2009/8/21 Flammarion <peterdjo...@yahoo.com>:
>
>
>
> On 20 Aug, 00:28, Bruno Marchal <marc...@ulb.ac.be> wrote:
>> On 19 Aug 2009, at 22:21, Flammarion wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> > Where he says computation can happen without any physicial process at
>> > all. I don't see any evidence for that
>>
>> I am explaining this right now.
>>
>> > Only Bruno thinks computation trancends matter.
>>
>> The notion of computation and computability have been discovered by
>> Mathematicians working around the foundation crisis of math after the
>> discovery by Cantor and others of paradoxes in set theory.
>>
>> The idea is that computation should be redefined as physical
>> computation is a very recent one, and is due to people like David
>> Deustch and Landauer. And it does not really work as such. Deutsch
>> "reconstruction" of the Post-Church-Turing thesis is really a
>> different thesis.
>
> Of course you can have theoretical
> truths about computation
>
> But show me something that has been computed by
> an immaterial computer.
>
>> > CTM *implies* materialism, and the MGA doesn't work.
>>
>> CTM is neutral on materialism, even if many materialist use
>> incorrectly comp to put the mind body problem under the rug. UDA,
>> including MGA, shows why this fails.
>>
>> What is in MGA which does not work?
>
> It's a reductio of the idea that mental states
> supervene on computational states.
> CTM must be cast as the claim
> that mental activity supervenes on computational
> activity.

If physicalism is true... in the end it supervenes on physical state
only as for physicalism, computations do not exists unless they are
being instantiated physically.

Also a computation is "implementation" agnostic... how can you explain
that with physicalism and denying any existence to computation ?

Regards,
Quentin


> >
>



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