Hi Bruno Marchal 

Before you can arrive at a TOE you need to be
able to define what "everything" means. 
Your responses indicate that "everything" to you
means the world of mechanism. No ?


----- Receiving the following content ----- 
From: Bruno Marchal 
Receiver: everything-list 
Time: 2013-02-05, 11:18:49
Subject: Re: context, comp, and multiverses




On 05 Feb 2013, at 16:44, Roger Clough wrote:


Hi Bruno Marchal 

If comp is assumed, then we need not worry about consequences of emulation,
it's a given that it works.

Then what is the purpose of this discussion ? 


To get a theory of everything. To figure out why and how physical realities 
appears, and what is the nature of consciousness, etc.


My main point is that the lasting Aristotelian picture is not compatible with 
computationalism, and that it is compatible with Plato and the most common 
mystics attempts to figure out what is.


Bruno












----- Receiving the following content ----- 
From: Bruno Marchal 
Receiver: everything-list 
Time: 2013-02-05, 07:32:01
Subject: Re: context, comp, and multiverses


Hi Roger, 


On 04 Feb 2013, at 16:43, Roger Clough wrote:


Hi Brunio,

I agree with Craig. And I've never understood how there can be any consequence 
of an emulation,
or how it can be proven or not that comp works, since no comparison can be made.


If comp is true, then we can explain why we cannot prove it.
But we can refute it, because comp explains the details about what the physical 
reality can be. So to test comp, just compare the physics inferred from the 
emprical reality, and the comp physics.








Without meaning to be insulting, in short, I say, OK, it's Turing emulable. So 
what ?


So the TOE is given by addition and multiplication on the integers, and the 
global internal views of all creatures is given by Plato and Plotinus, not by 
Aristotle and the naturalists. It means that rational theology is wrong since 
the closure of Plato academy. In a nutshell.


Of course you have to study UDA to grasp this.


Bruno








----- Receiving the following content ----- 
From: Telmo Menezes 
Receiver: everything-list 
Time: 2013-02-04, 09:59:09
Subject: Re: context, comp, and multiverses







On Mon, Feb 4, 2013 at 2:31 PM, Craig Weinberg <whatsons...@gmail.com> wrote:



On Sunday, February 3, 2013 12:11:17 PM UTC-5, Bruno Marchal wrote: 


On 01 Feb 2013, at 16:42, Roger Clough wrote:


Hi Bruno Marchal 
I would think that each universe provides its own distinctive
context to any?alculation, including comp. 


Comp is the assumption that we are Turing emulable.
That notion is made very solid by Church's thesis.



I don't think that we can assume that a Turing emulation of us is actually 
"us". To the contrary, a Turing emulation of geometry is not geometry. A Turing 
emulation of water can be the same as a Turing emulation of water in another 
Turing emulated virtual world, but no emulated drop of Turing water can ever be 
a genuine drop of water within the world that we actually live in. It doesn't 
matter that 17 is still prime when you are dying of dehydration.


Hi Craig,


Still trying to understand your theory better. What's your position on the 
following statements:


- The human brain can be Turing emulated.


- There is some (possibly mysterious) link between the physical human brain and 
consciousness.






Craig


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