You are making this too complicated. We have living examples every year when 
the power drops due to too, hot, too cold. Let's use Paris where this has 
occurred over the last 10 years at least twice. The heat comes in from North 
Africa, a blocking high happens over northern Europe, and the heat sinks in. 
France's reactors go on full, and there's still not enough air conditioning to 
cool people. Elders die first, then the very young, and there were thousands 
dead if I recall right. The same thing happens when winter sets in, peoples 
power lines drop from ice, heat goes out, people die, first the elderly, then 
the infants. In 2001 Los Angeles, but their economics ordered the price to stay 
low on Nat Gas, the suppliers said F-O, and there were rolling blackouts and 
brownouts in LA. 

My fear. Chris, installs some solar panels and wind farms, it covers 23% of 
total electrical production. Chris. order the filthy dirty fascist polluting 
power sources to go cold. There are rolling blackouts and brownouts. In 
December, a big winter storm hits. First oldsters, then babies, people complain 
a little. Chris responds, "Look, people die all the time. At least a lot fewer 
people will die now of pollution caused disease, our climate will start to 
heal, we can move, now, slowly, painfully, to a clean energy future. Sacrifices 
must be made if the human species is to survive. Onward to a better brighter 
future!"  

So name your poison, climate collapse or social disintegration due to a energy 
starvation? 

-----Original Message-----
From: Chris de Morsella <cdemorse...@yahoo.com>
To: everything-list <everything-list@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Sun, Nov 10, 2013 8:10 pm
Subject: RE: Our Demon-Haunted World



 
 
From: everything-list@googlegroups.com 
[mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of spudboy...@aol.com
Sent: Sunday, November 10, 2013 4:24 PM
To: everything-list@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Our Demon-Haunted World
 

>>Cool, I didn't bother to look it up, but rather remembered San Onofre. 
>>Whatever you want for solar, and if  it cannot supply replacement electricity 
>>sufficiently, and you still shutdown the dirty sources, anyway, people will 
>>die.
 
Explain exactly how people will die? Curious to see how your thinking works to 
make you state this as if it were a fact.
 

-----Original Message-----
From: Chris de Morsella <cdemorse...@yahoo.com>
To: everything-list <everything-list@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Sun, Nov 10, 2013 2:21 pm
Subject: RE: Our Demon-Haunted World


 

 

From: everything-list@googlegroups.com 
[mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of spudboy...@aol.com
Sent: Sunday, November 10, 2013 11:08 AM
To: everything-list@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Our Demon-Haunted World

 


One example might be the San Onofre plant in California, near San Diego. It's a 
uranium burner, and supplies 90% of the electricity, about 85% of the time. But 
let us look at your sun and wind power contribution that you mentioned before. 
40 GW, which I am assuming, is GW's per kilowatt hour, rather than a day, a 
week, etc? Lets say, its not inconsiderable (40 x 1000 MW plants) but its also 
not reliable when the sun don't shine, the winds don't blow. Do you expect 
these clean sources to fully replace the dirty one's in ten years, twenty 
years, five years, thirty? When can we turn of these poisonous electricity 
sources that we have come to rely on? Do you advocate shutting these suckers 
down, before the solar and wind supplied power is fully, implemented? 

 

The San Onofre nuclear power plant has been decommissioned – it is past its 
service life and now many more billions of dollars are going to be need to be 
spent over decades of time in order to decommission this facility – (it was 
very intelligently sited on an earthquake fault line by the way) Cost estimates 
for permanently closing and decommissioning San Onofre are over $4 billion. 

“The plant's first unit, Unit 1, operated from 1968 to 1992.[5] Unit 2 was 
started in 1983 and Unit 3 started in 1984. Upgrades designed to last 20 years 
were made to the reactor units in 2009 and 2010; however, both reactors had to 
be shut down in January 2012 due to premature wear found on over 3,000 tubes in 
the recently replaced steam generators.” 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/San_Onofre_Nuclear_Generating_Station

The actual answer to your question then is that the San Onofre power plants are 
supplying 0% of the San Diego electric energy market with electric power.  You 
might want to pick a better example to make your case. LOL

 

 


-----Original Message-----
From: Chris de Morsella <cdemorse...@yahoo.com>
To: everything-list <everything-list@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Sun, Nov 10, 2013 1:51 pm
Subject: RE: Our Demon-Haunted World



Name me one large city that gets its power 100% exclusively from coal or from 
nuclear? You can’t because all major energy markets are fed by a mix of energy 
generation capacity. Yet you keep on with this straw man argument. Why?


 


From: everything-list@googlegroups.com 
[mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of spudboy...@aol.com
Sent: Sunday, November 10, 2013 10:14 AM
To: everything-list@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Our Demon-Haunted World


 



I would say you are incorrect concerning cities which rely on one primary power 
source, especially, if its local or regional. Power by wire, is common 
practice, but first we must have sufficient spinning, or ready reserve. My 
objection is now the source of power, but if it produce enough power at an 
affordable cost? Your solar and wind may, 17 years from now, do the job that 
gas turbines, or nukes, or coal, or hydroelectric does right now. Right now, 
today 40 GW (is that Gigawatt hours or days?) is no more then a trifling amount 
of what is needed by the human species. I object to governments switching off 
power, when no sufficient substitute now exists. Many greens are fine with 
rolling blackouts and brownouts because at least whatever power is produced is 
environmentally benign. I suspect that when people start doing a die-off, the 
Greens will state: "Oh, then would've died anyway from pollution, 
contamination, and a ruined environment.."



-----Original Message-----
From: meekerdb <meeke...@verizon.net>
To: everything-list <everything-list@googlegroups.com>
Sent: Sat, Nov 9, 2013 11:44 pm
Subject: Re: Our Demon-Haunted World




On 11/9/2013 4:53 PM, spudboy...@aol.com wrote:



Your basically saying I am wrong for no contestable reason, you have no city in 
the world to cite to me that is powered by solar power or wind, for that 
matter, 




And there are none powered exclusively by hydroelectric power either.  It's a 
completely specious critereon that you cite as though it meant something.  
Because B cannot now completely satisfy all demand for X currently supplied by 
A doesn't make B useless, nor does it make A desirable or necessary.

Brent



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