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Today's Topics:

   1. Re: EV Digest, Vol 2, Issue 53 (Lawrence Rhodes)
   2. Re: Drag coefficient, frontal area data?
      ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
   3. Yahoo and Bounce Scores... (Steven Ciciora)
   4. Re: Yahoo and Bounce Scores... (Ben)
   5. ebay find - wish I had some money (Matt Milliron)
   6. Re: Yahoo and Bounce Scores... (storm connors)
   7. Re: ebay find - wish I had some money (Jeff Major)
   8. Re: Booted again (Michael Perry)
   9. Re: Drag coefficient, frontal area data? (David Dymaxion)
  10. Re: Drag coefficient, frontal area data? (Martin Klingensmith)
  11. This video a MUST SEE..... sorry I missed it on CBS Sunday
      Morning (Steven Lough)
  12. 55amp Shunwei Science & Technology controller (Lawrence Rhodes)
  13. Re: This video a MUST SEE..... sorry I missed it on CBS
      Sunday Morning (keith vansickle)
  14. Re: 55amp Shunwei Science & Technology controller (Alan Brinkman)
  15. Re: Drag coefficient, frontal area data? (Doug Weathers)
  16. Re: Poor battery connections (Roger Stockton)
  17. Battery Desulfators (Hunter Cook)
  18. Re: Drag coefficient, frontal area data? (GWMobile)
  19. Re: Battery Desulfators (Alan Brinkman)
  20. good project (Jeff Mccabe)


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Thu, 20 Sep 2007 23:29:38 -0700
From: "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] EV Digest, Vol 2, Issue 53
To: <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain;       charset="iso-8859-1"

Well Ken if you really don't like the idea of Bill being nominated for the
Darwin Award(Honorable Mention) you can always go to the slush pile and vote
against it.  http://darwinawards.com/slush/new/pending20070914-012422.html
However it has the most votes in the Slush Pile and is on its way for
inclusion(with 87% positive) of Bill as an Honorable Mention.  It's a fact
that it happened.  It's clear from the video what happened.  The Darwin
people love it.  Yes I did feel a little ashamed after I did it but be that
as it may Bills accident is classic Darwin.  Lawrence Rhodes.......
Message: 24
Date: Thu, 20 Sep 2007 20:23:54 EDT
From:
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Reaction time (was: Bill Dube nominated for

And while I'm at it, this Darwin award thing is just about as low as
anything I have seen.

Shame on this thread!

I'll probably regret this rant but right now I am just too steamed to care.

Just my two amps worth,

Ken




------------------------------

Message: 2
Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 13:26:16 +0200
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Drag coefficient, frontal area data?
To: ev@lists.sjsu.edu
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1

I'm interested in this too so I propose a team effort - 
if you can find front and side drawings or pics with scale,
I'll calculate A and approximate Cd (assuming car is 2d extrusion)
and put it up at 
http://imby.biz/saymoo/EvdlGems/DragAndRollingCoefficients
or if u like the nerd stuff I'll find the pics and you do the calcs.

>I was hoping for something comprehensive, a database where I could look up any
>mass-produced vehicle including OEM body style variants up to the
>current year. (The second list, while longer, only states Cd values,
>which aren't very useful without frontal area).
>I'll assume such a resource doesn't exist. There are descriptions online
>for using the deceleration curve of a vehicle to determine drag values
>(and, interestingly, to separate aerodynamic drag from rolling
>resistance), but these require that I actually get to drive the
>vehicles, on an otherwise vacant road. Maybe I can rent or do test
>drives...
>Makes me curious though ... some vehicle reviews do contain this kind of
>data -- where do they get it?  If it's not published somewhere, do they
>call the manufacturer? Surely a car review site isn't going to do its
>own wind tunnel tests....?



------------------------------

Message: 3
Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 05:30:13 -0700 (PDT)
From: Steven Ciciora <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: [EVDL] Yahoo and Bounce Scores...
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1

I just checked my bounce score, and it's a 9 out of
10.  The amount of emails getting sent to my spam
folder (actually, yahoo doesn't call it a spam folder,
but I forget right now what they call it) has dropped
by quite a bit.  For a while earlier this month, they
_all_ went to that folder.

Is there anything I can do to prevent bounces to my
Yahoo account, to get my bounce score back down?

Steven Ciciora


--- "David Roden (Akron OH USA)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:

> BTW, I just checked my test EVDL account on Yahoo. 
> I have a few missing 
> digests from earlier this month - on the 9th, 12th,
> and 14th.  
> 
> My bounce score is also 5.0 out of 10.0.  This
> suggests that Yahoo may 
> indeed be having some mail server problems.
> 
> If you'd like to check your bounce score, log in
> here :
> 
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/options/ev
> 
> David Roden
> EVDL Administrator
> http://www.evdl.org/
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
> 



       
____________________________________________________________________________________
Need a vacation? Get great deals
to amazing places on Yahoo! Travel.
http://travel.yahoo.com/



------------------------------

Message: 4
Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 08:34:10 -0400
From: Ben <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Yahoo and Bounce Scores...
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Message-ID:
        <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8

I hate to evangelize my choice of email provider, or put down someone
elses --- But I do think it is worth mentioning that GMail hasn't
given me any fits of bounced mail or missed messages, and I think I
remember some other members chiming in to say the same. Of the free
providers, I think they have one of the fastest and cleanest
interfaces and most reliable email delivery. I'm not sure if they have
it setup yet where anyone can sign up -- if not, I have plenty of
invites I'd be willing to share.

Ben

On 9/21/07, Steven Ciciora <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I just checked my bounce score, and it's a 9 out of
> 10.  The amount of emails getting sent to my spam
> folder (actually, yahoo doesn't call it a spam folder,
> but I forget right now what they call it) has dropped
> by quite a bit.  For a while earlier this month, they
> _all_ went to that folder.
>
> Is there anything I can do to prevent bounces to my
> Yahoo account, to get my bounce score back down?
>
> Steven Ciciora
>
>
> --- "David Roden (Akron OH USA)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
>
> > BTW, I just checked my test EVDL account on Yahoo.
> > I have a few missing
> > digests from earlier this month - on the 9th, 12th,
> > and 14th.
> >
> > My bounce score is also 5.0 out of 10.0.  This
> > suggests that Yahoo may
> > indeed be having some mail server problems.
> >
> > If you'd like to check your bounce score, log in
> > here :
> >
> > http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/options/ev
> >
> > David Roden
> > EVDL Administrator
> > http://www.evdl.org/
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > For subscription options, see
> > http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
> >
>
>
>
>
> ____________________________________________________________________________________
> Need a vacation? Get great deals
> to amazing places on Yahoo! Travel.
> http://travel.yahoo.com/
>
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>



------------------------------

Message: 5
Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 7:58:36 -0500
From: Matt Milliron <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: [EVDL] ebay find - wish I had some money
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Message-ID:
        <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
        
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1

ebay Item number: 300150587339




------------------------------

Message: 6
Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 09:31:27 -0400
From: "storm connors" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Yahoo and Bounce Scores...
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Message-ID:
        <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1

Does one have to have to be an administrator to check the bounce score? I
went to the options page you linked to and couldn't find it.

On 9/21/07, Steven Ciciora <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> I just checked my bounce score, and it's a 9 out of
> 10.  The amount of emails getting sent to my spam
> folder (actually, yahoo doesn't call it a spam folder,
> but I forget right now what they call it) has dropped
> by quite a bit.  For a while earlier this month, they
> _all_ went to that folder.
>
> Is there anything I can do to prevent bounces to my
> Yahoo account, to get my bounce score back down?
>
> Steven Ciciora
>
>
> --- "David Roden (Akron OH USA)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> wrote:
>
> > BTW, I just checked my test EVDL account on Yahoo.
> > I have a few missing
> > digests from earlier this month - on the 9th, 12th,
> > and 14th.
> >
> > My bounce score is also 5.0 out of 10.0.  This
> > suggests that Yahoo may
> > indeed be having some mail server problems.
> >
> > If you'd like to check your bounce score, log in
> > here :
> >
> > http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/options/ev
> >
> > David Roden
> > EVDL Administrator
> > http://www.evdl.org/
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > For subscription options, see
> > http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
> >
>
>
>
>
>
> ____________________________________________________________________________________
> Need a vacation? Get great deals
> to amazing places on Yahoo! Travel.
> http://travel.yahoo.com/
>
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>



-- 
http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/1059
http://stormselectric.blogspot.com/
Storm


------------------------------

Message: 7
Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 07:23:47 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jeff Major <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] ebay find - wish I had some money
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED], Electric Vehicle Discussion List <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1


Interesting find.  Looks like early versions.  Not
exactly what you would find in the EV-1.  Maybe from
the Impact.  Date on the motor is 1994.

Jeff M


--- Matt Milliron <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> ebay Item number: 300150587339
> 
> 
>


       
____________________________________________________________________________________
Boardwalk for $500? In 2007? Ha! Play Monopoly Here and Now (it's updated for 
today's economy) at Yahoo! Games.
http://get.games.yahoo.com/proddesc?gamekey=monopolyherenow  



------------------------------

Message: 8
Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 08:37:01 -0700
From: "Michael Perry" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Booted again
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain;       charset="iso-8859-1"

Usually this is your service provider, not Yahoogroups. You see, Yahoogroups
takes "bounce" messages at face value. Thus, when my service provider was
doing work on their servers (over 3 months) I had to constantly log into
Yahoogroups and take myself off of the bounced list.

Once you've been bounced from one list, you are bounced from them all.

I don't know if it's still true, but it used to be that (after a bounce) if
the admin of that group removed you, you were dropped from all lists. Get an
inexperienced moderator and you could find yourself in difficulty. <g>

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "David Roden (Akron OH USA)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Thursday, September 20, 2007 8:28 PM
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Booted again


> BTW, I just checked my test EVDL account on Yahoo.  I have a few missing
> digests from earlier this month - on the 9th, 12th, and 14th.
>
> My bounce score is also 5.0 out of 10.0.  This suggests that Yahoo may
> indeed be having some mail server problems.
>
> If you'd like to check your bounce score, log in here :
>
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/options/ev
>
> David Roden
> EVDL Administrator
> http://www.evdl.org/
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev



------------------------------

Message: 9
Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 09:18:44 -0700 (PDT)
From: David Dymaxion <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Drag coefficient, frontal area data?
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

The U.S. gov't EPA databases have some really neat information, like the weight 
and Cd*A, as well as fuel economy.

Unfortunately, the newer databases only have fuel economy info, but 1996 and 
earlier there is alot of neat stuff.

http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/download.shtml

----- Original Message ----
From: "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: ev@lists.sjsu.edu
Sent: Friday, September 21, 2007 4:26:16 AM
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Drag coefficient, frontal area data?

I'm interested in this too so I propose a team effort - 
if you can find front and side drawings or pics with scale,
I'll calculate A and approximate Cd (assuming car is 2d extrusion)
and put it up at 
http://imby.biz/saymoo/EvdlGems/DragAndRollingCoefficients
or if u like the nerd stuff I'll find the pics and you do the calcs.

>I was hoping for something comprehensive, a database where I could look up any
>mass-produced vehicle including OEM body style variants up to the
>current year. (The second list, while longer, only states Cd values,
>which aren't very useful without frontal area).
>I'll assume such a resource doesn't exist. There are descriptions online
>for using the deceleration curve of a vehicle to determine drag values
>(and, interestingly, to separate aerodynamic drag from rolling
>resistance), but these require that I actually get to drive the
>vehicles, on an otherwise vacant road. Maybe I can rent or do test
>drives...
>Makes me curious though ... some vehicle reviews do contain this kind of
>data -- where do they get it?  If it's not published somewhere, do they
>call the manufacturer? Surely a car review site isn't going to do its
>own wind tunnel tests....?

_______________________________________________
For subscription options, see
http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev







       
____________________________________________________________________________________
Be a better Heartthrob. Get better relationship answers from someone who knows. 
Yahoo! Answers - Check it out. 
http://answers.yahoo.com/dir/?link=list&sid=396545433

------------------------------

Message: 10
Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 12:25:42 -0400
From: Martin Klingensmith <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Drag coefficient, frontal area data?
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed

Depending on what the need for aerodynamic data is, I would assume that 
you could use highway fuel economy as a scale for how aerodynamic a 
vehicle is. If you're just trying to prove that a Honda Civic is more 
efficient in general than a Hummer H2. Things change rapidly when you 
start talking about hybrids and electric conversions with half a ton of 
lead but if you compare the gas-only list it should provide a good 
analog. City MPG is not a good comparison of aerodynamics, but it is 
directly related to size of engine and weight of vehicle.
--
Martin K

David Dymaxion wrote:
> The U.S. gov't EPA databases have some really neat information, like the 
> weight and Cd*A, as well as fuel economy.
>
> Unfortunately, the newer databases only have fuel economy info, but 1996 and 
> earlier there is alot of neat stuff.
>
> http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/download.shtml
>
>   



------------------------------

Message: 11
Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 09:30:44 -0700
From: Steven Lough <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: [EVDL] This video a MUST SEE..... sorry I missed it on CBS
        Sunday  Morning
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED],  Electric Vehicle Discussion List RCVR
        <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed

CBS Sunday Morning a while back had a 10 minute SPOT on the Rosy Future 
of the Electric Cars...  It is a MUST SEE...  It brought tears to my eyes.

And nothing has done that since I saw the "early first" trailor to
"Who Killed the Electric Car" and Chelsea tearing up at the mock funural 
for the EV1...two years ago.....

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/09/06/sunday/main3239838.shtml

This LINK, again Thanks to Felix, and the CalCars News FEED.

-- 
Steven S. Lough, Pres.
Seattle EV Association
6021 32nd Ave. N.E.
Seattle,  WA  98115-7230
Day:  206 850-8535
Eve:  206 524-1351
e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
web:     http://www.seattleeva.org



------------------------------

Message: 12
Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 09:52:21 -0700
From: "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: [EVDL] 55amp Shunwei Science & Technology controller
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,        "Electric Vehicle Discussion List"
        <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain;       charset="iso-8859-1"

SW-36v / 500WG controller.  I aquired this controller and another of simular
history for a 36v project.  I have a vague idea of the wiring.  Does  anyone
have a schematic of the pinouts?  I have heard these are on the Honda
Minimotos.  Silver case.  7 connectors.  The input is female & the motor
output is male I hope.  I recognised the brake cutout & a three pin which
must be hall effect.  Now I can't figure out volt sense or any of the other
functions.  This wouldn't have a charger built in to such a small unit would
it?   Lawrenece Rhodes.....



------------------------------

Message: 13
Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 10:09:09 -0700 (PDT)
From: keith vansickle <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] This video a MUST SEE..... sorry I missed it on
        CBS     Sunday Morning
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1

I saw this too and want to share it with My chapter
EAA does anyone know how to get a DVD of it? I can't
get my computer to make one.  Meeting is not till the
25th if any one can make a DVD of this and send it to
me either electronically or via mail I would
appreciate it.

--- Steven Lough <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

> CBS Sunday Morning a while back had a 10 minute SPOT
> on the Rosy Future 
> of the Electric Cars...  It is a MUST SEE...  It
> brought tears to my eyes.
> 
> And nothing has done that since I saw the "early
> first" trailor to
> "Who Killed the Electric Car" and Chelsea tearing up
> at the mock funural 
> for the EV1...two years ago.....
> 
>
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2007/09/06/sunday/main3239838.shtml
> 
> This LINK, again Thanks to Felix, and the CalCars
> News FEED.
> 
> -- 
> Steven S. Lough, Pres.
> Seattle EV Association
> 6021 32nd Ave. N.E.
> Seattle,  WA  98115-7230
> Day:  206 850-8535
> Eve:  206 524-1351
> e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> web:     http://www.seattleeva.org
> 
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
> 



       
____________________________________________________________________________________
Moody friends. Drama queens. Your life? Nope! - their life, your story. Play 
Sims Stories at Yahoo! Games.
http://sims.yahoo.com/  



------------------------------

Message: 14
Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 10:28:12 -0700
From: "Alan Brinkman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] 55amp Shunwei Science & Technology controller
To: "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,      "Electric Vehicle
        Discussion List" <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Message-ID:
        <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain;       charset="US-ASCII"

Lawrence,

Most of the small 24 and 36 volt scooters of this type have a separate
charger that plugs into the machine via a three prong XLR connector
(similar to a microphone).  Look at Ebay item number 220144495302

Maybe someone on this list has a schematic for the controller.

When I changed the hall effect throttle on a 24 volt Razor scooter from
thumb control to twist control, the three wires had different connectors
and I had some trouble but finally got it done.  Without a working or
broken bike to look at, hopefully someone has a schematic for you to
work from.   

Alan 

-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Lawrence Rhodes
Sent: Friday, September 21, 2007 9:52 AM
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Electric Vehicle Discussion List
Subject: [EVDL] 55amp Shunwei Science & Technology controller

SW-36v / 500WG controller.  I aquired this controller and another of
simular
history for a 36v project.  I have a vague idea of the wiring.  Does
anyone
have a schematic of the pinouts?  I have heard these are on the Honda
Minimotos.  Silver case.  7 connectors.  The input is female & the motor
output is male I hope.  I recognised the brake cutout & a three pin
which
must be hall effect.  Now I can't figure out volt sense or any of the
other
functions.  This wouldn't have a charger built in to such a small unit
would
it?   Lawrenece Rhodes.....

_______________________________________________
For subscription options, see
http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev



------------------------------

Message: 15
Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 11:08:23 -0600
From: Doug Weathers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Drag coefficient, frontal area data?
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed

In April 2006, Neon John posted a clever low-tech way to measure the 
frontal area of a given vehicle.

Start with a frontal photograph of the vehicle.  If you are taking the 
picture yourself, include a one-foot square, propped up vertically..  If 
not, make sure there's something in the photograph, in the plane of the 
front of the car, that has a known length.  Like a state license plate, 
for example.

Now use scissors/hobby knife and cut the outline of the car out of the 
photograph.

Then cut out the one-foot square, or calculate what a one-foot square 
would look like based on the scale of the known measurement and cut that 
out of the same paper.

Weigh the one-foot square on a laboratory scale.  This tells you how 
much the paper weighs per square (photographed) foot.

Now weigh the cutout of the vehicle.  Divide this number by the weight 
of the one-foot square, and you have the frontal area of the vehicle in 
square feet.

<http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/msg06421.html>

Sometimes I miss that guy.

Later,

Doug

Steve Peterson wrote:
> Yeah, that first table is from mayfco.com; however, the 2nd table is new
> since I last looked. Sadly, the 2nd table lists only the Cd, so you're
> left to approximate (guess) what the frontal area is. Sigh....
>
> --Steve
>
> On Thu, 2007-09-20 at 16:06 -0400, Martin Klingensmith wrote:
>   
>> Try this:
>> <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automobile_drag_coefficients>
>>
>> --
>> Martin K
>>
>> Christopher Robison wrote:
>>     
>>> Is there a good resource, online or elsewhere, to look up the drag
>>> coefficient and frontal area of modern vehicles? (Yes I already know
>>> about the mayfco.com list; it doesn't include any vehicles less than 10
>>> years old, and most are 15 or more years old). So far Google hasn't been
>>> helpful on half the cars I've tried to look up.
>>>
>>> Is this the kind of thing for which some kind of publication is
>>> available, that I might find in a library somewhere? I'd even be willing
>>> to pay a reasonable amount for ongoing access to this kind of
>>> information, if it's kept up to date.
>>>
>>>
>>>   
>>>       
>> _______________________________________________
>> For subscription options, see
>> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>>     
>
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>   



------------------------------

Message: 16
Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 10:51:00 -0700
From: "Roger Stockton" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Poor battery connections
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Message-ID:
        <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain;       charset="us-ascii"

Lee Hart wrote: 

> Tyler wrote:
> > Don't know if they pull 1000 amps, but I've always like 
> > Stinger (car audio) terminals...
> > 
> > http://stingerelectronics.com/index.asp
> 
> This stuff looks like all show, with no actual performance 
> data at all. I suspect you would find ridiculously high
> prices. Whether they actually work could only be determined
> by actual test. Caveat emptor.

In all fairness, I haven't seen any performance data for the
well-respected MagnaLug or QuickCable terminals commonly used by EVers
either ;^>

I've no doubt one might pay a premium for the good looks of these audio
connectors, but I see two signs that they probably wouldn't be a good
choice for EV use:  first, most EVs able to draw 1000A use 1/0 or 2/0
cables but these connectors accept a maximum of 4 or 6ga, and secondly,
these terminals are advertised as fitting either positive or negative
posts, and since positive and negative posts are different sizes this
usually means they fit neither particularly well.

I believe I have seen some similar style car audio terminals that did
accept at least 1/0, and which may have been available in positive and
negative models, but I can't find them at the moment.  I thought they
were from Lightning Audio (and maybe they were, it has been a few years
since I considered them), but Lightning Audio's site doesn't seem to
list any battery terminals these days.

I wouldn't automatically rule out the use of car audio type terminals if
you want to dress up batteries that are readily visible to the public;
John Wayland used car audio wire and connectors on the batteries in Blue
Meanie with success.  However, as Lee suggests, caveat emptor: use
connectors that others have already proven work in EVs or test them
yourself, don't assume they will work as well as they look!

Cheers,

Roger.



------------------------------

Message: 17
Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 13:20:15 -0500
From: Hunter Cook <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: [EVDL] Battery Desulfators
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain

Hi guys-

Well, I now have the title to my converted '84 S10, and it should be
delivered in a week or two. I'm totally stoked.

But now my thoughts have turned to the near-dead battery pack, its
eventual replacement, and what if anything I can do to improve things in
the meantime.

The pack was 24 US-145 6v flooded golf cart batteries, but is now 22 of
them, as two are toast and were removed from the string by the previous
owner (he still included them so I can exchange the cores). The
remaining batts have somewhat less than half their original capacity it
seems; he says current range is around 15-20mi, down from the original
50-55 or so.

So then I start running across these "desulfator" devices. Do these
things work? A lot of people seem to think so. I have just started
reading the chemistry stuff, and I'm not sure whether I grok it or not,
so I just figured I'd ask. Also, I'd be interested to know what
brands/models people have used and their specific experiences. And
finally, has anybody built their own desulfator, like this:
http://www.shaka.com/~kalepa/desulf.htm  ?? It doesn't look like too
complicated a circuit, and if it'll work well I think it's the way I'd
like to go.

Thanks in advance...

Hunter



------------------------------

Message: 18
Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 11:18:25 -0700
From: GWMobile <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Drag coefficient, frontal area data?
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format="flowed"

The current administration has made it a policy to pull all non required 
info from government websites to make it harder for evinomentalists to 
make their cases for alternatives to the oil economy and global 
warming.

They literally have destroyed whole offices with reasearch. The congress 
issued a injunction to stop some of it.


On Fri, 21 Sep 2007 9:51 am, David Dymaxion wrote:
> The U.S. gov't EPA databases have some really neat information, like 
> the weight and Cd*A, as well as fuel economy.
>
> Unfortunately, the newer databases only have fuel economy info, but 
> 1996 and earlier there is alot of neat stuff.
>
> http://www.fueleconomy.gov/feg/download.shtml
>
> ----- Original Message ----
> From: "[EMAIL PROTECTED]" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: ev@lists.sjsu.edu
> Sent: Friday, September 21, 2007 4:26:16 AM
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] Drag coefficient, frontal area data?
>
> I'm interested in this too so I propose a team effort -
> if you can find front and side drawings or pics with scale,
> I'll calculate A and approximate Cd (assuming car is 2d extrusion)
> and put it up at
> http://imby.biz/saymoo/EvdlGems/DragAndRollingCoefficients
> or if u like the nerd stuff I'll find the pics and you do the calcs.
>
>> I was hoping for something comprehensive, a database where I could 
>> look up any
>> mass-produced vehicle including OEM body style variants up to the
>> current year. (The second list, while longer, only states Cd values,
>> which aren't very useful without frontal area).
>> I'll assume such a resource doesn't exist. There are descriptions 
>> online
>> for using the deceleration curve of a vehicle to determine drag values
>> (and, interestingly, to separate aerodynamic drag from rolling
>> resistance), but these require that I actually get to drive the
>> vehicles, on an otherwise vacant road. Maybe I can rent or do test
>> drives...
>> Makes me curious though ... some vehicle reviews do contain this kind 
>> of
>> data -- where do they get it?  If it's not published somewhere, do they
>> call the manufacturer? Surely a car review site isn't going to do its
>> own wind tunnel tests....?
>
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ____________________________________________________________________________________
> Be a better Heartthrob. Get better relationship answers from someone 
> who knows. Yahoo! Answers - Check it out.
> http://answers.yahoo.com/dir/?link=list&sid=396545433
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev

www.GlobalBoiling.com for daily images about hurricanes, globalwarming 
and the melting poles.

www.ElectricQuakes.com daily solar and earthquake images.



------------------------------

Message: 19
Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 11:42:17 -0700
From: "Alan Brinkman" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Battery Desulfators
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Message-ID:
        <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain;       charset="US-ASCII"

Hunter,

In a quick search of the archives I saw this reply that suggests battery
"desulfators"....."don't do anything that proper charging and
maintenance won't do."

Inset from archives here.....

When you charge a lead-acid battery, lead sulfate in the plates gets
converted to lead oxide in the plates, and sulfuric acid in the liquid
electrolyte.

When you discharge it, the sulfuric acid leaves the liquid electrolyte
and converts the lead oxide to lead sulfate in the plates. This
"sulfation" is perfectly normal and necessary.

But if the lead sulfate sits around for a long time, or you make too
much of it by deeply discharging the battery, it gradually changes from
many small crystals to a few large ones. This makes it more difficult to
convert it all back into lead oxide and sulfuric acid. Typically, some
of the lead sulfate falls off the plates and winds up as sludge in the
bottom of the battery.

Battery "desulfators" are right in there with snake oil and magnetic
bracelets and other junk science cures. They don't do anything that
proper charging and maintenance won't do.

--
Ring the bells that still can ring
Forget the perfect offering
There is a crack in everything
That's how the light gets in -- Leonard Cohen
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net

End of insert from archives........

Some on the list start with a very slow charge and see if the batteries
improve.
Good luck!

Alan 


-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Hunter Cook
Sent: Friday, September 21, 2007 11:20 AM
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
Subject: [EVDL] Battery Desulfators

Hi guys-

Well, I now have the title to my converted '84 S10, and it should be
delivered in a week or two. I'm totally stoked.

But now my thoughts have turned to the near-dead battery pack, its
eventual replacement, and what if anything I can do to improve things in
the meantime.

The pack was 24 US-145 6v flooded golf cart batteries, but is now 22 of
them, as two are toast and were removed from the string by the previous
owner (he still included them so I can exchange the cores). The
remaining batts have somewhat less than half their original capacity it
seems; he says current range is around 15-20mi, down from the original
50-55 or so.

So then I start running across these "desulfator" devices. Do these
things work? A lot of people seem to think so. I have just started
reading the chemistry stuff, and I'm not sure whether I grok it or not,
so I just figured I'd ask. Also, I'd be interested to know what
brands/models people have used and their specific experiences. And
finally, has anybody built their own desulfator, like this:
http://www.shaka.com/~kalepa/desulf.htm  ?? It doesn't look like too
complicated a circuit, and if it'll work well I think it's the way I'd
like to go.

Thanks in advance...

Hunter

_______________________________________________
For subscription options, see
http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev



------------------------------

Message: 20
Date: Fri, 21 Sep 2007 11:57:38 -0700 (PDT)
From: Jeff Mccabe <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: [EVDL] good project
To: ev@lists.sjsu.edu
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1

http://sfbay.craigslist.org/eby/car/424384156.html

 Heres a good late model Ranger project for someone.
Jeff



------------------------------

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