> On 14 Mar 2020, at 22:42, Lawrence Crowell <[email protected]> > wrote: > > On Saturday, March 14, 2020 at 5:23:53 AM UTC-5, Bruno Marchal wrote: > >> On 12 Mar 2020, at 14:07, Lawrence Crowell <[email protected] >> <javascript:>> wrote: >> >> On Wednesday, March 11, 2020 at 11:21:55 PM UTC-5, [email protected] >> <http://aol.com/> wrote: >> You're ignoring quantum and photonic computing??!! >> >> >> No, quantum computing does not even map NP problems into P. I does not get >> around incompleteness results of Turing and Goedel. > > That’s right. In fact super-hyper-machine does not escape incompleteness and > can even be super-hyper-incomplete.Using the infinite to escape Gödel > incompleteness does not work, or becomes trivial. > > I will consider admitting the infinite in the ontology the day I got an > infinite salary :) > > Even the induction axioms are not allowed in the ontology, despite being the > main axiom about what is an observer. > > Quantum computing (and I guess photonic computing) does not violate the > Church-Turing thesis. David Deustch saw this clearly already in its main > quantum computability paper. > > Bruno > > > > Quantum computers obey the CT thesis. What might be called black hole > computers the same holds. Quantum gravitation is the same, and my essay on > FQXi explores this.
You might recall us the link. I tend to agree with you. Of course we don’t know, as we have not yet a coherent theory of gravitation and quantum mechanics. But it is not good practice to speculate on the wrongness of a theory to satisfy some philosophical desire, like Penrose seems to have done. Gödel’s theorem and the quantum theory are until now rather strong evidence that mechanism is true. But then the theory of everything, unifying all forces, (love included!) is very simple, and any Turing complete first order theory, without induction, nor axiom of infinity will do the job. Physics is “machine independent” as we say in computer science. Bruno > > LC > > >> >> LC >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Lawrence Crowell <[email protected] <>> >> To: Everything List <[email protected] <>> >> Sent: Wed, Mar 11, 2020 10:31 am >> Subject: Re: Reachability for infinite -time Turing machines with long tapes >> >> On Tuesday, March 10, 2020 at 10:16:38 AM UTC-5, Philip Thrift wrote: >> >> https://arxiv.org/abs/1802. 05734 <https://arxiv.org/abs/1802.05734> >> >> @philipthrift >> >> It looks to be a version of the busy beaver problem. The scale of the >> problem grows beyond computable bounds. >> >> LC > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/5aa35cd1-1ff2-4c5f-88b6-360ddb734e9a%40googlegroups.com > > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/5aa35cd1-1ff2-4c5f-88b6-360ddb734e9a%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/69FB0BBC-0803-48D0-9C32-1D18A336000F%40ulb.ac.be.
