It occurred to me a case of hard emergence. The outcome of a quantum 
measurement is such. I have iterated how I think this is connected to 
self-reference, so I will not repeat that here. However, the outcome is 
completely random and has no causal basis. It emerges for no particular 
reason, such as initial conditions, and is as I see it a complete hard 


On Friday, February 9, 2018 at 1:16:58 PM UTC-6, John Clark wrote:
> On Fri, Feb 9, 2018 at 6:28 AM, Bruno Marchal < 
> <javascript:>> wrote:
> ​> ​
>> You might try to give at least one example of hard emergence
> ​
> One molecule of water can't be wet but 6.02*10^ 23 molecules can be. And 
> H2O at 31 degrees F has none of the properties of a liquid but at 33 
> degrees F those same molecules have all the properties of a liquid; 
> although usually emergent properties don't appear as
> ​ ​
> suddenly as that, it is more smooth and continuous. Day is very different 
> from night but there isn't an exact point where one turns into the other. 
> There is nothing mysterious 
> ​or​
>  miraculous going on its just that human language puts concepts into 
> groups called "words" but the real world is messy
> ​ ​
> so
> ​ ​
> there are often intermediate
> ​ ​
> cases where its not clear what the correct word should be; an
> ​ ​
> 80 pound man is clearly thin
> ​​
> and a 800 pound man is clearly fat but there are values between those 
> extremes where reasonable people can differ on what the correct word should 
> be.  
> ​ ​
> John K Clark 

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