On 12 Nov 2013, at 18:19, meekerdb wrote:

On 11/12/2013 2:50 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote:

On 12 Nov 2013, at 04:35, LizR wrote:

On 12 November 2013 16:03, meekerdb <meeke...@verizon.net> wrote:
On 11/11/2013 6:38 PM, LizR wrote:

Benjamin Button lived his life in reverse.

Oh, right, like the guy in Martin Amis' "Time's Arrow" (itself a rip off from "An Age" by Brian Aldiss). Presumably according to QTI he's at the end of an infinite future lifetime, or whatever? But since he's unphysical I guess we can say what we like about him.

"The Curious Case of Benjamin Button" was by F. Scott Fitzgerald (1922).

Oh well, he gets precedence, then. But in any case I don't see any particular relevance, probably that's my fault...
So I'll ask you the same thing I asked Quentin, what's you inference from the fact you, and every body you've ever heard of died before reaching age 150?

My normal inference is that everyone dies. Apparently the QTI throws doubt on this by pointing out that we have only sampled an infinitesimal proportion of the available branches of the multiverse, and that in another infinitesimal portion there might be people who live forever (somehow).
But doesn't QTI imply that everybody is immortal, as Jason infers. Did you read "Divided by Inifinity" yet?

Yes it does, but only in infinitesimal slivers of the multiverse, which is what I was trying to say in my roundabout way.

If you die in the vast majority of the histories, you will still survive with a probability one in the 1p-view, even if that happens in infinitesimal portion of the computations.

That reads like something John Clark would write: if you see Washington the probability you are the guy who sees Washington is 1. No uncertainty there. Sounds like a misuse of the concept of probability to me.

I agree so much with you, but I am not saying Clarks useless tautology.

I am saying that IF you are in Helsinki, and if you are duplicated in W and in M, but that for some reason the reconstitution failed in W (and kill you instantaneously), then the probability has been renormalized, and a posteriori we have that in Helsinki, P(M) = 1.

This is capital to understand the comp immortality.

The probability is not P("I survive") = 1/2, because we abstract from the world where you die, as they can't be part of any first person experience.






The logic G says that all worlds access a cul-de-sac world, but the logic of probability (Bp & Dt) abstracts from all cul-de-sac world.

What does "abstracts from" mean?  "ignore"?  "condition on"?

Ah! Excellent question. I get stuck for ten years on that one. I would have answered "condition on", and I was pretty sure that the modal nuance was Bp I Dt. With "I" being some conditionalisation. But the math does not work for the conditionalisation I found until I eventually realized that the simpler conjunction Bp & Dt works. So "ignore" might be a better terming, or "conjunct with the condition that".

I have to go now. I might comment your other remarks later.

We are close to a very difficult question. You are in Helsinki, the first january, where (and when) you will be duplicated in the usual way in W and M, and you (all of you's) are supposed to stay for more than one month. But in M you get a cold and die, after one week from a pneumonia. Assuming you know that in advance, and are still willing to do the experience, - what is the probability you will find yourself in W the second day of january? -what is the probability you will find yourself in W at the last day of january?

Comp allows different answer to this. It does not change the theology, nor the physics, but it does change possible terrestrial use of comp. It might inspired different ... politics.


Bruno






Brent

If you are not reconstituted in Moscow, in the WM-duplication,, then P(Washington) = 1.

What the comp-immortality looks like is hard to evaluate, because we don't know how to evaluate the probabilities when amnesia, and backtracking, are allowed. Comp remains consistent with different beliefs on this, and that will lead to quite different comp "religions".

Bruno




No I skimmed it, but I hope / think I get the point. Is there anything else I should be taking from it apart from "this is what quantum immortality might look like, assuming a nearby gamma ray burst and so on" ?
What is your inference from the fact that everywhere you've ever travelled has been on or near the surface of a congenial planet supplied with air, water and all the necessities of life?
That I'm the product of evolution on this planet.

Right, you're here in an extremely unlikely situation if you take random samples from the universe. I was trying to draw a parallel here, if I can just remember what it was...



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