The Penrose incomputability issue may be reformulated into a fundamental question:
Is the universe a closed system ? Is materialism logically possible ? Can the observer be part of the measurement ? On http://philsci-archive.pitt.edu/4549/2/FinalCH.pdf The issue of whether the universe is a closed system is raised and immediately dismissed: ".1 Extending the Formalism Gell-Mann and Hartle independently developed a consistent history formalism as a transformation of Feynman's sum-over-histories formulation . Quantum cosmology, their concern, requires a quantum mechanical treatment of closed systems. The universe does not admit of an outside observer. " But it seems to me to be impossible to make a measurment if the observer is part of the sytem being measured. Similarly Aristotle long ago pointed out the impossibility of universal causation, for every cause must have a cause, leading to an infinite regression of causes. And so forth. Similarly Consciousness and perception require an observe which is not part of the system, for conscious ness = subject + object. Again,, there is the singularity problem of creation. And the uncomfortable admission that creatiion requires a Creator. r. Roger Clough NIST (ret.) 3/23/2013 "Coincidences are God's way of remaining anonymous." - Albert Einstein -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to email@example.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list?hl=en. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.