On 3/9/2011 4:15 PM, 1Z wrote:

On Mar 9, 7:28 pm, Brent Meeker<meeke...@dslextreme.com>  wrote:
On 3/9/2011 8:49 AM, 1Z wrote:

If you have a theory of qualia using primitive matter, and coherent
  with comp, then you should be able to use it to extract a flaw in the
  UD Argument.
Here's one: minds can be computed,  but they only have
real conscious if they run "on the metal" (at the zeroth
level of abstraction). That's not your version of COMP,
but it is adequate for most AI researchers, and for
anybody who wants to be reincarnated in silicon
But how do we know what the zeroth level is?
Then hypothesis that the physical world
is zero level is consistent with the hypothesis
that we are and must be running on the metal.
Many other scenarios are possible. But only
"coherence" was asked for (see above)

What is really meant is
OUR level - the one in which we can give ostensive definitions.  Which
is my point about BIVs.  We can only know them to be conscious insofar
as they can be grounded in our zeroth level.
A BIV that is grounded in our level is no BIV at all. That would
be like a novel consisting entirely of historical facts.

A BIV that is conscious is like a historical novel. A human BIV with input simulating the perceptions of a Drtywxz on planet Uwipjt might possibly be conscious, as a Boltzmann brain might be.


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