EV Digest 5782
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Roll call: International price comparison, was: Re: Driving
habbits
by James Massey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: Roll call: International price comparison, was: Re: Driving habbits
by "Evan Tuer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Re: NHRA Electric Dragster record holder, CE-V and Dennis "Killowatt"
Berube
by Dave Cover <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Re: battery trailers
by M Bianchi <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: Potbox problems
by Ken Albright <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Re: article: Tesla Roadster Sells Out First 100 Cars
by "David Roden" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Re: Roll call: International price comparison, was: Re: Driving habbits
by "Roland Wiench" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) Re: article: Tesla Roadster Sells Out First 100 Cars
by Bob Bath <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) New EV board !!!!!
by "ROBERT GOUDREAU" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: Potbox problems
by Bob Bath <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Re: A123 systems pack
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
12) Re: NHRA Electric Dragster record holder, CE-V and Dennis "Killowatt"
Berube
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
13) Re: eagle talon
by "Mike Ellis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Re: Current Eliminator News
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
15) Re: Roll call: International price comparison, was: Re: Driving habbits
by "John Luck Home" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) Re: Current Eliminator News
by "Bob Rice" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Re: I don't need a dc-dc converter
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) A123 pack configuration in KillaCycle?
by "Charles Whalen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Re: I don't need a dc-dc converter
by "Mike Ellis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) Inrush current limiting the IOTA DLS-55
by Eric Poulsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) Shunt circuit calibration
by Eric Poulsen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) Re: Roll call: International price comparison, was: Re: Driving habbits
by "Mike Ellis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) Re: A123 pack configuration in KillaCycle?
by Bill Dube <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
24) Re: battery trailers
by Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
25) Re: I don't need a dc-dc converter, YES ya DO!
by "Bob Rice" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
26) RE: Charles Whalen, WKTEC, and filet mignon
by "Joe Vitek" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
27) Re: eagle talon
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
--- Begin Message ---
At 10:16 AM 22/08/06 +0200, Philippe wrote:
Just to make all <Australians> feel less hard done by, ICE fuel is around
1,42euros/litre = $2,39AU/litre = US$1.82/litre, x 4.2 = $7.64US/Gal
EV fuel is arround 0,10 euros/kwh
If I calculate correctly US$0.128/kWh
I originaly wrote:
> Just to make all the Americans feel less hard done by, ICE fuel is around
> $1.40Aus/litre, 1.4 x 0.7 = US$0.98/litre, x 4.2 = $4.12US/Gal
>
> I don't know how this compares, but EV fuel is 0.186/kWh, around US$0.13
on step 1 (first 500kWh) and then $0.138/kWh, around US$0.097/kWh,
Which got me thinking, that in some places driving an EV is a
cost-comparable exercise to driving an ICE, but in other countries driving
an EV must be more expensive and in other places a lot cheaper, so, typical
prices paid, incentives are things like money saved on the London
congestion tax or registration rebates: Roll call:
What economy/country/state are you in:
How much does petrol cost in US$ per USgallon or litre:
How much does electricity cost US$/kWh:
How much does an Exide Orbital cost:
How much does a Trojan T-105 cost:
What/if any economic incentives and what are they worth:
I'll save all of the responses and post a summary in around a week, unless
anyone else wants to volunteer to do that in the mean time (hint, hint)
Regards
[Technik] James
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
What economy/country/state are you in:
How much does petrol cost in US$ per USgallon or litre:
How much does electricity cost US$/kWh:
How much does an Exide Orbital cost:
How much does a Trojan T-105 cost:
What/if any economic incentives and what are they worth:
OK then,
Scotland, £1/litre = $7.15/US Gallon
Electricity (renewable) = 8p/kWh = $0.15/kWh
Exide Orbital costs £125 = $236
Trojan T105 costs £99 = $187 *
No annual road tax required for EVs (otherwise up to £180/year).
Avoid congestion charge and some free parking in London.
* To be fair, these are US imported batteries and probably not
representative, Trojans are not widely used over here despite the
large Golf industry ;)
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Congratulations Dennis! Hard work pays off. Good luck in October.
--- DM3 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> For the newest members of the list and the rest of us that are interested,
> the following is a summary of this years achievement of the Current
> Eliminator V and its owner, designer, builder and driver Dennis Berube:
>
> This is a historic year (2006) for Division 7 of the National Hot Rod
> Association (NHRA). Since the NHRA's inception in 1951, all of the top
> competitors in it's ranks have run on combustible fuels, this is the first
> time an all-electric vehicle has gone this far in the division finals for
> bracket racing.
>
> Dennis Berube owns an Electric dragster named the "Current Eliminator V"
> (CE-V). He races the CE-V religiously at Speedworld Raceway Park in
> Surprise, Arizona. See it at his site:
> http://www.currenteliminator.net/home/
>
> Dennis and the CE-V hold the WORLD RECORD in the NHRA for the fastest time
> in the quarter mile for an ALL-electric vehicle at 8.801 seconds! The
> CE-V is truly fastest quarter mile EV on the PLANET!!!!
>
> Presently, Dennis is "Bracket Racing" the Current Eliminator V at
> Speedworld. Arizona is in Division 7 of the NHRA and he is the
> current points leader for the "Super Pro" Group. See the latest point
> standing, it is posted at: http://speedworldmotorplex.com/results.htm
>
> The next important Local event at Speedworld in Surprise Az will occur on
> September 16 at 8:00 AM. http://speedworldmotorplex.com/schedule.htm
> This is the final local event of the season for Dennis' class.
>
> As a result of this seasons racing, the top 4 from each track in Division
> 7 (Dennis is guaranteed to be in the top 4) will then go to Bakersfield
> California for the Division 7 "Race of Champions" on October 13 through
> 15. At that race the top 4 from each Division 7 track compete for the
> single winner from Division 7.
> http://www.nhra.com/aboutnhr/etseries.htm#finals
>
> The single winner from Division 7 will then go to Pomona California to
> compete in the overall "Race of Champions" for NHRA Bracket Racing on
> November 9 through 12. http://www.pomonaraceway.com/2006/schedule.html
>
> Dennis has as good a chance as any to make it to Pomona California. He
> is continually keeping his car in top condition and it shows with the
> results he has achived this year. All of us afilliated with Electric
> Vehicles can be proud of how far Dennis has taken the CE-V in the NHRA!
>
> For a more detailed explanation of Dennis Berube, the Current Eliminator V
> and bracket racing, go to the bottom of the following website:
> https://dm3electrics.com/
>
> Background info:
> "Super Pro" is a category of the type of dragster and
> driver skill level, if you look at the standings:
> http://speedworldmotorplex.com/results.htm
> - you will see Super Pro is the highest category of Bracket racers,
> essentially they are some of the best drivers and cars in bracket
> racing.
>
> A "Division" is an area of the country - Division 7 is the southwestern
> division. There is one other electric dragster in Division 7 - Tracy
> Miller, and should be at the competition in Bakersfield CA on October
> 13-15. All the other cars are fueled dragsters. Bakersfield will be the
> race to find out who is the best in Division 7.
> http://www.nhra.com/aboutnhr/etseries.htm#finals
>
> We wish you all the luck possible Dennis!!
> Jimmy
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Lee Hart wrote:
> Why aren't there any 2-wheel trailers with 2 hitches, where both wheels
> caster or steer to turn with the car?
AC Propulsion has an interesting take on the problem ...
http://www.acpropulsion.com/Products/Range_extending_trailers.htm
--
Mike Bianchi
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Lee,
I think I agree with you about the quality of the pot in the PB-6 although I
don't have much experience with them. However, I wonder about having the exact
same failure mode on two pots in short order. It makes me think there may be
some other factor in the system causing the failures - perhaps in the
controller??? Or maybe it's a manufacturing glitch. I have a call in to the
Curtis engineering dept to pose this question...
When I do replace the pot again I would like to go to something more robust
and reliable. I would appreciate more detail on the Allen Bradley pots that
you mention. A quick search turned up a lot of choices. Also, it seems to me
that the arm of the potbox rotates about 45 degrees which is 1/8 of a turn,
but the pots I have removed and installed have a large portion of their turn
that does nothing - at both ends of the range. Is that typical for pots? And
is that why you need a 25k pot rather than a 40k pot?
In my search I came across Hall effect pots that would seem to be even
better because there is no contact at all. Are there problems with these?
Thanks
Ken
Lee Hart wrote:
Ken Albright wrote:
> I have had problems with two potboxes and wonder if this is common
> or if there is something I could be doing to cause it.
The Curtis PB6 is a painfully expensive box with a pitifully cheap
potentiometer inside it. It does not hold up well, because the pot
wasn't built for the rigors of the automotive environment.
You can take it apart and spray it with contact cleaner. It will work
for another year or so, then fail again.
You can replace it with another cheap 20k pot (20k ohms because you
need
0-5k, and it only rotates about 1/4th of a revolution). It will last
another few years, and go bad again.
Or, you can buy a high-quality sealed potentiometer for about $10,
which
will last the life of the car. I like the Allen Bradley type "AB", or
one of its second sources.
--
---------------------------------
Do you Yahoo!?
Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On 21 Aug 2006 at 10:43, Otmar wrote:
> Of
> course as someone said before, $100K isn't that much anymore.
Maybe not in your world! But in mine that's a healthy chunk of change. A
$30k car is a strain for me; $50k is right out, and I can only marvel at
those would would plunk down 6 figures - for a car, for something that gets
used up and depreciates. In my world, something that costs that much ought
to have a basement under it and should keep increasing in value. (But then
a Tesla might fulfill the second requirement - we don't know yet - and if I
bought one I probably >would< have to live in it.)
David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
EV List Assistant Administrator
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--- Begin Message ---
Here is some data from Great Falls, Montana, USA which is known as the
electric city.
The economy is agriculture, wood products, minerals (copper), oil production
and electrical power production.
Gasoline is $3.01 per gallon.
Electricity is $0.10 per KWh - production from five Hydro dams right here in
the city, wind power, coal and gas turbines.
Exide Orbital Red top 1000 A at 100 AH is $98.00 at Sam Club to $166.00 at a
auto parts store.
Trojan T105 ranges from $68.58 to $79.38
Economics incentive is a feel good difference for the cost of energy per
mile which is three times cheaper for me. Otherwise conversion cost for a
full size vehicle far exceeds the cost of my ICE, but the EV has outlast the
ICE by 20 years.
There is no road tax. For a classic vehicle, you can purchase a annual
license fee, or a one time permanent license for life which I did for
$125.00
Roland
----- Original Message -----
From: "James Massey" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2006 4:55 AM
Subject: Roll call: International price comparison, was: Re: Driving habbits
> At 10:16 AM 22/08/06 +0200, Philippe wrote:
> >Just to make all <Australians> feel less hard done by, ICE fuel is around
> >1,42euros/litre = $2,39AU/litre = US$1.82/litre, x 4.2 = $7.64US/Gal
> >
> >EV fuel is arround 0,10 euros/kwh
> If I calculate correctly US$0.128/kWh
>
> I originaly wrote:
> > > Just to make all the Americans feel less hard done by, ICE fuel is
> > > around
> > > $1.40Aus/litre, 1.4 x 0.7 = US$0.98/litre, x 4.2 = $4.12US/Gal
> > >
> > > I don't know how this compares, but EV fuel is 0.186/kWh, around
> > > US$0.13
> >on step 1 (first 500kWh) and then $0.138/kWh, around US$0.097/kWh,
>
> Which got me thinking, that in some places driving an EV is a
> cost-comparable exercise to driving an ICE, but in other countries driving
> an EV must be more expensive and in other places a lot cheaper, so,
> typical
> prices paid, incentives are things like money saved on the London
> congestion tax or registration rebates: Roll call:
>
> What economy/country/state are you in:
> How much does petrol cost in US$ per USgallon or litre:
> How much does electricity cost US$/kWh:
> How much does an Exide Orbital cost:
> How much does a Trojan T-105 cost:
> What/if any economic incentives and what are they worth:
>
> I'll save all of the responses and post a summary in around a week, unless
> anyone else wants to volunteer to do that in the mean time (hint, hint)
>
> Regards
>
> [Technik] James
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Let alone, the cost of insuring such a vehicle...
--- David Roden <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On 21 Aug 2006 at 10:43, Otmar wrote:
>
> > Of
> > course as someone said before, $100K isn't that
> much anymore.
>
> Maybe not in your world! But in mine that's a
> healthy chunk of change. A
> $30k car is a strain for me; $50k is right out, and
> I can only marvel at
> those would would plunk down 6 figures - for a car,
> for something that gets
> used up and depreciates. In my world, something
> that costs that much ought
> to have a basement under it and should keep
> increasing in value. (But then
> a Tesla might fulfill the second requirement - we
> don't know yet - and if I
> bought one I probably >would< have to live in it.)
>
>
> David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
> EV List Assistant Administrator
>
> = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
> = = = = = = =
> Want to unsubscribe, stop the EV list mail while
> you're on vacation,
> or switch to digest mode? See how:
> http://www.evdl.org/help/
> = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
> = = = = = = =
> Note: mail sent to "evpost" or "etpost" addresses
> will not reach me.
> To send a private message, please obtain my email
> address from
> the webpage http://www.evdl.org/help/ - the former
> contact address
> ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) will soon disappear.
> = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
> = = = = = = =
>
>
Converting a gen. 5 Honda Civic? My $20 video/DVD
has my '92 sedan, as well as a del Sol and hatch too!
Learn more at:
www.budget.net/~bbath/CivicWithACord.html
____
__/__|__\ __
=D-------/ - - \
'O'-----'O'-'
Would you still drive your car if the tailpipe came out of the steering wheel?
Are you saving any gas for your kids?
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Please,come and chat with us about your passion for EVs.
http://electricperformance.com/forum/index.php
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
This is timely, as I'm likely swapping out the
inductive throttle on my DCP600 Raptor for potbox.
a) Wife doesn't like the force of the return spring
(hurts her back...?!)
b) Interferes with radio reception.
Tried Jameco for the model you list, but no dice.
Should I try Digi-Key? Other? Does it come with the
mount & swing arm like the PB-6?
Thanks,
--- Ken Albright <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Lee,
>
> I think I agree with you about the quality of the
> pot in the PB-6 although I don't have much
> experience with them. However, I wonder about
> having the exact same failure mode on two pots in
> short order. It makes me think there may be some
> other factor in the system causing the failures -
> perhaps in the controller??? Or maybe it's a
> manufacturing glitch. I have a call in to the
> Curtis engineering dept to pose this question...
>
> When I do replace the pot again I would like to go
> to something more robust and reliable. I would
> appreciate more detail on the Allen Bradley pots
> that you mention. A quick search turned up a lot of
> choices. Also, it seems to me that the arm of the
> potbox rotates about 45 degrees which is 1/8 of a
> turn, but the pots I have removed and installed
> have a large portion of their turn that does nothing
> - at both ends of the range. Is that typical for
> pots? And is that why you need a 25k pot rather
> than a 40k pot?
>
> In my search I came across Hall effect pots that
> would seem to be even better because there is no
> contact at all. Are there problems with these?
>
> Thanks
>
> Ken
>
>
> Lee Hart wrote:
>
> Ken Albright wrote:
> > I have had problems with two potboxes and wonder
> if this is common
> > or if there is something I could be doing to cause
> it.
>
> The Curtis PB6 is a painfully expensive box with a
> pitifully cheap
> potentiometer inside it. It does not hold up well,
> because the pot
> wasn't built for the rigors of the automotive
> environment.
>
> You can take it apart and spray it with contact
> cleaner. It will work
> for another year or so, then fail again.
>
> You can replace it with another cheap 20k pot (20k
> ohms because you
> need
> 0-5k, and it only rotates about 1/4th of a
> revolution). It will last
> another few years, and go bad again.
>
> Or, you can buy a high-quality sealed potentiometer
> for about $10,
> which
> will last the life of the car. I like the Allen
> Bradley type "AB", or
> one of its second sources.
> --
>
>
> ---------------------------------
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail.
>
>
Converting a gen. 5 Honda Civic? My $20 video/DVD
has my '92 sedan, as well as a del Sol and hatch too!
Learn more at:
www.budget.net/~bbath/CivicWithACord.html
____
__/__|__\ __
=D-------/ - - \
'O'-----'O'-'
Would you still drive your car if the tailpipe came out of the steering wheel?
Are you saving any gas for your kids?
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
You have to remember that the 28Ah is all available under any load, no Peukerts
effect like Lead Acid. Even when my 100 Ah Lead acid batts were new I was lucky
to get 45Ah out of them on a run. I use about 20Ah on my usual 20km commute so
it no problem for now. It can be scaled up later and then I will have to install
a Zilla for a bit more fun ;-)
Rod
> per kwh, Kokam is less expensive, lighter, smaller !
>
> if rule book is safety then i suppose A123 and other phosphate based
lithium
> cells are the way to go.
>
> just a suggestion: 46S12P is 147V28Ah and so not enough for a car, range
> will be just the corner...
>
I had exactly the same thought - ~$1500/kwh for a pack that will get
you 12-20miles? A123s peak close to 100C, so should be feeding Zillas,
not a Cursit! Kokams peak from 2C to 10C, depending on the model and
cost less than half as much.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
In a message dated 8/21/06 8:52:38 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
<< Subj: NHRA Electric Dragster record holder, CE-V and Dennis
"Killowatt" Berube
Date: 8/21/06 8:52:38 PM Pacific Daylight Time
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (DM3)
Sender: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-to: [email protected]
To: [email protected]
For the newest members of the list and the rest of us that are interested,
the following is a summary of this years achievement of the Current
Eliminator V and its owner, designer, builder and driver Dennis Berube:
This is a historic year (2006) for Division 7 of the National Hot Rod
Association (NHRA). Since the NHRA's inception in 1951, all of the top
competitors in it's ranks have run on combustible fuels, this is the first
time an all-electric vehicle has gone this far in the division finals for
bracket racing.
Dennis Berube owns an Electric dragster named the "Current Eliminator V"
(CE-V). He races the CE-V religiously at Speedworld Raceway Park in
Surprise, Arizona. See it at his site:
http://www.currenteliminator.net/home/
Dennis and the CE-V hold the WORLD RECORD in the NHRA for the fastest time
in the quarter mile for an ALL-electric vehicle at 8.801 seconds! The
CE-V is truly fastest quarter mile EV on the PLANET!!!!
Presently, Dennis is "Bracket Racing" the Current Eliminator V at
Speedworld. Arizona is in Division 7 of the NHRA and he is the
current points leader for the "Super Pro" Group. See the latest point
standing, it is posted at: http://speedworldmotorplex.com/results.htm
The next important Local event at Speedworld in Surprise Az will occur on
September 16 at 8:00 AM. http://speedworldmotorplex.com/schedule.htm
This is the final local event of the season for Dennis' class.
*** Just for the record the final race on the 16th has been replaced by a
race on the 23rd of sept.I only need to go 1 round to capture the track
championship.
As a result of this seasons racing, the top 4 from each track in Division
7 (Dennis is guaranteed to be in the top 4) will then go to Bakersfield
California for the Division 7 "Race of Champions" on October 13 through
15. At that race the top 4 from each Division 7 track compete for the
single winner from Division 7.
http://www.nhra.com/aboutnhr/etseries.htm#finals
The single winner from Division 7 will then go to Pomona California to
compete in the overall "Race of Champions" for NHRA Bracket Racing on
November 9 through 12. http://www.pomonaraceway.com/2006/schedule.html
Dennis has as good a chance as any to make it to Pomona California. He
is continually keeping his car in top condition and it shows with the
results he has achived this year. All of us afilliated with Electric
Vehicles can be proud of how far Dennis has taken the CE-V in the NHRA!
For a more detailed explanation of Dennis Berube, the Current Eliminator V
and bracket racing, go to the bottom of the following website:
https://dm3electrics.com/
Background info:
"Super Pro" is a category of the type of dragster and
driver skill level, if you look at the standings:
http://speedworldmotorplex.com/results.htm
- you will see Super Pro is the highest category of Bracket racers,
essentially they are some of the best drivers and cars in bracket
racing.
A "Division" is an area of the country - Division 7 is the southwestern
division. There is one other electric dragster in Division 7 - Tracy
Miller, and should be at the competition in Bakersfield CA on October
13-15. All the other cars are fueled dragsters. Bakersfield will be the
race to find out who is the best in Division 7.
http://www.nhra.com/aboutnhr/etseries.htm#finals
We wish you all the luck possible Dennis!!
Jimmy >>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I can't remember, but weren't most Talon's 4WD? I've heard that makes
for an inefficient EV.
-Mike
On 8/20/06, [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Has anyone converted an eagle talon to an ev? Is this vehicle to heave for
such a conversion?
--
In Friendship, Ted
//ted.sanders.home.comcast.net
//ffni.home.comcast.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Sept.8 PBS will be filming/doing an article on the CE at Speedworld at the
ADRA points race.The CE will Not be just in the TEST an TUNE lane but will
actually be racing the ice dragsters for points and $.Total winings this year
for CE just over $3800.racing the ices.with the big buck races yet to come.
Dennis Berube
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
England:-
95 pence / litre = $1.72 / litre or $6.51 / US Gallon
Electricity:- Peak rate 15 Cents/KWh, Low rate 6.5 Cents / KWh
No Road tax payable - average car pays $220 per yr
All at $1.81 = £1
John
www.bedfordev.flyer.co.uk
>
What economy/country/state are you in:
How much does petrol cost in US$ per USgallon or litre:
How much does electricity cost US$/kWh:
How much does an Exide Orbital cost:
How much does a Trojan T-105 cost:
What/if any economic incentives and what are they worth:
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi Dennis;
Way to go! Will be lookin' for the PBS stuff, at last TV worth
watching.Gees! You can almost make a living racing? If you don't hafta eat,
or need a place to live<g>!? Be watching for te Big Bux stuff.
Bob
----- Original Message -----
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2006 11:27 AM
Subject: Re: Current Eliminator News
> On Sept.8 PBS will be filming/doing an article on the CE at Speedworld at
the
> ADRA points race.The CE will Not be just in the TEST an TUNE lane but will
> actually be racing the ice dragsters for points and $.Total winings this
year
> for CE just over $3800.racing the ices.with the big buck races yet to
come.
> Dennis Berube
>
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--- Begin Message ---
I have the 120vac 55 amp IOTA. These devices are sold as battery chargers.
They will work as float or full voltage chargers. All I know is that when you
hook them up to DC they work just as if they were on AC power. Ignore the
ground wire and hook the neutral & hot to any DC source from 96vdc to 144vdc.
They brown out at 90vdc & have an upper range of 180vdc. Above this charge
rate it's probably a good idea to get the 240vdc version. It would probably
work up to 180vdc systems if you put in a relay so it doesn't see the full
charging voltage. If you want to top off your 12v system while charging your
pack you can still use the 120v plug into the wall. I made a 120 ac to pack
adapter. Just don't plug anything else into it or your get a big smoke show.
Lawrence Rhodes.....
----- Original Message -----
From: Bruce Weisenberger
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2006 6:20 AM
Subject: Re: I don't need a dc-dc converter
Could you please share the model number of your IOTA- They make lots of them
with incomplete specification as to wheither they are DC to DC or AC to DC or
DC to AC. Thanks for info
Lawrence Rhodes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
I am using an IOTA in my Aspire. It has two settings 13.8 & 14.4. It puts
as much as 55 amps. I leave it on the low float setting with a 17ah BB
battery and I haven't noticed any problems day or night, rain or shine.
Having a powerful dc/dc makes it so you don't need much of a battery. If
you go flooded/AGM no dc/dc you have a battery as big as your traction
battery and that is a waste of space and weight. The IOTA is good up to
144vdc. The 220v version should run with the HV Zillas. Lawrence
Rhodes.....
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Do you Yahoo!?
Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail.
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--- Begin Message ---
A question for Bill Dube' or Stephen Ciciora if either of you guys got your
ears on.
Is the pack of 800 A123 M1 26650 cells (3.3V, 2.3Ah each) in the KillaCycle
configured as:
a) 8 parallel strings each having 100 in series
or
b) a series of 100 blocks each having 8 in parallel?
Thanks,
Charles Whalen
Delray Beach, FL
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--- Begin Message ---
3. Unequal Pack Draw. The battery used for acc runs down faster and
gets unequal. Is this really a big deal, don't the batteries equalize
upon charging anyway?
I'm confused now. I thought most conversions had a separate 12V
battery from the pack for the accessories.
-Mike
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--- Begin Message ---
I have an IOTA DLS-55 which I intend to use as a DC/DC. I've noticed
that when I plug it in (to AC), there's a healthy spark because of (I
assume) inrush current to charge the capacitors.
Three questions:
1) Would a inrush thermistor (like this:
http://www.ametherm.com/Bigamp_datasheet.htm) work to suppress this?
2) I don't see any reason you can't use the thermistor with DC -- right?
3) Why didn't IOTA limit the inrush better?
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--- Begin Message ---
If someone were crazy enough to make their own shunt amplifier/isolation
circuit (please, no "Why would you want to do that?" questions), how
would one go about putting a calibrated current through the shunt itself
in order to test the circuit? Low amps (< 10 ) are relatively easy, but
how do I check it at 100 amps? Oh, and relatively cheaply?
Best answer I can come up with is to put _another_ shunt in series with
a known good (analog) meter, and use a good CV/CC power supply.
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--- Begin Message ---
Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada
Gas: CAN$1.14/litre = US$3.86/USGallon
Residential Electricity = CAN5.654¢/KWH = US5.07¢/KWH
Battery costs comparable to those in the US.
No economic incentives.
On 8/22/06, James Massey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
At 10:16 AM 22/08/06 +0200, Philippe wrote:
>Just to make all <Australians> feel less hard done by, ICE fuel is around
>1,42euros/litre = $2,39AU/litre = US$1.82/litre, x 4.2 = $7.64US/Gal
>
>EV fuel is arround 0,10 euros/kwh
If I calculate correctly US$0.128/kWh
I originaly wrote:
> > Just to make all the Americans feel less hard done by, ICE fuel is around
> > $1.40Aus/litre, 1.4 x 0.7 = US$0.98/litre, x 4.2 = $4.12US/Gal
> >
> > I don't know how this compares, but EV fuel is 0.186/kWh, around US$0.13
>on step 1 (first 500kWh) and then $0.138/kWh, around US$0.097/kWh,
Which got me thinking, that in some places driving an EV is a
cost-comparable exercise to driving an ICE, but in other countries driving
an EV must be more expensive and in other places a lot cheaper, so, typical
prices paid, incentives are things like money saved on the London
congestion tax or registration rebates: Roll call:
What economy/country/state are you in:
How much does petrol cost in US$ per USgallon or litre:
How much does electricity cost US$/kWh:
How much does an Exide Orbital cost:
How much does a Trojan T-105 cost:
What/if any economic incentives and what are they worth:
I'll save all of the responses and post a summary in around a week, unless
anyone else wants to volunteer to do that in the mean time (hint, hint)
Regards
[Technik] James
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I'm in Tampa, but I have my e-mail hooked up.
The main pack is indeed 8 parallel by 100 series. They are 3.4 volts
each as we leave the pits.
We added 40 more cells recently; 8 parallel, 10 series.
The only sensible way to arrange a parallel pack is to lick the cells
in parallel at the lowest level that is practical. In this case, we
parallel at the cell level.
Bill Dube'
At 09:22 AM 8/22/2006, you wrote:
A question for Bill Dube' or Stephen Ciciora if either of you guys got your
ears on.
Is the pack of 800 A123 M1 26650 cells (3.3V, 2.3Ah each) in the KillaCycle
configured as:
a) 8 parallel strings each having 100 in series
or
b) a series of 100 blocks each having 8 in parallel?
Thanks,
Charles Whalen
Delray Beach, FL
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
If I were to do it, I'd just allow the wheels to scrub.
How often you use the trailer and when you do, how often scrubbing
is causing real problem? I'm pretty sure even with that, the
tires on the trailer will outlast vehicle's.
Victor
Lee Hart wrote:
From: Lee Hart
Why aren't there any 2-wheel trailers with 2 hitches, where both
wheels caster or steer to turn with the car?
steve clunn wrote:
The problem with this is that you then have a lot of weight that
will "wag" the tail of the car much worse...
That makes sense. But I was assuming a trailer that is fairly light
compared to the weight of the tow vehicle. Like a 500 lbs trailer on a
2500 lbs car, etc.
I'm sure you're right that you would not want a heavy trailer with
castered wheels!
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
----- Original Message -----
From: "Mike Ellis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[email protected]>
Sent: Tuesday, August 22, 2006 11:54 AM
Subject: Re: I don't need a dc-dc converter
> > 3. Unequal Pack Draw. The battery used for acc runs down faster and
> > gets unequal. Is this really a big deal, don't the batteries equalize
> > upon charging anyway?
>
> I'm confused now. I thought most conversions had a separate 12V
> battery from the pack for the accessories.
>
> -Mike
>
Hi Mike an' EVerybody;
Just about ALL conversions carry a separate 12 volt battery, STILL where
it lived when the car was a gas, in it's former life. As a few other guyz
have commented; You want the car's origional 12 volt system LEFT ALONE and
isolated from the hy power DC system YOU put in. Don't mess with Mother
Nature and the origional manufacturer of the car! THEY went to all the
trouble to wire it up and make it work!! I mean lights, signals, brake
applied lights, horn, EVen the crappy radio it came with. But if it, the
radio, comes with a cassette or DVD player, you're golden. Forgetabout a
Radio in an EV, With the squeel of the controller, hash from your brushes,
on and on. So if you want tunes, ya need a player. OK a Boom Box in the back
seat will do in a pinch! Might EVen work on Radio as it isn't commected to
thre cars electricals!??I ran a separate Sears charger on my 12 volt, for
years, it's doable. Worked OK for daylight driving. It was those muggy rainy
nites that I used the defroster, wipers and seems like EVerything else,
loadwise ,in the car, the 12 volt would poo out 10 miles from home!So you
can do with out if your driving is mostly day stuff? You're call. After all
EV's are custom cars anyhow, built to do a spicific job.I called it Nice
Upgrades when I went to my Rapture controller from a home brew contacter,
and a DC to dc. Hook it up(Sevcon) and forgetabout it.And later, a PFC-30,
from a Bad Boy and long ' stench chord!
As for the unequell pack draw of " Tapping the Pack" Don't do it! it
slowlywears down the two 6 volt batteries that have been robbed of a little
of their power.You would be surprised at how many AMPS the 12 volt load is!
But it's OK in a pinch, if youre 12 volt system's shit the bed, and you want
to get home, lights and dignity intact. Before I took J. Wayland's advise,
and got a DC to dc, in my old contacter controller daze when the 12 volt got
to tired to pull in the contacters, like having to turn off the headlites to
get the line switch to pull in, then turning the lights back on. When it got
TOO outragious, like NO lites, out came the two clip leads ,to tap 12 volts
off the traction pack, to get home.It's part of the home built EV learning
curve<g>!
my two cells worth.
Bob
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
> Steve and I had kind of come up with some "charging ettiquette" rules
>>snip<<
> So Steve and Joe have completely turned this "charging ettiquette" idea on
> its head, upside down, and have turned the visiting charging thing into what
> basically amounts to a 5-star resort experience, complete with filet mignon,
> free loaner EVs, jazz band entertainment, free tutorials, the works!
Etiquette? Schmetiquette... :) I do think it is a good idea though. You never
know who you
are gonna run into. There are some real weirdos out there... ;)
> now starting to wonder if maybe there isn't some sort of business
> opportunity in this thing for them.
I am all about business opportunities. :D If there comes a day when there is a
lot of
charging going on and I am able to make a real business out of it, I would be
into that. I
just like people and learning new things!
> Joe Vitek is a very talented and experienced EE who formerly worked in
> Silicon Valley and now works as an EE on the hi-tech Space Coast of Florida.
Awww, shucks, <kicks the dirt>, 'tain't nuthin'... :)
> With my being completely ignorant of California, its culture, and geography,
> Joe pulled out a detailed road map of the Silicon Valley area and gave me
> the lay of the land, showed me where everything is, from Cisco to Tesla
> Motors in San Carlos.
When I lived there in '97/'98, that's when I first got interested in EVs. In
fact, that is
when I first got on this list. I have been on it ever since, but I have
generally lurked
for all these years. I wanted to build a high current/high voltage DC motor
controller
back then. I went and talked to International Rectifier (right down the street
from my
apartment) about devices and topologies, but obviously, I never got any further
than that.
I regret not pursuing that...
Also, thanks, Charles, for all the very nice words. I am getting a little
embarrassed
now... ;)
> But what was even more amazing is that Joe and I found out that we have both
> had almost the exact same, identical thoughts for 5 years now of what our
> dream EV project would be, right down to the exact same car, the exact same
> drivetrain, everything.
I was amazed at that too. I had been looking at that kit since '97 and Al's AC
controller
setup. The fact that you had practically the same idea was a little déjà
vu-ish. I think
it will make a ripping badass roadster.
> And Joe has got a nice big triple/quad bay shop, very well equipped
> with an impressive array of tools. Everything needed right there to start a
> hi-tech conversion business, and Joe's certainly got the knowledge, skills,
> and experience to do so.
I am a car freak for all types of autos and EVs are at the top of my list when
I get done
with my current project and the wife's '54 Ford. My shop is expanding here in
the near
future with another 900 sq.ft. building (25'x36') that will be climate
controlled and used
for conversions, restorations, mods, fabrication, etc. Also, a very good friend
of mine
owns a fully equipped machine shop where he can fab anything from a print. He
tells me
that whenever I am ready, just buy materials and I can make anything I want
there.
> By the way, Joe, thanks for the kind words you spoke about me in your
> previous post a week ago with all that glowing praise, but you're creating
> expectations that I will certainly never be able to live up to in person
Don't listen to him, Charles is a sharp d00d. Take my word for it. ;)
> when they come down here for our next big Battery
> Beach Burnout NEDRA race in late January together with the 6th EVer All
> Chapters EAA Conference the same weekend.
Now, that, I want to be at. It would be great if, as you say, all the west coast
luminaries were down here in January.
> Sorry to hear about your grandpa, Joe; hope he gets better and hangs on to
> some good quality of life for some more years.
It turns out that yesterday and today he was chipper and seemingly more happy
than he had
been in a while (he is 90). My mom called me and said that all he can talk
about is my
next visit. I had asked him if it would be alright if I started taking notes on
his
upbringing and his life experiences that happened long before my mom was born
and after he
had kids etc. and he seems to really like the idea. He was a huge positive
influence on me
as I grew up and want to make sure that he knows how much I appreciate him.
--
joe vitek
Cocoa, Florida
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--- Begin Message ---
It is a front wheel drive but it weighs in at almost 3000lbs curb weight.
Since I would like to get a range of almost 75 miles I think that I will need
to try to stay under 2000lbs curb weight.
--
In Friendship, Ted
//ted.sanders.home.comcast.net
//ffni.home.comcast.net
-------------- Original message ----------------------
From: "Mike Ellis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> I can't remember, but weren't most Talon's 4WD? I've heard that makes
> for an inefficient EV.
>
> -Mike
>
> On 8/20/06, [EMAIL PROTECTED] <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > Has anyone converted an eagle talon to an ev? Is this vehicle to heave for
> such a conversion?
> >
> > --
> > In Friendship, Ted
> > //ted.sanders.home.comcast.net
> > //ffni.home.comcast.net
> >
> >
>
--- End Message ---
