Bruno.
Thanks for your measured style and your gentle responses, as always.

But the prevention principle, that has been incorporated to the French
Constitution a few years ago, has disastrous consequences. We have only one
planet. But we have only one France. And we have only one life. And we have
many young people, but all and veryone are unique. By the principle of
prevention, the slightest hint that some activity can be dangerous for such
a long list of things and a lot more,  then this activity should be stopped
or severely regulated by adequately paid bureaucrats.

 Who decide what and how to regulate? Response: the enlightened ones.  Not
the scientists, but the ones aware of COMP 1p and 3p.

Comrades, the future is ours.
And meekerdb after a two days course about 1p-3p, could join the
avant-garde of the COMP manifesto. for the well being for all the planet!


2013/11/13 Bruno Marchal <marc...@ulb.ac.be>

>
> On 12 Nov 2013, at 22:47, spudboy...@aol.com wrote:
>
>  Indeed. I look at things a bit different, perhaps. then yourself. I see
> it, us, as being set against obliteration versus existence.
>
>
> It is never between obliteration and existence, it is always between good
> quality of life and bad quality of life.
>
> I realize that the ASSA/RSSA discussion is, after all, related to the
> global warming politics, after all. But not a the decision theoretic level
> (which is 1p, making things complex there).
>
> If people have to understand comp to have the right common sense politics,
> then we are doomed!
>
> No worry, that's not entirely the case.
>
> Ironically, those NOT understanding comp (like Brent) are correct on the
> political decision (manage better the CO2 emission). That's correct, for an
> invalid reason, ...
>
> Bruno
>
>
>
>
>
> Mitch
>   -----Original Message-----
> From: Alberto G. Corona <agocor...@gmail.com>
> To: everything-list <everything-list@googlegroups.com>
> Sent: Tue, Nov 12, 2013 3:12 pm
> Subject: Re: Our Demon-Haunted World
>
>  Thus said, because there are eternal laws, there are eternal truths. For
> the materialists, Konrad Lorenz said something extraordinarily profound
> that connect two universes of knowledge: The Kantian apriori of knowledge
> have been inserted in our brain/mind/soul by evolution in the form of
> intuitions, processing of the senses  and other instinctive elements
> without which not only knowledge but existence would be impossible.  They
> are US in a literal sense.
>
>  That means that the eternal truths are around us, but primarily also  in
> ourselves, in this instinctive knowledge gained trough evolution, about
> ourselves, about others and about the world. It includes from the very
> basic: the perception of space and time, that Roger talk about from time to
> time, to  the commons sense to the the highest truths about what is good
> and what is bad.
>
>
> 2013/11/12 <spudboy...@aol.com>
>
>>  I agree and understand, Alberto, with your elegy.
>>
>> Mitch
>>   -----Original Message-----
>> From: Alberto G. Corona <agocor...@gmail.com>
>> To: everything-list <everything-list@googlegroups.com>
>> Sent: Tue, Nov 12, 2013 6:42 am
>> Subject: Re: Our Demon-Haunted World
>>
>>  To spudboy:
>>
>>  Reason alone does`n move to anything, not even to knowledge. If you
>> think that your passions are bad for looking for the truth, you are wrong.
>> What you must say is that some passions are an obstacle for other higher
>> passions, for example the passion of using the reason to reach the truth.
>>
>>  But truth is ever constitutionally instrumental, it is ever passional,
>> because the ultimate arbiter  of truth in the most deep of our mind (brain
>> if you like) is a switch that is activated by different stimulus that are
>> unavoidably passional, because that is in our own nature, architecture of
>> the mind, or whathever you may call it, in the light of experience,
>> philosophy or evolutionary science, the ultimate legitimizer of truth is
>> passional.
>>
>>  Or in physico-mathematical terms, truth is whathever that maintain us,
>> and ours away from entropic obliteration,
>>
>>
>> 2013/11/12 Bruno Marchal <marc...@ulb.ac.be>
>>
>>>
>>>  On 12 Nov 2013, at 06:23, Chris de Morsella wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>  *From:* everything-list@googlegroups.com [
>>> mailto:everything-list@googlegroups.com<everything-list@googlegroups.com>
>>> ] *On Behalf Of *Bruno Marchal
>>> *Sent:* Monday, November 11, 2013 7:43 PM
>>> *To:* everything-list@googlegroups.com
>>> *Subject:* Re: Our Demon-Haunted World
>>>
>>>
>>>   On 11 Nov 2013, at 18:49, spudboy...@aol.com wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>  A Grand Council of Truth?
>>>
>>>
>>>  >>Certainly not. Honesty is not "knowing truth". It is just being able
>>> to correct oneself when being shown wrong. It is very simple, if they were
>>> not jealousy, vanity, pride, and things like that.
>>>
>>> Good point… but we are wrapped up in these other emotions and often
>>> driven by them, some more than others for sure, but all of us – if we are
>>> honest with ourselves -- to some degree on some occasions (no shame & no
>>> blame) We are so wrapped up in all of this that it drives us to hotly deny
>>> that anything of the sort could possibly be so; we cannot even begin
>>> admitting to it. Naturally there is a whole range of personality types
>>> along the spectrum; perhaps some humans have transcended it all… they say
>>> Buddha did, but the rest of us to one degree or another suffer from our own
>>> blind failings.
>>> It is a struggle within sometimes to not fall into these all too easy to
>>> fall into habits and their blind unthinking way of supplying the mind with
>>> readymade answers. This very quick, but unthinking mechanism makes sense in
>>> a field survival situation, where there is no time for thought to slow down
>>> response. Just some cardinal trigger and there is an immediate
>>> amplification of the signal in the brain and an immediate zoom to the fore
>>> of our minds. Often, especially in situations, such as can develop on
>>> internet discussion groups, primitive instincts take over – I have seen it,
>>> so have you, so has everyone here. Passion can drive instinctive behavioral
>>> modes to the fore. Re-learning the inner being living inside the mind is
>>> rather much a lifelong pursuit – for after all we are a moving target, and
>>> if we do not keep a certain vigilance we all risk falling into habitual
>>> modes of mind.
>>>
>>>
>>>  You are right. I think that biological evolution oscillates all the
>>> time between the selfishness (the self and his/her passions) and
>>> cooperation (long term sensible and reasonable action). This comes from the
>>> tension between the 1p and the 3p (Bp & p and Bp). It is very complex, and
>>> related to the paradox of theology: If everything is solved, we can as well
>>> kill ourself. There is no simple solution, and more than one life is not
>>> enough. The correct contemplation-level is hard to grasp. But Buddha got it
>>> ... allegedly.
>>>
>>>  Bruno
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>   And, you already know where I am going with this. One night, while
>>> dining at a restaurant, a good one, the High Reasoner, meets with an old
>>> friend to discuss the new FIFA rules issued for the World Cup. The friend
>>> slides over a closed sports magazine. "Have a look at this article in the
>>> middle, here." Inside the magazine is a rather thick envelope.
>>>  -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Bruno Marchal <marc...@ulb.ac.be>
>>> To: everything-list <everything-list@googlegroups.com>
>>> Sent: Mon, Nov 11, 2013 3:06 am
>>> Subject: Re: Our Demon-Haunted World
>>>
>>>   On 11 Nov 2013, at 01:27, spudboy...@aol.com wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>  Ok, but this is a technique for priming the intellectual pump. If it
>>> produces nothing good, nothing powerful, then this method would be a
>>> complete failure.
>>>
>>>  It seems to me that this works very well, as long as the society is
>>> below some level of corruption, in which case you can be misinfoirmed, and
>>> by not knowing it and being honest, you spread the lies and this leads to
>>> problem soon or later. Problems comes from the liars, but also from the
>>> people who have been lied. It is very often hard to delineate them.
>>>
>>>  Bruno
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>   -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Bruno Marchal <marc...@ulb.ac.be>
>>> To: everything-list <everything-list@googlegroups.com>
>>> Sent: Sun, Nov 10, 2013 2:49 pm
>>> Subject: Re: Our Demon-Haunted World
>>>
>>>   On 09 Nov 2013, at 19:09, spudboy...@aol.com wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>  I am emphasizing having governments print out (Keynes style)
>>> absolutely, colossal, amounts of cash, as a reward for coming up with
>>> excellent disease treatments and cures, human solar system tours, and clean
>>> energy solution, environmental remediation. If the banks won't fund
>>> researchers, then private equity will, if private equity won't then a
>>> million contributors-open source-will, provided they get a cut of the
>>> reward offered by a government prize. I wouldn't be shocked if you,
>>> Professor, Marchal, might summon up 25 ECU's in exchange for receiving 3000
>>> ECU's or Golden Yuans, in payment, 5 years later.
>>>
>>>
>>>  Only if this reflects some honest contracts.
>>>
>>>  Honesty is not just "moral", it is something which elevates a lot the
>>> real value of money. It generates trust.
>>>
>>>  Be honest.
>>>  If you don't try to be honest for the calm of your conscience, do it
>>> for the wealth of your children.
>>>
>>>  Today big corporations are based on lies. That's the problem.
>>>
>>>  Bruno
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>    http://iridia.ulb.ac.be/~marchal/
>>>
>>>
>>>
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>>>   http://iridia.ulb.ac.be/~marchal/
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>>>   http://iridia.ulb.ac.be/~marchal/
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>>
>>
>>
>>  --
>> Alberto.
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>
>
>  --
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>  http://iridia.ulb.ac.be/~marchal/
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>
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-- 
Alberto.

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