On Sunday, March 3, 2019 at 5:58:17 AM UTC-6, Bruno Marchal wrote:
>
>
> On 1 Mar 2019, at 19:32, Philip Thrift <cloud...@gmail.com <javascript:>> 
> wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> Reading all the above in the context of 
>>
>> *Naturalness and Emergence*
>> David Wallace
>> February 20, 2019
>> http://philsci-archive.pitt.edu/15757/1/naturalness_emergence.pdf
>>
>> leads to the conclusion that *our current language(s) of physics is(are) 
>> most likely wrong.*
>>
>>
>>
>> A proposition can be wrong. I am not sure what you or Wallace would mean 
>> by a language being wrong. Perhaps Wallace meant that our metaphysics (most 
>> of the time the materialist one) is wrong, which makes more sense. Perhaps 
>> he does not dare to say so. It is not well seen in some circles.
>>
>> Bruno
>>
>>
>>
>>
> By 'language' in the above paper he means 'mathematical language' and he 
> means precisely the language in which QFT an GR are actually written in 
> (seen when you look at them on paper or on a screen): Sentences are made of 
> mathematical symbols and variables, but the basics begin with a selection 
> of sentences (axioms) from which a theory is made. 
>
>
> OK. Thanks. That makes more sense.
>
>
>
> So he is really saying the axioms are likely wrong, and even new 
> primitives (mathematical symbols) may have to be invented.
>
>
> Of course, I don’t think so. It is phenomenologically true, but for the 
> ontology, i.e. the minimal amount of things which needs to be assumed, s, 
> 0, + and x are enough (added to logic). In fact, S and K, with “(“ and “)”, 
> plus “=“ are enough, even without logic. (I always assume Mechanism, by 
> default, to be sure).
>
> Bruno
>
>
>
>
>
Here's an example David Wallace presents (as an "outlandish" possibility): 
Suppose in *pi *(which is computable, so has a *program* (a spigot one, in 
fact) that produces its digits. Suppose somewhere in that stream of digits 
is the Standard Model Equation

    (say written in LaTeX/Math but rendered here)
    
 https://www.sciencealert.com/images/Screen_Shot_2016-08-03_at_3.20.12_pm.png

So what could this mean? (He sort of leaves it hanging.)

- pt

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