On 2/28/2022 1:01 PM, John Clark wrote:
On Mon, Feb 28, 2022 at 3:31 PM Brent Meeker <[email protected]>
wrote:
>> Determinism just means a future state of the universe can be
calculated from the information in a previous date, but it
says nothing about the initial conditionof the universe.
Superdeterminism says in addition that out of all the huge,
and possibly infinite, number of states the universe could've
started out in it started out in the one in only state that
would not only produce humans after 13.8 billion years but
humans who would always just happen to perform the wrong
experiments so that they would always be fooled into thinking
that the universe was random and non-local when in reality it
was neither. And it's literally impossible for there to be a
theory with a greater violation of Occam's razor than that.
/> That's like saying it's violation of Occam's razor that some
buy won a million dollars in the lottery because it was so
improbable that he won. If the universe started out in some
definite state and it evolved deterministically then that it
produced humans who did certain things is no more remarkable than
if had produced Martians who did something different. /
No, it's saying that whenever humans did an experiment in physics and
changed something in a way they thought was random and concluded from
the experiment that the universe was random and non-local they were
actually being fooled because what they thought was random was not
random at all, instead it was a part of a grand conspiracy that
started 13.8 billion years ago from a very very specific initial state
that resulted in humans always being fooled no matter how many times
they repeated such experiments.
So you think their decisions were not deterministic; then they were
either random or libertarian "free will". If they were deterministic
they were determined by any Cauchy slice of their past light cone,
including the one 13.8 billion years ago. There's no "consipiracy to
it; that implies some intelligence agent arranging it. It's just what
happened. You don't believe in free will, but you believe in
statistically independent will.
Brent
The only reason somebody would concoct such a ridiculous theory is
that for whatever reason they just didn't like the Many Worlds idea
and were desperate to do something, anything, to avoid it. If they
really believed in superdeterminism then there would be no point in
conducting scientific experiments at all because the universe is
perverse and will always lie to them so the entire scientific method
is invalid. You couldn't even trust your own memories or thoughts
because the universe has been engineered from the start to make fools
of us, so even thinking is a waste of time. I thought the holy rollers
who say the universe is only 4000 years old and God buried dinosaur
bones to fool humans and test their faith were bad, but this is worse,
much much worse.
John K Clark See what's on my new list at Extropolis
<https://groups.google.com/g/extropolis>
lqg
sua
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