On Sun, Nov 16, 2014 at 6:31 AM, Bruno Marchal <[email protected]> wrote:
> > On 15 Nov 2014, at 17:02, John Clark wrote: > > On Fri, Nov 14, 2014 at 4:54 PM, Richard Ruquist <[email protected]> > wrote: > > > Along these lines of thought, the universe splitting or differentiation >> in MWI is said to be irreversible >> even though the equation of QM are time reversible. >> > > The Many Worlds split is not necessarily irreversible, but like > thermodynamics it usually is. When the electron approaches the 2 slits the > universe splits, but when it hits the photographic plate (or just a brick > wall) the split is reversed; of course that is not a typical situation, it > was specifically set up by experimenters to be as simple as possible, in > most situations they never recombine because so many things would have to > conspire together it would be astronomically unlikely. > > > That might account for the arrow of time. >> > > You don't need Many Worlds or even Quantum Mechanics to explain the arrow > of time, all you need is for things to start out in a low entropy state and > the fact that there are VASTLY more ways to be disorganized than organized. > > > Of course wave collapse is also irreversible and is similar to MWI to >> that extent. >> > > You keep talking as if the quantum wave function is a real physical thing > rather than just a calculating device like the lines of longitude and > latitude, but Quantum Mechanics can get along just fine without > Schrodinger's Wave Equation. > > > Latitudes and longitudes do not interfere. > > > > In fact about 9 months BEFORE Schrodinger came out with his wave equation > Heisenberg had his own version of Quantum Mechanics that had nothing to do > with waves. In fact Heisenberg despised the Schrodinger Wave Equation > because he felt that "a good theory must be based on directly observable > magnitudes". And nobody can observe a quantum wave function. > > > Heisenberg was influenced by the positivism of the time (The Vienna > circles, the young Wittgenstein, etc.). That was very bad philosophy, and > we can say that is is virtually abandoned. Positivism is easily shown > self-defeating or just an instrumentalism which abandon fundamental > research. > > > > > If you measure what a particle is doing at point X Heisenberg could use > matrix algebra to tell you what measurements you are likely to get at point > Y, and he could do it all without using a unobservable wave, he only used > measured quantities . Heisenberg's original formulation of Quantum > Mechanics works just as well as Schrodinger and his Wave Equation, they are > equivalent, and which one you use is strictly a matter of taste. > > The only advantage Schrodinger had is that it allowed human beings to form > a mental picture of what is going on, but Heisenberg felt that the mental > picture was wrong and the quantum world was so strange that none was any > better, so it would be best to just forget about visualization and only > worry about what you can measure. Everett disagreed and thought that > mental pictures were important but agreed that Schrodinger's was wrong, > however he believed that he had found a better one and so do I. > > > ? he agreed that Schroedinger was wrong when saying that he was sure that > the cat is definitely alive or dead. But Everett agrees with schroedinger > equation, and picture. But Deutsch and Hayden argues that the many-world > picture, and its locality, are more simply explained in the Heisenberg > picture. Those are different formalism for the same theory (as long as we > don't introduce the collapse, which is just a magical trick to eliminate > the "parallel realities". of course, with computationalism, the "other > realities" exists like numbers, so it is just dishonest to make abstraction > of them, without making precise some selection principle (and the UDA shows > that such a selection principle is contradictory with the computationalist > assumption). > Sorry to be disagreeable but many many-world adherents still claim the total energy in the multiverse is conserved and if so wave collapse is necessary from quantum mechanics of particle energy conservation. That it preserves a single world universe is a by product. > > Bruno > > > > > > John K Clark > > > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > > > http://iridia.ulb.ac.be/~marchal/ > > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. > Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout. > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. 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