Bruno Marchal wrote: > Hi David, > > > Le 16-août-06, à 02:51, David Nyman a écrit : > > > > > Good to see this. First off some grandmotherly-ish questions: > > > >> 1) The computationalist hypothesis (comp), > >> > >> This is the hypothesis that "I am a digital machine" in the > >> quasi-operational sense that I can survive through an artificial > >> digital body/brain. I make it precise by adding Church thesis and some > >> amount of Arithmetical Realism (without which those terms are > >> ambiguous). > >> To be sure this is what Peter D. Jones called "standard > >> computationallism". > > > > I need to ask you to make this more precise for me. When I say I *am* a > > digital machine, what is my instantiation? IOW, am 'I' just the *idea* > > of a dmc for the purposes of a gedanken experiment, or am I to conceive > > of myself as equivalent to a collection of bits under certain > > operations, instantiated - well, how? > > > Well, for a "comp practitioners", saying "yes to the doctor" is not a > thought experiment. > I will try to explain at some point why we cannot really know what is > our instantiation, and that is why the "yes doctor" needs some act of > faith, and also why comp guaranties the right to say NO to the doctor > (either because you feel he is proposing a substitution level which is > too high, or because you just doubt comp, etc.). Eventually you will > see we have always 2^aleph_zero "instantiations". > >

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Bruno, I noticed that you slipped in "infinity" ("infinite collection of computations") into your roadmap (even the short roadmap). In the "technical" posts, if I remember right, you said that at some point we were leaving the constructionist realm. But are you really talking about infinity? It is easy to slip into invoking infinity and get away with it without being noticed. I think this is because we are used to it in mathematics. In fact, I want to point out that David Nyman skipped over it, perhaps a case in point. But then you brought it up again here with aleph_zero, and 2^aleph_zero, so it seems you are really serious about it. I thought that infinities and singularities are things that physicists have dedicated their lives to trying to purge from the system (so far unsuccessfully ?) in order to approach a "true" theory of everything. Here you are invoking it from the start. No wonder you talk about faith. Even in the realm of pure mathematics, there are those of course who think it is invalid to invoke infinity. Not to try to complicate things, but I'm trying to make a point about how serious a matter this is. Have you heard about the feasible numbers of V. Sazanov, as discussed on the FOM (Foundations Of Mathematics) list? Why couldn't we just have 2^N instantiations or computations, where N is a very large number? Tom --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---