On 30/12/2008, at 9:29 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote:

>
>
>
> Hi Kim,
>
> Still OK to continue? You are ready?


"I am good to go!"


>
>
> Let me sum up so far. I suggest you look at the UDA slide.


Have teleported it to my screen...
>
>
> For those who don't have it, and want follow: it is the PDF slide of
> UDA[1 ... 8] in
>  http://iridia.ulb.ac.be/~marchal/publications/SANE2004MARCHALAbstract.html
>
>
> In Kim 2.1 You agree with MEC =>"I survive" through teleportation. All
> right ? "MEC =>" means "Assuming MEC,"
> It is the UDA step 1 of the slide. "The 1=3" on the right means the
> first and third person points of view (figured by "1" and "2" with
> points) are identical. (cf Kim has gone on Mars).



Yes



>
>
> Kim 2.2 A delay is introduced, with and without "you" knowing the
> protocol. Imagine the reconstitutation machine on Mars did work but
> with a delay of one month. It is a situation where the first person
> experience remains unchanged (same account in the diary) where the
> third person account notice a change: the delay. You agree with this?


Yes. It would be hard to imagine how this would not be the case...



>
> That the first person cannot be aware, without external clues, of the
> presence and length of reconstitution delays? All right?


Except by hindsight, after the event, when I notice (following  
reconst.) that I am one month younger now than my twin sister who is  
already on Mars



>
>
> "Kim 2.3" was done through my reply to Abram. It is the self-
> duplication thought experiment. I want do it as slowly as possible,
> because it is a crucial step. So my first question, and second
> question are:
>
> 1) With a duplication you are scanned and annihilated, and then
> reconstitute in two places at once. For example in two identical room
> A and room B. . Do you agree that (MEC => I survive a duplication) ?


Yes - this follows, given that I am Turing emulable down to the last  
atom of my being; I am a Universal Machine



>
> Put in another way, do you agree that if one survive teleportation,
> then one can be said to survive in such a duplication.


Or polyplication - you could spam every teleportation centre on Mars  
with copies of me. Each one is Kim, but Kim cannot know (before  
teleportation) which copy he will *feel* himself to be - assuming he  
KNOWS you are going to duplicate him and not simply transport him to  
one place (I choose here 3rd person language on purpose; at this point  
I cannot see how the 1 and 3 perspective might differ; I could equally  
have said "each one is me, but I cannot know (before teleportation)  
which copy I will *feel* myself to be - assuming I KNOW you are going  
to duplicate me and not simply transport me to one place.

It seems to me that what I believe is about to happen (based on what  
you tell me before I step into the teleporter) affects how I feel  
(beforehand). If you tell me I am going to two places, my diary will  
surely reflect my uncertainty about which place I will feel I am in  
afterward. It seems to me that you could not (at this or any point)  
tell me which of the two copies I will feel is me either. After the  
teleportation, the 1 and 3 perspectives separate, necessarily. Each  
copy will claim (with perfect validity) that he is Kim - so the 1st  
person uncertainty is clearly symptomatic of the indeterminacy of that  
point of view.



>
>
> ... and 2) suppose that in both rooms I put, .... Hmmm... a glass of
> you favorite whisky (OK?). In both rooms. What do you answer if I ask
> you before that duplication experience, you knowing the protocol,
> "Will you drink alcohol after the duplication?". What would you say  
> say?


I will say "Yes, one of me will drink the whiskey after the  
experiment" - because the one who *feels* he is me will probably need  
a stiff drink after having his atoms annihilated and reconstituted. I  
could probably also, with a little wisdom, surmise that the one I do  
*not* feel I am may - with probability 1/2 - do the same.



>
> 2-variant): Same question with whisky in room A and gin in room B.


Here I would answer that, depending on where I *find myself* following  
the teleportation, I will drink whiskey or I will not, given that gin  
makes me vomit. So, if you are asking me beforehand, I can only answer  
"I do not know at this stage."

I've also printed out your 2004 thesis and am studying that as well. I  
hope I have given the impression that I understand up to here.

cheers,

K





> >


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