On Saturday, October 12, 2013, Craig Weinberg wrote:

> On Friday, October 11, 2013 5:37:52 PM UTC-4, stathisp wrote:
>> On Oct 11, 2013, at 8:19 PM, Craig Weinberg <whats...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> On Thursday, October 10, 2013 8:58:30 PM UTC-4, stathisp wrote:
>>> On 9 October 2013 05:25, Craig Weinberg <whats...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> > http://online.wsj.com/article/**SB1000142405270230349250457911**
>>> 5310362925246.html<http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052702303492504579115310362925246.html>
>>> > A lot of what I am always talking about is in there...computers don't
>>> > understand produce because they have no aesthetic sensibility. A
>>> mechanical
>>> > description of a function is not the same thing as participating in an
>>> > experience.
>>> This is effectively a test for consciousness: if the entity can
>>> perform the type of task you postulate requires aesthetic sensibility,
>>> it must have aesthetic sensibility.
>> Not at all. That's exactly the opposite of what I am saying. The failure
>> of digital mechanism to interface with aesthetic presence is not testable
>> unless you yourself become a digital mechanism. There can never be a test
>> of aesthetic sensibility because testing is by definition anesthetic. To
>> test is to measure into a system of universal representation. Measurement
>> is the removal of presence for the purpose of distribution as symbol. I can
>> draw a picture of a robot correctly identifying a vegetable, but that
>> doesn't mean that the drawing of the robot is doing anything. I can make a
>> movie of the robot cartoon, or a sculpture, or an animated sculpture that
>> has a sensor for iodine or magnesium which can be correlated to a higher
>> probability of a particular vegetable, but that doesn't change anything at
>> all. There is still no robot except in our experience and our expectations
>> of its experience. The robot is not even a zombie, it is a puppet playing
>> back recordings of our thoughts in a clever way.
>> OK, so it would prove nothing to you if the supermarket computers did a
>> better job than the checkout chicks. Why then did you cite this article?
> Because the article is consistent with my view that there is a fundamental
> difference between quantitative tasks and aesthetic awareness. If there
> were no difference, then I would expect that the problems that supermarket
> computers would have would not be related to its unconsciousness, but to
> unreliability or even willfulness developing. Why isn't the story
> "Automated cashiers have begun throwing temper tantrums at some locations
> which are contagious to certain smart phones that now become upset in
> sympathy...we had anticipated this, but not so soon, yadda yadda"? I think
> it's pretty clear why. For the same reason that all machines will always
> fall short of authentic personality and sensitivity.

So you would just say that computers lack authentic personality and
sensitivity, no matter what they did.

Stathis Papaioannou

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