> On 11 Feb 2019, at 00:34, Philip Thrift <cloudver...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > > Two recent books: > > The First Minds: Caterpillars, Karyotes, and Consciousness > Arthur S. Reber > https://books.google.com/books/about/The_First_Minds.html?id=RBLEugEACAAJ > > Brain-Mind: From Neurons to Consciousness and Creativity > Paul Thagard > https://books.google.com/books/about/Brain_Mind.html?id=jJjHvAEACAAJ > > via > When Did Consciousness Begin? > Paul Thagard > https://www.psychologytoday.com/intl/blog/hot-thought/201901/when-did-consciousness-begin
I compare with the theology of the computationalist Universal Turing machine’s theology. (So I do the blasphemy some times, and it is important that keep in mind the necessary interrogation point). I have not look at the answer of others, to test this later …). Consciousness is just the “instinctive” or “automated” belief/anticipation concerning a possible reality. > > Thagard's 10 hypotheses: > > 1. Consciousness has always existed, because God is conscious and eternal. Consciousness has always existed, because all universal machine/number are conscious and “eternal” (out of time). Is God conscious? Open problem. > > 2. Consciousness began when the universe formed, around 13.7 billion years > ago. This cannot be. But the event “13 billion years ago” and many variants occurs "all the time” (or all the number-of-step of all universal dovetailing) in the arithmetical reality. Those are important events in our history, but the consciousness which does the history selection was there “before”. > > 3. Consciousness began with single-celled life, around 3.7 billion years ago > (Reber). Not really, but the consciousness of the universal machine get a physical stable implementations, apparently relatively to us. We get many universal entities capable of interacting with a solid notion of resources. > > 4. Consciousness began with multicellular plants, around 850 million years > ago. In our histories, which “tautologically” are those semantical statifying the logic of the material modes of self-reference, which seems the case thanks to the quantum and Gödel (which enforces the distinction between p and p & <>t in the provable part of the machine in arithmetic. Again, important events in our history, but consciousness was “there before”. > > 5. Consciousness began when animals such as jellyfish got thousands of > neurons, around 580 million years ago. That’s about the time the soul of the machine falls, and they begin to hallucinate and believe in what they were conscious of, and thus get partially deluded. The universal machine get Löbian. Soon, they will even begin to believe in the axiom of infinity, and calculus, if not Lagrangian (grin). > > 6. Consciousness began when insects and fish developed larger brains with > about a million neurons (honeybees) or 10 million neurons (zebrafish) around > 560 million years ago. It has been discovered that bees adds and multiplies little numbers, when they need, to get pollen from mathematical human teacher! But I still think that spider, especially the hunters, go much farer in their conception of reality as a video illustrates well here. At 0.44 she explores and get a surprise when “not seeing a spider where expected”, that occurs two times, and the second times she run away! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ij4pdf49bxw > > 7. Consciousness began when animals such as birds and mammals developed much > larger brains with hundreds of millions neurons, around 200 million years > ago. [Thagard] Much larger brain enlarges the number of stupidity you can asserts, but of course, the catastrophes are limited until … the universal (natural) languages develops … > > 8. Consciousness began with humans, homo sapiens, around 200,000 years ago. “Homo sapiens” cannot be asserted by the homo if he is really sapiens … Let us say that the peculiar human Intelligence, accompanied by human stupidity, begin to develop. Intelligence and stupidity are two big friends, they never separate each other. > > 9. Consciousness began when human culture became advanced, around 3000 years > ago (Julian Jaynes). Birth of the little ego. Birth of cruelty and the human suffering. > > 10. Consciousness does not exist, as it is just a scientific mistake > (behaviorism} or a “user illusion” (Daniel Dennett). Negation of the first person indubitable: you don’t exist. Dennett is logically correct, as this follows from its ontological commitment in both primary matter and Mechanism. Of course, it is simpler to just omit such an ontological commitment. Bruno > > - pt > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com > <mailto:everything-list+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com>. > To post to this group, send email to email@example.com > <mailto:firstname.lastname@example.org>. > Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/everything-list > <https://groups.google.com/group/everything-list>. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout > <https://groups.google.com/d/optout>. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. 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