On Friday, March 29, 2013 3:43:09 AM UTC-4, Quentin Anciaux wrote: > > > > 2013/3/29 John Clark <johnk...@gmail.com <javascript:>> > >> >> >> On Tue, Mar 26, 2013 at 1:55 PM, meekerdb <meek...@verizon.net<javascript:> >> > wrote: >> >> > I exercise my free will when I make a choice without being coerced. >>> >>> >>> >> If you alter your path to avoid walking face first into a brick wall >>> has the wall coerced you to do so, or more precisely have the photons that >>> entered your eye indicating the presents of the wall caused you to do so? >>> If you wish to jump over a mountain has gravity coerced you to stay where >>> you are? >>> >>> > No, I think coercion is influence by another's will >>> >> >> So if somebody else prevents me from doing what I want then I lack free >> will, >> > > No, you just lack the ability to exercise it. >
Right, or you could say that you have the ability as a private sense, but your ability is frustrated from being realized publicly. Maybe someone else really isn't preventing you from doing what you want, but you just feel insecure and worry that they could. In that case your sensitivity is frustrating your will in a different way, privately undermining it so that the motivation is diminished. Then there's paralysis or locked in syndrome, where your free will could be very strong privately but you have no access to realize the motive affect into motor effect. This, as opposed to being in a coma, where someone could even hold a burning candle under your skin and you will have no sensory affect that feels strong enough alarm you, even though a brain scan shows that you are detecting this painful stimulation. All kinds of variations are common. I brought up the idea of control in another thread - what is self control? What is "letting yourself go"? Why can Val Kilmer let himself go but everything that Val Kilmer's body and brain are made of cannot choose to relax into entropy voluntarily. Craig > >> but if anything else prevents me I still have it; >> > > Same thing, except that even if you would decide freely to pass through a > mountain like it was water you wouldn't be able to, on the contrary if you > wanted freely to do something but someone coerced you not to, the only > thing preventing you from doing it is the other person, not a physicial > impossibility. You can't freely decide that a square is a circle. > > >> thus we are entirely dependent not on ourselves but on other people for >> free will >> > > I know you like showing how smart you are, but reading that just make you > look dumb. > > Quentin > > >> to be meaningful, and on a desert island a man with free will would act >> and feel exactly like a man without free will. >> > Says who? Some men eat coconuts, some try to catch fish, some jump out of a palm tree hoping to end it all. Free will is intentionally favoring some set of sensory preferences and using them to guide your motives. The intention to favor them is already a motive which is private, but as an animal with voluntary control over some of its muscles, i.e. a nervous system embedded in a muscular-skeletal system, so our relatively private intention is amplified into more public facing motives of our body. It's a two level, two stage realization because of the neural nesting, although from the perspective of the total organism (which means longer units of time relative to cellular and molecular time) all of the levels are united and simultaneous. Perceptual relativity hinges on the localization of frequency rates of experience. Craig > >> John K Clark >> >> >> >> >> >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Everything List" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to everything-li...@googlegroups.com <javascript:>. >> To post to this group, send email to everyth...@googlegroups.com<javascript:> >> . >> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list?hl=en. >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out. >> >> >> > > > > -- > All those moments will be lost in time, like tears in rain. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list?hl=en. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/groups/opt_out.
