deep cycle (not as much output) and also seem to
have serious charge sustaining issues due to some mishandling.
~Marc
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Simple - cost and heat.
For a DC controller, you need only 1 transistor.
(a really big and expensive one or many identical in parallel
to pretend they are one big transistor)
This one transistor is in between one of the battery wires
and the motor.
The other battery wire basically goes straight through the
controller to the motor.
If you want reverse, the two battery wires need to be reverse
connected to the motor.
To do this, you need at least 4 transistors.
In addition to the cost increase (hundreds of dollars) this
also makes the motor current always run through 2 transistors
instead of through one.
That means that double the amount of heat is produced and the
cooling needs to take care of that, so the unit must be larger
(also to accommodate the 3 extra transistors) and the
performance goes down (heat means loss of power).
Since a lot of conversions use the original transmission that
already has a reverse gear, the "backup" feature would be
unnecessary cost and losses for most DC conversions, so that
is why it was not required in the controller in the first place.
Hope this gives you a 1,000 ft view,
Cor van de Water
Systems Architect
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
Proxim Wireless Networks eFAX: +1-610-423-5743
Take your network further http://www.proxim.com
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Monday, January 16, 2006 8:34 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Why no switching in the controller??-
After some limited reading on the subject I realized that the typical DC
controllers didn't provide for internal switching for reverse. Why not?
Please keep the reply to one this novice would understand. I'm not an ee so
I'd be better understanding the 1,000 ft view vs. the finite details but
from a simplistic view why can't you "switch" internally with a controller
for the reverse?? (say a curtis brand)
There are no dumb questions only dumb questioners!
Pedroman
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Jeff Shanab wrote:
> Sadly, yes. I looked for weeks in wrecking yards and online and couldn't
> find this obsolete part. Excepton ebay at an infalted price, might as
> well get the Bosch or ...
There are still 2nd hand vacuum pumps going on Ebay, two yesterday for
about $60 incl shipping. I won one. Since I don't need it for a while,
if anyone is in a pinch then give me a shout.
Cor van de Water
Systems Architect
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
Proxim Wireless Networks eFAX: +1-610-423-5743
Take your network further http://www.proxim.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Tell me how you suspend it in mid-air, I mean mid-vacuum,
and I will tell you if you will hear it or not.
Cor van de Water
Systems Architect
Email: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Private: http://www.cvandewater.com
Skype: cor_van_de_water IM: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Tel: +1 408 542 5225 VoIP: +31 20 3987567 FWD# 25925
Fax: +1 408 731 3675 eFAX: +31-87-784-1130
Proxim Wireless Networks eFAX: +1-610-423-5743
Take your network further http://www.proxim.com
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of Adrian DeLeon
Sent: Monday, January 16, 2006 4:01 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: power steering
I'm about to mount an MR2 pump in my Cabriolet, hope it's not too loud...
Funny that MR2 owners don't complain :)
How about mounting the pump inside the power brake vacuum reservoir? Sound
won't travel through a vacuum, but heat won't either - ie: Thermos bottle.
I wonder if the power steering fluid would remove enough heat to keep the
pump itself cool? Are they thermally protected?
Let's see - a water cooled, vacuum mounted power steering pump!
How do motor/contactor characteristics change in a (slight) vacuum? Less
air for contact oxidation or cooling, nearly identical dielectric
strength, ???.
Adrian
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hey David and listers...
When you quote me... from the archives, please give the Date that I posted
it.
In 10 Plus years on this list... some of my ideas have changed...
AKA I do learn stuff along the way.
This Kostov quote is still pretty much the way I think.
Rich Rudman
Manzanita Micro
----- Original Message -----
From: "David Dymaxion" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, January 16, 2006 11:02 AM
Subject: Re: Kostov
> There is some good discussion on this archive:
> <http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/msg03781.html>
>
> I liked this paragraph from Rich Rudman:
>
> Ok here's the way I take the Kostov 11 incher. I have one in the
> Fiero. With the Raptor in it the Comm "sings" at about 800 motor
> amps, and about 5000 rpm. I take this to be insipent arcs. READ NOT
> good but not leathal. This is with 156 volts. Brush wear is un known.
> I havn't taken it apart.
> So with interpoles, stay below 800 amps. Wayland had 336+VDC
> on his and 1400 motor amps. With interpoles you have to stay close to
> the design limit or the timing correct efforts become moot, and
> damage results. What helps at 400 amps hurts at over some given
> point, I say that is 800 amps. My guess would be the motor is good
> and safe at under 800 amps and up to 288 to 312 volts. Note that both
> numbers are about 2x the expected design levels. AND not anymore.
> The improvemnts done by Warp, add mechanical robustness, but
> NOT electrical. The fields and the comm and the interpole setups are
> the same, so you have the same arc limits, but a much higher RPM
> withstand ability. Your brushes will handle more amps, but, may not
> reduce the 800 amp arcing point at all. So... What do you want your
> motor to do??? Spin like heck??? OK, you Want to stuff 2000 amps into
> it, better keep your rpm down.
> There are other issues, but they may not come into play. I
> would love to dyno a Warp motor and see the effective improvments.
> Since they are cheaper that AvDC right out of the box.... I would
> head in this direction for serious racing and abuse.
> --
> Rich Rudman
> Manzanita Micro
> www.manzanitamicro.com
> 1-360-297-7383,Cell 1-360-620-6266
>
> --- Seth Rothenberg <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > I was wondering if anyone has specs on
> > the Kostov motors? (including a good URL? :-)
> > I don't even know if it is AC or DC.
> > (or do they make both?)
> >
> > The links I found in the archive are stale.
> >
> > Thanks
> > Seth
> > (Or did they make such a good motor they
> > put themselves out of business? :-)
>
>
>
>
> __________________________________________________
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>
--- End Message ---
