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________________________________ From: Bruno Marchal <marc...@ulb.ac.be> To: everything-list@googlegroups.com Sent: Thu, February 23, 2012 4:48:10 AM Subject: Re: The free will function On 22 Feb 2012, at 18:17, marty684 wrote: Bruno, > If everything is made of numbers (as in COMP) Nothing is "made of". Everything appears in the mind of Universal numbers relatively to universal numbers, with hopefully reasonable relative statistics. Think about a dream. If you dream that you drink coffee, you can understand that such a "coffee" is not made of anything. The experience of coffee is due to some computation in your brain. With the big picture apparently implied by comp, even the brain is like that dreamed coffee: it is not made of anything. It is only locally made of things due to the infinitely many computations generating your actual state. The "matrix" metaphore, or the Galouye "simulacron" metaphore is not so bad. And we don't need more than the numbers + addition and multiplication to get an initial dreaming immaterial machinery. Thanks for this vivid clarification. But... Read UDA. You might understand that if we are machine (numbers relative to other numbers), then we cannot know which machine we are, nor which computations supports us, among an infinity of them.Everything observable becomes probabilistic. The probability bears on the infinitely many computations going throughyour actual state (that's why they are relative). Why should probability depend on us; on what we 'know or cannot know' ? On what is 'observable' to us? It seems to me that you are defining probability by that which is relative to our 'actual states'. Why can't we inhabit a seemingly probablistic part of an infinite, determined universe ? (If you've been over this before, please refer me to the relevant posts, thanks.) marty a. Read UDA, and ask question for each step, in case of problem, so we might single out the precise point where you don't succeed to grasp why comp put probabilities, or credibilities, uncertainties, in front of everything. UDA1-7 is enough to get this. UDA-8 is needed only for the more subtle immateriality point implied by computationalism. My attempts to read UDA were never successful. Sorry. Bruno http://iridia.ulb.ac.be/~marchal/ -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list?hl=en.