On 10/20/2013 12:09 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote:


On 20 Oct 2013, at 02:20, Russell Standish wrote:

On Sat, Oct 19, 2013 at 04:37:31PM -0700, Craig Weinberg wrote:


On Saturday, October 19, 2013 6:22:05 PM UTC-4, Russell Standish wrote:

On Sat, Oct 19, 2013 at 03:06:00PM -0700, Craig Weinberg wrote:
Isn't a corporation a Turing emulable machine though? It seems like its
just a matter of properly configuring a corporation's functions to tap
into
the arithmetic truths of self-reference, and then it would have to be a
person...unless you believe in zombies.


Not all Turing machines are people.


I didn't want to imply they were. That was my intent in saying that they
need only be configured properly to become persons.

That is only known to be possible if they are universal machines. It
seems unlikely to me that corporations are universal machines.


Certainly not in any interesting sense. I agree.

Of course universality is cheap, and some corporation might be able to emulate addition and multiplication, but this makes it trivially universal, in a way not related to what the corporation is created for, so you are right (or wrong but in a non relevant sense for the decision to make it into a person).

To avoid this, we might declare a universal machine to be a person only when it is Löbian. This is a bit conventional (and annoying for the lower invertebrates. An insect would not be a person, but a spider would still do, for example).

ISTM that according to your definitions a corporation is a person. It bears the same relation to its employees and officers that a person does to neurons. It's just a person made of different stuff.

Brent
"If corporations are persons then they should be subject to the death penalty."
    --- Terence Geohagan

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