On 10 Jan 2014, at 16:23, Jason Resch wrote:

Liz,

I think Edgar's computational reality can be consistent with the computational theory of mind if you somehow constrain reality to be small and finite.

OK.



The moment you let the universe be very big (eternal inflation) then you also get an infinite number of computers built by aliens in distant galaxies, any of which might be simulating you, and the same consequences Bruno points out apply.

OK. But the universe might need to be robust too, which, in passing, I am not sure our local cosmos can be, even if infinite, unless there is really infinite room at the bottom, which I doubt. The UD has toe become unboundedly large ...



My question to Edgar is why do you believe reality is finite? This seems to contradict a number of current scientific theories.

Also, when do you believe reality was created? And how do you explain it's origins?

Good questions.

Bruno




Jason

On Jan 9, 2014, at 10:35 PM, LizR <lizj...@gmail.com> wrote:

On 10 January 2014 17:19, meekerdb <meeke...@verizon.net> wrote:
On 1/9/2014 7:07 PM, Edgar L. Owen wrote:
No Liz, I told you what it IS. It's the happening in computational space that enables computations to take place since something has to move for computations to occur. All it DOES is provide the processor cycle for computations.

You seem to be nit picking...

Edgar

On Thursday, January 9, 2014 9:56:19 PM UTC-5, Liz R wrote:
No you spent them telling me what it does. I'd like to know what it is.


On 10 January 2014 15:54, Edgar L. Owen <edga...@att.net> wrote:
Common Liz, I just spent the last number of posts telling you and Stephen what it is... Don't make me repeat myself...

I don't know why there is this concern about Edgar's computations. It's seems very much like Bruno's, except Bruno's Universal computer is running all possible programs (by dovetailing). The time that appears on clocks is a computed ordering relation which is conjugate to the conserved quantity called "energy".

Bruno's dovetailer is supposedly running (if that's the word) in an abstract space, while Edgar's processor units are, as far as one can tell, intended to be in some sense physical. It's clear what Bruno's ontology is based on, he makes it explicit in his axioms. It isn't clear what Edgar's ontology is based on - he seems to be assuming that time and some form of computation are fundamental properties of the universe, but not what those computers are running on (by Turing equivalence, I assume they COULD be running on a desktop PC in some other universe) or what his "universal present moment" consists of - is it a linear dimensio, say? But then it appears to be quantised, since it only supports discrete computational steps. Can time be quantised? What are the implications? Do things like the Landauer limit come into his theory?

The concern is, I suspect, due to...

a) a lack of rigour, either logical or mathematical, in describing the theory b) a lack of testable results, or indications of how one gets from the theory to the observed reality
c) a bad attitude



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