On 29 Sep 2011, at 19:09, meekerdb wrote:
On 9/29/2011 12:22 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote:
OK. But this is non communicable by (sound) machines. In fact in
the ethics of the ideally correct machine, asserting moral
principle is immoral. We can only encourage people to understand or
discover this by themselves.
Bruno
Several times you have made moral assertions (like the immoral one
above :-) ), and I have agreed with them. But I don't see how they
follow from the UDA. An objective basis of agreement on ethics and
morals would be a great advance in world peace, so I'm very
interested in how you derive these assertions (which you shouldn't
make).
The ineffable is so much ineffable that even just writing one sentence
on it can only completely miss the point.
In fact, your very question answers it: we are near a diagonal self-
defeating sentence. Those are the fixed point of p <---> ~Bp, and are
of type Dt. So they belong to G* minus G. They obey the laws Bx --> ~x.
And so, if I was a wise guy, I should either shut my mouth, or explain
that "If moral makes sense, then we can't communicate that moral", or
something like that.
Moral is a bet in a better reality, and thus Dt, by completeness, for
Löbian entity talking firs order logic. (~Bf <-> there is a model/
reality). That is another path for justifying that link.
Lao Tseu, Plotinus, etc. All the mystic, capable if being a bit
rationalist knows that they should better NOT talk. That is why the
ideal machine keeps so much silence on the deep question. Thanks to
G*, many no provable proposition (rationally communicable,
justifiable) can be justified by assuming some reflexion principle,
like Dt (Bf -> f), or stronger.
But it is here that the LUMs can easily fall in the pseudo-theological
trap.
Bruno
PS This comes more from AUDA, than UDA. But UDA is enough to explain
that "if we are moral enough then we cannot enforce anyone in
believing that he will survive, or just be satisfied, with an
artificial brain (or even an aspirin). The truth of comp, or aspirin
(btw), is in personal judgement, evaluation and possible (risky)
experiences. That's number life!
http://iridia.ulb.ac.be/~marchal/
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