EV Digest 6398
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: EVLN(Mike Harvey's Cabby 80mi range conversion)
by Electro Automotive <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) RE: wiring size
by "Dale Ulan" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Re: Crimping Tool Choice
by Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Re: wiring size
by Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: Question about 20 gauge fusible link, what is the blow
current in amps?
by James Massey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Re: Speaking of Hybrids
by Jack Murray <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Re: wiring size back to the question...
by "Tim Gamber" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) soneil chargers
by "Tim Gamber" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) electric motor with a CVT
by "Tim Gamber" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: wiring size
by "Ev Performance (Robert Chew)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Re: wiring size
by "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Just don't call it a smart EV
by Lock Hughes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Re: Tell your friends to join us: Speak out on Global Warming!] Forwarded
without recommentation.
by "Joseph H. Strubhar" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Re: Top two wheeled ev you can buy right now
by "Kip C. Anderson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) Re: wiring size
by "Peter VanDerWal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) Re: electric motor with a CVT
by "Peter VanDerWal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Re: wiring size back to the question...
by "Peter VanDerWal" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) Personal Electric Transport
by "jmygann" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Re: Tell your friends to join us: Speak out on Global Warming!] Forwarded
without recommentation.
by "jmygann" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) Re: Speaking of Hybrids
by thomas ward <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) Re: Tell your friends to join us: Speak out on Global Warming!] Forwarded
without recommentation.
by "David Roden" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) Re: wiring size back to the question...
by Danny Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) Re: Personal Electric Transport
by nikki <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
Hey! One of our Voltsrabbit Kits got some good ink!
Shari Prange
Electro Automotive POB 1113 Felton CA 95018-1113 Telephone 831-429-1989
http://www.electroauto.com [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Electric Car Conversion Kits * Components * Books * Videos * Since 1979
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Voltage drop across a wire is only related to the current and the history of
the applied current across the wire, not to the voltage applied to the
voltage across the load IF THE CURRENT REMAINS THE SAME. The history of the
current affects the wire resistance because copper has a temperature
coefficient - the wire's resistance will tend to go up as it heats up,
producing more heat....
It does not matter if you have a 100V battery pack or a 200V battery pack.
If you are taking 100A from the battery, you get the same wiring voltage
drop either way across the wire between the load (motor controller) and the
battery. This is somewhat hypothetical because in a commute, you tend to use
a relatively constant amount of power to drive the same way. This means that
you will tend to take less current at a higher battery voltage in a
real-world application.
Things get a bit more complicated with a current-limiting controller. If you
have a current limiting controller, the wiring voltage drops change with
input voltage because the controller reduces voltage and increases current
(any AC or DC motor controller is essentially a buck-type switching power
supply - AC drives have three of them in one box, DC drives have just one).
In which case, increasing the battery voltage to 200V will reduce the
battery current and the voltage drops in the battery-to-controller wiring if
the motor load remains constant. The controller-to-motor wiring voltage
drops will remain identical because the motor current remains identical for
the same motor output power.
This is not strictly correct, actually. Efficiency losses in the controller
(due to the difference between MOSFET Rds(on) or IGBT on-voltage vs. diode
voltage drop) skew these results somewhat. A controller is not an ohm's law
device - rather, it is a constant-power device. It offers a negative
resistance characteristic to the battery - a lower battery voltage results
in more current when it is in current limiting mode (which is essentially
all of the time on an AC drive).
This means that if you use bigger wire (with lower resistance) in the
battery feed to a controller, the current will drop more than you would
initially think because the available voltage at the controller is higher.
That makes the voltage higher than ohm's law would have you initially
believe.
-Dale
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--- Begin Message ---
Shari,
I'd like to comment on the subject, IMHO Bill is 100% right on this.
It's not amount of pressure; hammer crimp sure can provide you more
(in theory, with half-ton hammer if you wish) than any jaw-style one.
It's consistency and assurance. Yes, there is nothing intrinsically
wrong with hammer crimper, there is *always* something intrinsically
wrong with its operator. Little tired, little off impact angle, little
distraction, little harder swing of a hammer, etc.
Hex or ratchet tool just takes these human induced variables away,
that's the *value of the tool* so *anyone* can make good uniform
crimps and doesn't have to be as skillful and as consistent as a robot.
If you (and others) have no problems with hammer crimps, good for you.
This does not change the fact above: no one can exactly duplicate
*your* [excellent] crimp with hammer crimper, but perhaps anyone can do
near excellent job with
ratchet one - it simply won't let you make bad crimp. That's I think
is whole point of Bill's response. Jaw crimper is the best for average
person to make very good crimp. Hammer one is perhaps best for you and
others who feel confident, are very experienced and skillful enough, so
there is no risk of hiccup.
Victor
Electro Automotive wrote:
At 01:49 PM 2/7/2007, you wrote:
However, we have sold them to Boeing, so I guess they must be ok.
They most certainly would not be using them for an airplane.
The FAA would have their head on a pike for using a hammer crimper.
Probably for a fork lift or a car battery.
I didn't ask what they were using them for. But apparently the tool
met their standards.
Shari Prange
The FAA requires that the crimp operation be done with a tool
that delivers the same (and the correct) displacement every time it is
operated. Ratchet type crimpers that will not retract until fully
actuated are the norm for aircraft use.
A hammer crimper would be unable to meet any "standard"
because the resultant crimp quality is highly variable. Even the same
operator would have varying results. Aside from 100% pull testing and
resistance testing, there would be no way to assure that each
connection was done with consistent quality.
If you hammer too hard or too much, you will cut the strands
of the cable, resulting in a poor connection.
Never seen this happen.
If you hammer too light or too little, you will not deform the crimp
enough to swage tightly against the cable, causing a poor connection.
That's why there's calibrations on the tool.
If it is OK to have an occasional bad connection that you will
correct when it lets go or heats up, then I guess a hammer crimper
will work for you. If, however, you want some degree of consistency
and quality control in your connections, you cannot use a hammer crimper.
Geez, Bill! I don't need my car to be FAA certified.
Ok, let's say that Boeing can probably buy any kind of crimper they
want, including for their bloody forklifts. And let's also assume that,
as an aircraft company, they generally have a corporate culture of NOT
buying shoddy tools. (At least, I certainly hope they do!). So,
apparently the hammer crimper met THEIR PURCHASING STANDARDS for
whatever the hell they were using it for. If it was for forklifts, or
tugs, or whatever, then it MAY have even been a HIGHER current
application than our poor little cars.
My point is, if it's good enough for Boeing, it's good enough for me.
To quote one hgih school instructor customer of ours: "We gave the
cables and lugs and crimper and hammer to the special ed kids, and let
'em have at it. They had a great time, and we didn't lose a single
connection in the race."
The hammer crimpers are practically idiot-proof. Which is not to say
the bolt-cutter style aren't also excellent. Also great for developing
your pecs.
Shari Prange
Electro Automotive POB 1113 Felton CA 95018-1113 Telephone 831-429-1989
http://www.electroauto.com [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Electric Car Conversion Kits * Components * Books * Videos * Since 1979
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Peter VanDerWal wrote:
Again this changes nothing, the voltage drop is not related to our pack
voltage, only the current.
But this current depends on the voltage for given power EV, this is I
guess is the source of confusion.
To simplify this:
Voltage drop on the wire (measured between both ends of the same wire)
depends on the current through this wire and it's resistance.
It has nothing to do with the voltage *between* two wires (+ and -) of
the battery supplying your system.
Don't confuse voltage [drop] on a wire and voltage [battery] between two
wires. (This clarification of course is not aimed to you Peter).
Victor
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
At 01:23 PM 8/02/07 -0800, you wrote:
Hi all,
I have a question about 20 gauge fusible links. Can't find much
information about them,
and not many places to buy them by googling! Anyways, what is the current
that will
trip the fusible link in amps, for say, a 20 gauge fusible link? I'm
guessing 15 amps or so?
- Tony
G'day Tony
I assume you are after a fusible link for 12 volt or 24 volt? It is ummm...
not recommended... over that voltage as you risk plasma events in the event
of a short.
Keep it safe.
Regards
James.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I uploaded some pictures of the aspire hybrid.
This is the rear wheel converted to a driven wheel using FWD hub strut
and half-shaft. I put a bearing and made an aluminum support for it, and
put in a keyway to hold a QD bushing.
http://www.nimblemotorsports.com/drivenwheel.jpg
Here is the chain drive from the 8" ADC motor.
http://www.nimblemotorsports.com/motorchain.jpg
I machined up the nylon drive sprocket and installed it.
It doesn't make as much noise as the steel sprocket, but the chain drive
still makes more noise than I would like.
Might be OK once a cover is made so the noise doesn't echo around inside
the car.
Jack
David Hrivnak wrote:
Interesting, please keep us posted!
-----Original Message-----
From: Jack Murray [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Sunday, February 04, 2007 10:26 PM
To: David Hrivnak
Subject: Re: Speaking of Hybrids
This car (95 Ford Aspire) is FWD (front wheel drive), so there is no
driveshaft that goes to the back wheels. The front of the car remains
stock with its 1.3L engine.
I have grafted into the rear suspension on one side of the car a FWD hub
that now drives the wheel using a half shaft, with a pulley setup
connected to the half-shaft. I'll have some pictures of it soon.
Jack
David Hrivnak wrote:
Have you thought about putting the electric motor in line with a
shortened driveshaft? I too am in the process of building such a
vehicle and could not come up with a good belt or chain driven
alternative. So I am trying in-line and will vary the power between
the
ICE and electric motor.
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On
Behalf Of Jack Murray
Sent: Saturday, February 03, 2007 8:38 PM
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: Speaking of Hybrids
I think a good way to do a plug-in hybrid is to take a FWD car, and
add
an electric motor to drive the rear wheels.
Then you can use the electric motor around town, and use the gas motor
on the freeway.
I've been building just such a car, I've converted one rear wheel into
a
driven wheel powered by an electric motor.
However, I'm having trouble and could use some suggestions. I
originally used a 1" wide belt drive to power the wheel, but the belt
would
slip when enough torque was applied to move the car.
So I've changed it to use a chain drive. The problem now is the chain
makes a huge amount of noise! more noise than ICE does.
Has anyone else done a chain or belt drive setup? Are there chain
drives that are not so noisy? Or belts that can handle a lot of
torque.
A 3" wide belt?
I'm considering trying the snowmobile CVT setup, but its a little
expensive for this project.
Thanks,
Jack
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
So anyway back to the question... If if i had the option of choosing 1/0 or
2/0 in a motorcycle would the 2/0 make my motorcycle more efficent because
of less resistance? Or would the weight and cost savings (which are minimal)
of 1/0 be worth it? what if i put huge 4/0 in it would that make it even
more efficent?
From: Victor Tikhonov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: Re: wiring size
Date: Thu, 08 Feb 2007 18:21:45 -0800
Peter VanDerWal wrote:
Again this changes nothing, the voltage drop is not related to our pack
voltage, only the current.
But this current depends on the voltage for given power EV, this is I guess
is the source of confusion.
To simplify this:
Voltage drop on the wire (measured between both ends of the same wire)
depends on the current through this wire and it's resistance.
It has nothing to do with the voltage *between* two wires (+ and -) of the
battery supplying your system.
Don't confuse voltage [drop] on a wire and voltage [battery] between two
wires. (This clarification of course is not aimed to you Peter).
Victor
_________________________________________________________________
Buy what you want when you want it on Sympatico / MSN Shopping
http://shopping.sympatico.msn.ca/content/shp/?ctId=2,ptnrid=176,ptnrdata=081805
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
i recently saw a 36 volt 4.5 amp charger on the internet and it said that
you could leave it hooked up indefinetly and it would not overcharge your
batteries. Would this also be true for AGMs because thats what i was
thinking of usng it for. Do i still need regulators, or could i do without?
_________________________________________________________________
Your Space. Your Friends. Your Stories. Share your world with Windows Live
Spaces. http://discoverspaces.live.com/?loc=en-CA
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--- Begin Message ---
If i was to make a electric motorcycle with a CVT what would i want it to
do. Would i want it to let the motor get to full speed and then change the
gear ratio or somewhere in between? Can you even adjust a cvt to shit at
different rpms? Are most of them mechanical or computerized? can you program
or adjust them?
_________________________________________________________________
http://local.live.com/default.aspx?v=2&cp=43.658648~-79.383962&style=r&lvl=15&tilt=-90&dir=0&alt=-1000&scene=3702663&cid=7ABE80D1746919B4!1329
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
In short, of course mate!
On 08/02/07, Tim Gamber <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
is 1/0 wiring big enough to take 450 amps for short bursts and 100-200
amps
continuous at 72 volts?
_________________________________________________________________
http://local.live.com/default.aspx?v=2&cp=43.658648~-79.383962&style=r&lvl=15&tilt=-90&dir=0&alt=-1000&scene=3702663&cid=7ABE80D1746919B4!1329
>From January 26 to February 8, 2007
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Absolutely. There are also trade offs if you try to control these
factors as well. Finding a well balanced state will also vary with
time. While my experience has been with stationary inverters, the same
should apply with EVs. The only real condition you can immediately
manipulate with control readily is temperature. Make up water will
impact your specific gravity (specific gravity), and it isn't very
practical to change out your electrolyte when its density is only
changing in percentage points. In fact I've permitted the density of my
PbAs to change 10-15% without any real impact on overall short term
performance ... I can't comment on long term affects as I simply haven't
had any noted experience beyond a year or so. Richard Perez (Home Power
Magazine, issue #9) has a good article on "Lead Acid Battery State of
Charge vs Voltage" which might help. There are also several good
resources you might find googling. Like yourself, I've been concerned
in finding out the source of voltage differences as well ... I've gotten
to where I monitor my battery packs for deviations that might indicate a
pending cell failure, and still search for phantom ghost sinks (my wife
... bless her heart ... she loves gadgets that have sleep timers,
clocks, standby voltages ... etc), but small deviations in battery
status (<10%) I've gotten to where I make note but pend action.
Disclaimer - my situation is vastly different from your constant heavy
drain and huge swing in charge; I've never had cause to use more than
20% of my battery state of charge (not to mention being some distance
from any source of help when on the road). I'm counting pennies toward
a Li-ion pack, maybe within the next two years I'll be able to make that
purchase ... I'm sure I'll be freaking out soon enough as well given
their current costs!
Peter VanDerWal wrote:
Roland, I think I've figured out where you went wrong.
You said you saw your pack voltage sagged 3% (from 192V to 186V) under a
200 Amp load and apparently you mistakenly attributed this to voltage drop
in the wiring.
The vast amount of this voltage drop was in the batteries themselves due
to their internal resistance, and not in the wiring.
I suppose you could describe battery voltage sag as a percentage of pack
voltage, since it depends on how many cells you have (more cells in
series, more voltage sag). However, this would be somewhat meaningless as
battery voltage sag is dependent on the batteries internal resistance and
this varies constantly. It changes depending on how old the batteries
are, how warm/cold they are, and their SoC, specific gravity, etc.
Anyway, the voltage sag was mostly due to the batteries and not the wire.
This discussion of house wiring isn't really relevent and doesn't change
anything anyway.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
"New generation electric city car will be completed in Jan. 20, 2007":
http://www.vstargroup.com/product/eccar/ecitycar.html
tks
Lock
Toronto
human-electric
December 23rd:
EVLN(Shandong Huoyan Electromobile City Spirit: a DC Smart
knock-off)
http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/ev-list-archive/message/82642
October 3rd:
China Knock-offs (Re: "Strange EV on eBay" round 3)
http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/ev-list-archive/message/76611
September 28th:
China Knock-offs (Re: "Strange EV on eBay" round 2)
http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/ev-list-archive/message/76096
September 26th:
China Knock-offs (Re: "Strange EV on eBay" round 2)
http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/ev-list-archive/message/75896
And finally September 19th:
Strange EV on Ebay
http://autos.groups.yahoo.com/group/ev-list-archive/message/75067
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Please do NOT post this kind of hogwash to this list!
Joseph H. Strubhar
E-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Web: www.gremcoinc.com
----- Original Message -----
From: "JS" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2007 10:45 AM
Subject: [Fwd: Tell your friends to join us: Speak out on Global Warming!]
Forwarded without recommentation.
>
>
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> Subject: Tell your friends to join us: Speak out on Global Warming!
> Date: Tue, 06 Feb 2007 18:26:35 GMT
> From: Barbara Boxer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> To: John Spradley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>
>
>
> <http://www.pacforachange.com>
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> Dear John,
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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I'm glad the Lepton suits your needs, but frankly I'm discouraged with
what's available in terms of 2-wheel EVs. 28 mph top speed is simply
unacceptable for even my short commute. If I can't keep up with the 40 mph
traffic on the main roads, I might as well just stay in the bike lane and
get some exercise like I do now. At least there, nobody tailgates or honks.
They have their place obviously, but it's disappointingly small.
- Kip
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>;
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>;
"SFEVA" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Thursday, February 08, 2007 9:28 AM
Subject: Top two wheeled ev you can buy right now
I'm liking my experience with my Lepton. It is a full fledged moped.
Great
for running around town. I've also owned Vego's, Bladez and othere
scooters
which were ok. Who has had a good two wheeled experience? Certainly
Electricmotorsports is the only place I know where you can get a real
electric motorcycle. Anyone else have a good experience to share? Reply
the the list please. Lawrence Rhodes......
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
> Peter VanDerWal wrote:
>>
>> Again this changes nothing, the voltage drop is not related to our pack
>> voltage, only the current.
>
> But this current depends on the voltage for given power EV, this is I
> guess is the source of confusion.
But we weren't talking about power.
The original statement was that the voltage drop for 50 ft of 1/0 wire was
3% of the applied voltage at 200 amps.
And then made an interesting statement that the wiring voltage drop for a
72V EV would be 10V.
Neither of these statements is correct.
That is what I was trying to point out before things started skewed in an
apparent attempt to somehow make the original statements true.
--
If you send email to me, or the EVDL, that has > 4 lines of legalistic
junk at the end; then you are specifically authorizing me to do whatever I
wish with the message. By posting the message you agree that your long
legalistic signature is void.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Well, for th emoment we'll ignore the obvious question (why would you want
a CVT on a motorcycle)
The answer to most of your questions is "yes".
If you are fixed on using a CVT, then I'd suggest you find one that will
fit and then figure out how that particular CVT works.
> If i was to make a electric motorcycle with a CVT what would i want it to
> do. Would i want it to let the motor get to full speed and then change the
> gear ratio or somewhere in between? Can you even adjust a cvt to shit at
> different rpms? Are most of them mechanical or computerized? can you
> program
> or adjust them?
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> http://local.live.com/default.aspx?v=2&cp=43.658648~-79.383962&style=r&lvl=15&tilt=-90&dir=0&alt=-1000&scene=3702663&cid=7ABE80D1746919B4!1329
>
>
--
If you send email to me, or the EVDL, that has > 4 lines of legalistic
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--- Begin Message ---
Ok, as I recall you were discussing a 72V bike? Are you drag racing it?
If not, then cruising speed will probably need about 75 amps give or take.
Assume your bike has 20 feet of cable (probably less but what the heck).
The resistance for 20 feet of:
1/0 is approx 0.002 ohms
00 is approx 0.0015
0000 is approx 0.001
So 4/0 will have about 1/2 the voltage drop of 1/0
At 75 amps
1/0 will drop ~0.14 volts
2/0 will drop ~0.116 volts
4/0 will drop ~0.074 volts
The difference in efficiency at 75 amps will be ~0.1% between 1/0 and 4/0
At 200 amps the difference in efficiency is ~0.26%
Note: those are not typos, I did NOT mean to say 26%, we are talking about
a fraction of 1%.
So yes, it makes a tiny difference in efficiency. You'd have to decide
whether or not that is worth the extra weight, expense, and hassle.
P.S. I asked if you were planning on drag racing because at 1,000 amps it
gets up over 1%. Probably not worth the extra weight but you'd have to
run the calculations.
> So anyway back to the question... If if i had the option of choosing 1/0
> or
> 2/0 in a motorcycle would the 2/0 make my motorcycle more efficent because
> of less resistance? Or would the weight and cost savings (which are
> minimal)
> of 1/0 be worth it? what if i put huge 4/0 in it would that make it even
> more efficent?
--
If you send email to me, or the EVDL, that has > 4 lines of legalistic
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--- Begin Message ---
http://blueskydsn.com/BugE_Concept.html
ADvanced DC 4001 series wound motor.
Chain drive; 6/1 ratio.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I made my comments to support EV's , Solar and electrify the railways
Received a personal thank you
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "JS" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sent: Tuesday, February 06, 2007 10:45 AM
> Subject: [Fwd: Tell your friends to join us: Speak out on Global
Warming!]
> Forwarded without recommentation.
>
>
> >
> >
> > -------- Original Message --------
> > Subject: Tell your friends to join us: Speak out on Global
Warming!
> > Date: Tue, 06 Feb 2007 18:26:35 GMT
> > From: Barbara Boxer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > To: John Spradley <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >
> >
> >
> > <http://www.pacforachange.com>
> >
> > Dear John,
> >
> >
> <http://ga4.org/pacforachange/join-forward.html?
domain=boxer2004&r=F1A8nWs1r
> HHl&>
> >
> > *Invite your friends & family to rank their preferred global
warming
> > solutions now!
> >
> <http://ga4.org/pacforachange/join-forward.html?
domain=boxer2004&r=F1A8nWs1r
> HHl&>*
> >
> > Since last week, more than 20,000 Americans -- including you --
have
> > already shared your priorities with me about how we should fight
global
> > warming. I'm thrilled by this tremendous response! Clearly,
global
> > warming is an issue of critical importance to Americans from
> > coast-to-coast. Thank you so much for your feedback.
> >
> > But I still hope to hear from tens of thousands more Americans.
*Won't
> > you invite your friends & family to let us know how they think
we should
> > fight global warming as well?*
> >
> > *Help me set the Senate's environmental agenda -- invite your
friends &
> > family to rank their preferred solutions for fighting global
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> > now!
> >
> <http://ga4.org/pacforachange/join-forward.html?
domain=boxer2004&r=F1A8nWs1r
> HHl&>*
> >
> > Last Tuesday, my first major act as the new Chair of the Senate's
> > Environment and Public Works Committee was to hold a hearing on
global
> > warming. More than one-third of my colleagues participated -- an
> > unprecedented number -- each Senator offering his or her own
ideas and
> > perspectives about how we should deal with the global warming
crisis.
> >
> > Then, after the hearing, I was further energized by the feedback
I
> > received when blogging about the hearing on DailyKos, spawning a
rousing
> > discussion that drew more than 800 comments to my initial blog
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> >
> > Clearly, online and offline, from the halls of Congress to the
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> > of Americans all across our country, a growing bipartisan
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> > emerging to confront this environmental crisis head-on. *The
question
> > is -- how best can we fight global warming? Invite everyone you
know to
> > let us know what you think we should do to address the most
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> > environmental issue of our generation.*
> >
> > *Help me fight global warming -- invite your friends & family to
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> >
> <http://ga4.org/pacforachange/join-forward.html?
domain=boxer2004&r=F1A8nWs1r
> HHl&>*
> >
> > I've scheduled our next Environment and Public Works Committee
hearing
> > for Wednesday, and I want to share as much feedback with my
colleagues
> > as possible when we reconvene.
> >
> > Thanks to the responses from you and more than 20,000 Americans,
we've
> > already collected some invaluable feedback. But I hope to hear
from
> > tens of thousands Americans more before Wednesday's hearing, to
ensure
> > as broad a range of opinions as possible.
> >
> > *So please, take just 60 seconds to invite your friends & family
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> >
> <http://ga4.org/pacforachange/join-forward.html?
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> > In Friendship,
> >
> > Barbara Boxer
> >
> > P.S. Please *invite your friends, family, neighbors, and
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> <http://ga4.org/pacforachange/join-forward.html?
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> difference!
> >
> > *_Prioritize our Global Warming Solutions
> >
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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Thanks for sharing that Jack.
I have been thinking along similar lines.
My idea was slightly different . Run a high strength
steel shaft through the hollow shaft of a normal rear
wheel hub, with bearings at either end.
The outer end of the shaft would be keyed or welded
into a circular disk bolted via the existing wheel
bolts to the hub.
To the inner end of the shaft is fitted a sprocket.
The sprocket is driven by chain drive with the chain
running along the existing swing arm to a small motor
(either electric or petrol).
I think your idea looks better, less machining but
uses a little more space.
Was it difficult to mount the strut?
What did you do with the rear swing arm, springs and
torsion bar?
Do you have anymore pictures/details? (Don't time
taking pictures if you don't have them, I won't be
doing any work on my project for a few years).
Tom Ward
--- Jack Murray <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I uploaded some pictures of the aspire hybrid.
>
> This is the rear wheel converted to a driven wheel
> using FWD hub strut
> and half-shaft. I put a bearing and made an aluminum
> support for it, and
> put in a keyway to hold a QD bushing.
>
> http://www.nimblemotorsports.com/drivenwheel.jpg
>
> Here is the chain drive from the 8" ADC motor.
>
> http://www.nimblemotorsports.com/motorchain.jpg
>
> I machined up the nylon drive sprocket and installed
> it.
> It doesn't make as much noise as the steel sprocket,
> but the chain drive
> still makes more noise than I would like.
> Might be OK once a cover is made so the noise
> doesn't echo around inside
> the car.
>
> Jack
>
> David Hrivnak wrote:
> > Interesting, please keep us posted!
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Jack Murray
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > Sent: Sunday, February 04, 2007 10:26 PM
> > To: David Hrivnak
> > Subject: Re: Speaking of Hybrids
> >
> > This car (95 Ford Aspire) is FWD (front wheel
> drive), so there is no
> > driveshaft that goes to the back wheels. The
> front of the car remains
> > stock with its 1.3L engine.
> >
> > I have grafted into the rear suspension on one
> side of the car a FWD hub
> >
> > that now drives the wheel using a half shaft, with
> a pulley setup
> > connected to the half-shaft. I'll have some
> pictures of it soon.
> >
> > Jack
> >
> > David Hrivnak wrote:
> >
> >>Have you thought about putting the electric motor
> in line with a
> >>shortened driveshaft? I too am in the process of
> building such a
> >>vehicle and could not come up with a good belt or
> chain driven
> >>alternative. So I am trying in-line and will vary
> the power between
> >
> > the
> >
> >>ICE and electric motor.
> >>
> >>-----Original Message-----
> >>From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
> >
> > On
> >
> >>Behalf Of Jack Murray
> >>Sent: Saturday, February 03, 2007 8:38 PM
> >>To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
> >>Subject: Speaking of Hybrids
> >>
> >>I think a good way to do a plug-in hybrid is to
> take a FWD car, and
> >
> > add
> >
> >>an electric motor to drive the rear wheels.
> >>Then you can use the electric motor around town,
> and use the gas motor
> >
> >
> >>on the freeway.
> >>
> >>I've been building just such a car, I've converted
> one rear wheel into
> >
> > a
> >
> >>driven wheel powered by an electric motor.
> >>However, I'm having trouble and could use some
> suggestions. I
> >>originally used a 1" wide belt drive to power the
> wheel, but the belt
> >>would
> >>slip when enough torque was applied to move the
> car.
> >>So I've changed it to use a chain drive. The
> problem now is the chain
> >
> >
> >>makes a huge amount of noise! more noise than ICE
> does.
> >>Has anyone else done a chain or belt drive setup?
> Are there chain
> >>drives that are not so noisy? Or belts that can
> handle a lot of
> >
> > torque.
> >
> >>A 3" wide belt?
> >>I'm considering trying the snowmobile CVT setup,
> but its a little
> >>expensive for this project.
> >>
> >>Thanks,
> >>Jack
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
___________________________________________________________
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--- Begin Message ---
Your terminals are probably going to have much more resistance than a
few feet of 2/0, or even a few feet of much lesser gauge.
Danny
Peter VanDerWal wrote:
At 200 amps the difference in efficiency is ~0.26%
Note: those are not typos, I did NOT mean to say 26%, we are talking about
a fraction of 1%.
So yes, it makes a tiny difference in efficiency. You'd have to decide
whether or not that is worth the extra weight, expense, and hassle.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Cool, but isn't it missing a back panel?
DC [EMAIL
PROTECTED])¢Ë\¢{Z{~Û×^g¬±¨ ~æjÛ.r¬jvµ§!y×âæ¯qªÝ 3 ~æjÛbâ²Û¶Èì¹çn¢yriÇ ¦ÓË StÈ*.®,¶)à±Ø¬¦V²¶¬ë,j²¢êæj)i®+jh¬lzÛh±éÝ<°51LãKa©Ý籧cºËb
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