On Thu, Mar 14, 2013 at 5:32 PM, Craig Weinberg <whatsons...@gmail.com>wrote:

> A wheel is just [...]  a mouse trap does not [...]  it doesn't care about
> [...]  it doesn't matter to [...]
>

This is really getting tedious. Again and again you are decreeing what is
and what is not so but you're not even attempting to give us a reason for
believing it is true except for your word. You're not the Pope and I don't
believe what the Pope says without evidence or rational argument either.

>> As a practical matter both you and I judge that something is conscious
>> in exactly the same way, we look for intelligence.
>>
>
> > No, I would generally look for movement. Breathing.
>

So when I undergo anesthesia I'm conscious  but when Einstein holds his
breath he's not.


> >> ESP parapsychology junk science.
>>
>
> >You must be psychic to know the results of experiments before they are
> even designed.
>

These sort of experiments have been performed ad nauseam for at least 2
centuries and have produced null results, it's time to move on.

> Machines are getting better in some ways, but not in any way that matters
> to anything except human minds.
>

A machine mattered very much to 2 champion human minds who got their ass
beaten on Jeopardy by a certain machine.


> > In your universe, the Free Will noise either exists for a reason or it
> does not.


Obviously

> You don't seem to allow that it could have a reason,
>

Not at all, there might be a reason people believe in free will just as
there is a reason children believe in Santa Claws.

> nor do you allow that the belief in free will could be random
>

Not at all, there might be no reason; but one thing is certain, there is a
reason people believe in "free will" or there is not a reason people
believe in "free will"

> You clearly believe that people intentionally choose their belief in free
> will and that they could and should correct this error by educating
> themselves in a particular way.
>

Maybe, or maybe some people are just hardwired that way.

  John K Clark

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