On 3/14/2020 4:22 AM, Philip Thrift wrote:
On Saturday, March 14, 2020 at 5:23:53 AM UTC-5, Bruno Marchal wrote:
On 12 Mar 2020, at 14:07, Lawrence Crowell
<[email protected] <javascript:>> wrote:
On Wednesday, March 11, 2020 at 11:21:55 PM UTC-5,
[email protected] <http://aol.com> wrote:
You're ignoring quantum and photonic computing??!!
No, quantum computing does not even map NP problems into P. I
does not get around incompleteness results of Turing and Goedel.
That’s right. In fact super-hyper-machine does not escape
incompleteness and can even be super-hyper-incomplete.Using the
infinite to escape Gödel incompleteness does not work, or becomes
trivial.
I will consider admitting the infinite in the ontology the day I
got an infinite salary :)
Even the induction axioms are not allowed in the ontology, despite
being the main axiom about what is an observer.
Quantum computing (and I guess photonic computing) does not
violate the Church-Turing thesis. David Deustch saw this clearly
already in its main quantum computability paper.
Bruno
https://www.nbcnews.com/mach/science/weirdest-idea-quantum-physics-catching-there-may-be-endless-worlds-ncna1068706
“It's absolutely possible that there are multiple worlds where you
made different decisions. We're just obeying the laws of physics,”
says Sean Carroll, a theoretical physicist at the California Institute
of Technology and the author of a new book on many worlds titled
"Something Deeply Hidden." Just how many versions of you might there
be? “We don't know whether the number of worlds is finite or infinite,
but it's certainly a very large number," Carroll says. "There’s no way
it’s, like, five.”
Renowned theorist Roger Penrose of Oxford University dismisses the
idea as “reductio ad absurdum”: physics reduced to absurdity. On the
other hand, Penrose’s former collaborator, the late Stephen Hawking,
described the many worlds interpretation as “self-evidently true.”
Coming at the critique from a different angle, Oxford's Roger Penrose
argues that the whole idea of many worlds is flawed, because it’s
based on an overly simplistic version of quantum mechanics that
doesn’t account for gravity. “The rules must change when gravity is
involved,” he says.
In a more complete quantum theory, Penrose argues, gravity helps
anchor reality and blurry events will have only one allowable outcome.
He points to a potentially decisive experiment now being carried out
at the University of California, Santa Barbara, and Leiden University
in the Netherlands that's designed to directly observe how an object
transforms from many possible locations to a single, fixed reality.
Carroll is unmoved by these alternative explanations, which he
considers overly complicated and unsupported by data. The notion of
multiple yous can be unnerving, he concedes. But to him the underlying
concept of many worlds is “crisp, clear, beautiful, simple and pure.”
Did you not follow the discussion with Bruce and Smitra? It is far from
“crisp, clear, beautiful, simple and pure.” when you actually try to
fill out how it works.
Brent
If he's right, he's not the only Sean Carroll who feels that way.
@philipthrift
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