On Thu, May 8, 2014 at 2:57 PM, Alberto G. Corona <agocor...@gmail.com>wrote:
> Any theory that stand over non intelligent axioms has to accept an > infinity of multiverses, That may be refined, taking into account > information=0 etc, but I will not go further on that. > I would say that the anthropic principle allows for a "dumb" multiverse where all the universes where you can actually exists contain the illusion of intelligent design. > > That multiverse must include among other things the universes with gods , > and the universes with goods that have miracles, and the universes with > gods that have miracles whose first miracle is the creation of the universe > by the god. > I am not so sure of this. An infinity of universes does not imply that there is a universe for which something is possible. You can have infinite variations within certain constraints. For example: you can have the infinite set of all the possible combinations of english characters and never see a chinese character. It depends on the generative rule. I'm not sure, for example, that a universal dove tailer produces all conceivable universes -- to use a simple trick, it cannot produce a universe that was not generated by computation. I would say that the MWI necessarily implies the existence of worlds where deities appear to exist, but with two caveats: - the probability of finding yourself in such a world is tremendously small; - the deity is not stable, even if you find yourself in such a world, with very high probability the deity will fail in the next instant. I say this because the MWI assumes the wave equation, so the generative rule already limits what's possible, even at infinity. Is there some flaw in my reasoning? > > > And what if certain kinds of miracles are one more among the many > preconditions for a universe with intelligent beings for some reason that > we still don´t know? > That could be the case, but then they are not miracles. They are just laws of reality that we don't know about yet. > In this -single universe- context, the fine tuning of the physical > constants are miracles by the way, so the hypothesis is true. > I tend to agree. This is why I reject the single universe -- it's an extraordinary claim with no evidences. > The multiverse is the hypothesis neccessary in order to rule out the > miracle. What more -single universe- miracles that we still don´t know are > necessary for intelligent sentient human life? > Ruling out miracles is just an optimistic attitude: we assume that we can understand. There's no way to prove this, it's just an attitude towards knowledge. If we don't have this attitude, the alternative is to give up. Given that his attitude gave us modern medicine, electricity and so on (the so on includes the fact that we can have this debate at a distance), there are utilitarian reasons to adopt it, if nothing else. > > Yet the mere existence of intelligence in this universe and the easily > acceptable hypothesis by naturalists that after some time we will be > capable to create or emulate worlds with simulated living beings or robots > in this universe that probably by the laws of robotics (Asimov et al) have > to virtually worship us in order to create or be part of an self > sustainable society... > Why would they have to worship us? I don't see how that follows. > > This assumible hypothesis means, by the multiverse assumption that this > has already happened somewhere somehow. And very well we may be, here and > now, the product of it. > Sure. I am fairly convinced that we already live inside such a simulation. That just means that the structure of the multi-verse is a fractal. Not so surprising, but fun to think about. Telmo. > > > > > 2014-05-08 13:36 GMT+02:00 spudboy100 via Everything List < > everything-list@googlegroups.com>: > > What if God is a Boltzmann Brain? He is likely not, but what they heck, >> it's a shot at looking at the issue from another angle. Another thought, is >> thing of the Big Mind (shrug) as doing the multiverse using the Schrodinger >> universal wave function, and allow me to use hugh evertt the 3rd's >> interpretation, ok? This is a ultra-gigantic amount of cosmii to initiate >> biology inside of, a thankless task, that would poop anyone out >> (anthropomorphism here) even God. Let's not cling frantically to >> what Aquinas thought about God. Atheist Shmatheist. By the way your graphic >> or whatever couldn't appear on this boys email. >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: LizR <lizj...@gmail.com> >> To: everything-list <everything-list@googlegroups.com> >> Sent: Thu, May 8, 2014 1:09 am >> Subject: God is an atheist! >> >> >> >> As hopefully the above will demonstrate, if I managed to upload the >> picture... >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Everything List" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >> To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. >> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Everything List" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. >> To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. >> Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. >> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. >> > > > > -- > Alberto. > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. > To post to this group, send email to everything-list@googlegroups.com. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. 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