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Today's Topics:

   1. Re: LED Taillights - a money saver in gas cars? -
      >rangeextenderin EV's? - an analysis PC Power Supply (storm connors)
   2. Re: LED Taillights - a money saver in gas cars?
      ->rangeextenderin EV's? - an analysis PC Power Supply ((-Phil-))
   3. Re: LED Taillights - a money saver in gas cars? -
      >rangeextenderin EV's? - an analysis PC Power Supply (David Roden)
   4. SIX Chapters! WAS, Calling any EV owners in the Bay Area, SF
      (Bob Rice)
   5. Re: Calling any EV owners in the Bay Area, SF (Bob Rice)
   6. GM EV Commercial Heard (David Dymaxion)
   7. Re: Poor battery connections (Timothy Balcer)
   8. Portland, OR area races or EVents? (Jim Coate)
   9. Re: LED Taillights - a money saver in gas
      cars?->rangeextenderin EV's? - an analysis PC Power Supply
      (Marty Hewes)


----------------------------------------------------------------------

Message: 1
Date: Wed, 26 Sep 2007 11:55:58 -0400
From: "storm connors" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] LED Taillights - a money saver in gas cars? -
        >rangeextenderin EV's? - an analysis PC Power Supply
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Message-ID:
        <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1

The laptop brick puts out 15v with a max of 70 watts. Obviously not enough
juice to handle extended times of the worst case scenario. The tradeoff is
carrying a bigger battery. My car wouldn't be driven over 2 hours, and
generally there would be a stop somewhere that could recharge the battery.
In my circumstance, I don't see the wisdom in spending several hundred
dollars to purchase a DC/DC converter that can handle 100% of max load since
I would still need a battery (albeit a smaller one). Your operating
conditions might be different than mine.
storm

On 9/26/07, Marty Hewes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> The PC supply I'm looking at here does 25 amps at 12 volts (300 watts),
> and
> it's better than average.  I don't know what it would take to raise the
> voltage, control overcharging, and make it run off of a DC input.  Maybe
> it
> could supplement the aux battery, maybe with the addition of some
> alternator
> regen during deceleration, to the point a large DC/DC is not required.
> Might be able to find a 12 volt only "brick" type supply surplus
> someplace.
>
> Marty
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
> Sent: Wednesday, September 26, 2007 8:53 AM
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] LED Taillights - a money saver in gas cars? -
> >rangeextenderin EV's? - an analysis PC Power Supply
>
>
> > down from 530 watts to 440 watts...
> > Now we're talking about "pc power supply" range for $50 bucks, rather
> than
> > expensive $250+ DC/DC converters...
> > What do you folks think?
> >
> > Has anyone used a cheap pc-power supply rather than a DC/DC converter -
> to
> > recharge their 12-volt aux battery?
> > Do you think it would hold up?
> >
> > Ed Cooley
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > "Adrian DeLeon" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> > 09/25/2007 23:37
> > Please respond to
> > Electric Vehicle Discussion List <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
> >
> >
> > To
> > ev@lists.sjsu.edu
> > cc
> >
> > Subject
> > Re: [EVDL] LED Taillights - a money saver in gas cars? -
> >rangeextenderin
> > EV's? - an analysis
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Around and around we go...
> >
> > The one big plus for LED lighting is the possibility of using a
> > smaller/less expensive DC/DC converter.
> >
> > Headlight on HI = 130W
> > Heater fan HI = 250W
> > Misc 12V = 60W
> > TOTAL SO FAR = 440W
> >
> > 4 marker lights = 5W x 4 = 20W
> > 4 turn signals = 27W x 4 = 100W (intermittent - can use "peak power"
> from
> > DC/DC)
> > 2 brake lights = 27W x 2 = 50W
> > 2 tail lights = 5W x 2 = 10W
> > Center brake light = 5W = 2 = 10W
> > TOTAL LIGHTING = 90W/190W (intermittent)
> >
> > So LEDs can reduce your DC/DC requirements from 530W to 450W.
> >
> > Adrian
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > For subscription options, see
> > http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > For subscription options, see
> > http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>



-- 
http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/1059
http://stormselectric.blogspot.com/
Storm


------------------------------

Message: 2
Date: Wed, 26 Sep 2007 09:29:47 -0700
From: "(-Phil-)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] LED Taillights - a money saver in gas cars?
        ->rangeextenderin EV's? - an analysis PC Power Supply
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
        reply-type=original

PC switchmodes almost always have capacitor voltage doublers on the input 
(split rail).  That means they probably need a minimum of 250ish volts to 
start properly (assuming they'll run with Japan-Spec AC).

There are plenty of surplus 12v supplies that are only designed for US spec 
and don't use doublers, so that means they are designed to run at ~150VDC 
but will probably start at around many pack voltages.

Remove the bridge rectifier and AC input filter stages and you have a nice 
DC supply for your EV.

It's usually pretty trivial to adjust a 12v supply up to 14v without too 
much trouble.

-Phil
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Marty Hewes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Wednesday, September 26, 2007 7:47 AM
Subject: Re: [EVDL] LED Taillights - a money saver in gas 
cars? ->rangeextenderin EV's? - an analysis PC Power Supply


> The PC supply I'm looking at here does 25 amps at 12 volts (300 watts), 
> and
> it's better than average.  I don't know what it would take to raise the
> voltage, control overcharging, and make it run off of a DC input.  Maybe 
> it
> could supplement the aux battery, maybe with the addition of some 
> alternator
> regen during deceleration, to the point a large DC/DC is not required.
> Might be able to find a 12 volt only "brick" type supply surplus 
> someplace.
>
> Marty
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
> Sent: Wednesday, September 26, 2007 8:53 AM
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] LED Taillights - a money saver in gas cars? -
> >rangeextenderin EV's? - an analysis PC Power Supply
>
>
>> down from 530 watts to 440 watts...
>> Now we're talking about "pc power supply" range for $50 bucks, rather 
>> than
>> expensive $250+ DC/DC converters...
>> What do you folks think?
>>
>> Has anyone used a cheap pc-power supply rather than a DC/DC converter - 
>> to
>> recharge their 12-volt aux battery?
>> Do you think it would hold up?
>>
>> Ed Cooley
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> "Adrian DeLeon" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> 09/25/2007 23:37
>> Please respond to
>> Electric Vehicle Discussion List <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
>>
>>
>> To
>> ev@lists.sjsu.edu
>> cc
>>
>> Subject
>> Re: [EVDL] LED Taillights - a money saver in gas cars? - >rangeextenderin
>> EV's? - an analysis
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Around and around we go...
>>
>> The one big plus for LED lighting is the possibility of using a
>> smaller/less expensive DC/DC converter.
>>
>> Headlight on HI = 130W
>> Heater fan HI = 250W
>> Misc 12V = 60W
>> TOTAL SO FAR = 440W
>>
>> 4 marker lights = 5W x 4 = 20W
>> 4 turn signals = 27W x 4 = 100W (intermittent - can use "peak power" from
>> DC/DC)
>> 2 brake lights = 27W x 2 = 50W
>> 2 tail lights = 5W x 2 = 10W
>> Center brake light = 5W = 2 = 10W
>> TOTAL LIGHTING = 90W/190W (intermittent)
>>
>> So LEDs can reduce your DC/DC requirements from 530W to 450W.
>>
>> Adrian
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> For subscription options, see
>> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> For subscription options, see
>> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
> 



------------------------------

Message: 3
Date: Wed, 26 Sep 2007 12:43:45 -0400
From: "David Roden" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] LED Taillights - a money saver in gas cars? -
        >rangeextenderin EV's? - an analysis PC Power Supply
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII

On 26 Sep 2007 at 9:53, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

> Has anyone used a cheap pc-power supply rather than a DC/DC converter - to 
> recharge their 12-volt aux battery?

This subject has been exhaustively discussed previously on the EVDL.  Please 
check the older public archives for more information :

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/ev/

http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/evdl_post_archive/

http://www.mail-archive.com/[EMAIL PROTECTED]/

David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
EVDL Administrator

= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
EVDL Information: http://www.evdl.org/help/
= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = 
Note: mail sent to "evpost" or "etpost" addresses will not 
reach me.  To send a private message, please obtain my 
email address from the webpage http://www.evdl.org/help/ .
= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =




------------------------------

Message: 4
Date: Wed, 26 Sep 2007 13:49:41 -0400
From: "Bob Rice" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: [EVDL] SIX Chapters! WAS, Calling any EV owners in the Bay
        Area, SF
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
        reply-type=original


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Cor van de Water" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Sunday, September 23, 2007 4:37 PM
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Calling any EV owners in the Bay Area, SF


> Hi Nikki,
>
> There are 6 EAA chapters in the Bay Area that meet once a month,

      Hi EVerybody;

     Gees! And we struggle to keep ONE up an' going in the Big 
Least.Corrupticut, Massatwoshitts, Road Island, Wrong Island .....Sigh! And 
in SF you have "Market Street" A rolling workaday trolley museum, running 
EVery day, too. I can see you could leave yur heart in SF by the bay! Throw 
in the Cable cars, too. What's not to love? But the battery killing HILLS! 
Maybe you can " Tack" up them, rather than a direct, cable car like, 
attempt? And the Redwoods a short trip away!Awesome! The G.G. BRIDGE, too. 
Cool place. But with SIX EAA chapters. You do stuff right on the Left Coast.

    See Ya

    Bob 



------------------------------

Message: 5
Date: Wed, 26 Sep 2007 13:52:18 -0400
From: "Bob Rice" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Calling any EV owners in the Bay Area, SF
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
        reply-type=original


----- Original Message ----- 
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "'Electric Vehicle Discussion List'" <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Sunday, September 23, 2007 4:58 PM
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Calling any EV owners in the Bay Area, SF


> ==
> BTW, one of my other visitors was very underwelmed by the demo of a trip 
> in
> my S10 truck, he said: this feels like any other
> S10 truck only with the absence of noise.
> Exactly, that is how an EV can be 'just a regular car'.
> ==
>
> He probably expected it to take off like a Blade Runner hovercar.

 Well, IF he was watching a bit of You Tube<g>?Not ALL EV's go like the 
Zoombie!

   Bob,  "Led Sled" Jetta, but it gets me there!Going for groceries EVen Ice 
Cream, later!
>
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev 



------------------------------

Message: 6
Date: Wed, 26 Sep 2007 10:57:42 -0700 (PDT)
From: David Dymaxion <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: [EVDL] GM EV Commercial Heard
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii

I heard a commercial on a major radio station for the GM Volt. It was described 
as an electric car, with a pure electric range up to 40 miles. A little 
disclaimer said something like "Range depends on initial state of charge." I 
loved it, your mileage may vary! The ad also said something about advanced 
batteries. Anyway, I thought it was neat it was promoted as an electric car, 
rather than a hybrid.





       
____________________________________________________________________________________
Yahoo! oneSearch: Finally, mobile search 
that gives answers, not web links. 
http://mobile.yahoo.com/mobileweb/onesearch?refer=1ONXIC

------------------------------

Message: 7
Date: Wed, 26 Sep 2007 14:18:49 -0400
From: "Timothy Balcer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] Poor battery connections
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Message-ID:
        <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1

Thats the trouble with gold though.. it can flow away from contact
points when you have vibrations involved. That's how, for example, the
Tesla guys found out that using gold plated connectors for their leads
in the roadster was a bad idea and rediscovered why automotive
applications use Tin for leads.

I'm sure there is a way to push thousands of amps through gold plated
connectors without suffering this problem. I don't know that it would
be cost effective in an EV.

On 9/26/07, Roy LeMeur <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Tony Hwang wrote:
> >Plain copper crimp connectors, or tin plated copper connectors seem like
> >they'd be better than these brass gold plated connectors. The copper
> >connectors will actually compress, since the copper is soft, and won't this
> >make a better connection?
>
> Gold is soft.
>
> Um... gold doesn't corrode. Ever.
>
> Even at the bottom of the ocean for hundreds of years.
>
>
> Roy
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> More photos; more messages; more whatever. Windows Live Hotmail - NOW with
> 5GB storage.
> http://imagine-windowslive.com/hotmail/?locale=en-us&ocid=TXT_TAGHM_migration_HM_mini_5G_0907
>
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>



------------------------------

Message: 8
Date: Wed, 26 Sep 2007 13:22:32 -0400
From: Jim Coate <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: [EVDL] Portland, OR area races or EVents?
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed

I and my wife are heading to Portland Oregon this weekend for a couple 
of weeks in the area.

Are there any drag races left coming up, or is the season over? Any 
other EVents to know about?

Thanks to earlier suggestions, we will be at the OEVA meeting on Oct 
11th. And I have an e-mail in to John Wayland to see if he has any 
suggestions.


TIA.

PS Replies to this e-mail may not be read... either post a public reply 
or to reach me directly, use the e-mail link found at 
http://www.coate.org/contact_jim/


-- 
Jim Coate
1970's Elec-Trak's
1997 Solectria Force
1998 Chevy S-10 NiMH BEV
1997 Chevy S-10 NGV Bi-Fuel
http://www.eeevee.com



------------------------------

Message: 9
Date: Wed, 26 Sep 2007 13:44:42 -0500
From: "Marty Hewes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [EVDL] LED Taillights - a money saver in gas
        cars?->rangeextenderin EV's? - an analysis PC Power Supply
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
        reply-type=original

I suppose if you raise the voltage, you'd have to reduce the current limit 
to acheive the same maximum wattage?  Maybe not on a PC supply (or any multi 
output supply) since you're not going to use the 3.3V and 5V sections.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "(-Phil-)" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Wednesday, September 26, 2007 11:29 AM
Subject: Re: [EVDL] LED Taillights - a money saver in gas 
cars?->rangeextenderin EV's? - an analysis PC Power Supply


> PC switchmodes almost always have capacitor voltage doublers on the input
> (split rail).  That means they probably need a minimum of 250ish volts to
> start properly (assuming they'll run with Japan-Spec AC).
>
> There are plenty of surplus 12v supplies that are only designed for US 
> spec
> and don't use doublers, so that means they are designed to run at ~150VDC
> but will probably start at around many pack voltages.
>
> Remove the bridge rectifier and AC input filter stages and you have a nice
> DC supply for your EV.
>
> It's usually pretty trivial to adjust a 12v supply up to 14v without too
> much trouble.
>
> -Phil
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Marty Hewes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
> Sent: Wednesday, September 26, 2007 7:47 AM
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] LED Taillights - a money saver in gas
> cars? ->rangeextenderin EV's? - an analysis PC Power Supply
>
>
>> The PC supply I'm looking at here does 25 amps at 12 volts (300 watts),
>> and
>> it's better than average.  I don't know what it would take to raise the
>> voltage, control overcharging, and make it run off of a DC input.  Maybe
>> it
>> could supplement the aux battery, maybe with the addition of some
>> alternator
>> regen during deceleration, to the point a large DC/DC is not required.
>> Might be able to find a 12 volt only "brick" type supply surplus
>> someplace.
>>
>> Marty
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> To: "Electric Vehicle Discussion List" <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
>> Sent: Wednesday, September 26, 2007 8:53 AM
>> Subject: Re: [EVDL] LED Taillights - a money saver in gas cars? -
>> >rangeextenderin EV's? - an analysis PC Power Supply
>>
>>
>>> down from 530 watts to 440 watts...
>>> Now we're talking about "pc power supply" range for $50 bucks, rather
>>> than
>>> expensive $250+ DC/DC converters...
>>> What do you folks think?
>>>
>>> Has anyone used a cheap pc-power supply rather than a DC/DC converter -
>>> to
>>> recharge their 12-volt aux battery?
>>> Do you think it would hold up?
>>>
>>> Ed Cooley
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> "Adrian DeLeon" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>>> Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>> 09/25/2007 23:37
>>> Please respond to
>>> Electric Vehicle Discussion List <ev@lists.sjsu.edu>
>>>
>>>
>>> To
>>> ev@lists.sjsu.edu
>>> cc
>>>
>>> Subject
>>> Re: [EVDL] LED Taillights - a money saver in gas cars? - 
>>>  >rangeextenderin
>>> EV's? - an analysis
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Around and around we go...
>>>
>>> The one big plus for LED lighting is the possibility of using a
>>> smaller/less expensive DC/DC converter.
>>>
>>> Headlight on HI = 130W
>>> Heater fan HI = 250W
>>> Misc 12V = 60W
>>> TOTAL SO FAR = 440W
>>>
>>> 4 marker lights = 5W x 4 = 20W
>>> 4 turn signals = 27W x 4 = 100W (intermittent - can use "peak power" 
>>> from
>>> DC/DC)
>>> 2 brake lights = 27W x 2 = 50W
>>> 2 tail lights = 5W x 2 = 10W
>>> Center brake light = 5W = 2 = 10W
>>> TOTAL LIGHTING = 90W/190W (intermittent)
>>>
>>> So LEDs can reduce your DC/DC requirements from 530W to 450W.
>>>
>>> Adrian
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> For subscription options, see
>>> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> For subscription options, see
>>> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> For subscription options, see
>> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> For subscription options, see
> http://lists.sjsu.edu/mailman/listinfo/ev
>
> 




------------------------------

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EV@lists.sjsu.edu
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