Le mer. 11 sept. 2024, 10:31, Brent Meeker <[email protected]> a écrit :
> > > > On 9/11/2024 1:02 AM, Quentin Anciaux wrote: > > > > Le mer. 11 sept. 2024, 09:56, Alan Grayson <[email protected]> a > écrit : > >> >> >> On Wednesday, September 11, 2024 at 1:44:39 AM UTC-6 Quentin Anciaux >> wrote: >> >> >> >> Le mer. 11 sept. 2024, 09:42, Alan Grayson <[email protected]> a >> écrit : >> >> >> >> On Tuesday, September 10, 2024 at 3:50:08 PM UTC-6 Quentin Anciaux wrote: >> >> >> >> Le mar. 10 sept. 2024, 23:19, Alan Grayson <[email protected]> a >> écrit : >> >> >> >> On Tuesday, September 10, 2024 at 2:19:42 PM UTC-6 John Clark wrote: >> >> On Tue, Sep 10, 2024 at 3:57 PM Alan Grayson <[email protected]> wrote: >> >> >> *>> Even if you ignore Dark Energy and postulate that the Hubble constant >> really is constant, every object a megaparsec away (3.26 million >> light-years) is moving away from us at about 70 kilometers per second. So >> if you try to look at objects a sufficiently large number of megaparsec >> away you will fail to find any because they are moving away from us faster >> than the speed of light.* >> >> >> >* That was in the past. At present, the universe is expanding at about >> 70 km/sec.* >> >> >> *Galaxies are receding from the Earth at 70 km/sec for EACH megaparsec >> distant from Earth they are. The further from Earth they are, the faster >> they are moving away from us, so if they are far enough away they will be >> moving faster than the speed of light away from us. * >> >> *> You're assuming the universe today is infinite,* >> >> >> *NO! I said IF the entire universe is infinite today then it was always >> infinite, and IF it was finite 10^-35 seconds after the Big Bang then it's >> still finite today. I also said nobody knows if the entire universe is >> infinite or finite. * >> >> >> *>* *Hubble's law applies to the past, not to the future,* >> >> >> *What the hell?! * >> >> >> *How about an intelligent reply? Obviously, if the universe is infinite >> today, it was always infinite. But that's what I am questioning. For >> galaxies to fall out of view, they have to moving at greater than c. Now >> they aren't receding that fast. How will they start moving that fast? >> You're applying Hubble's law without thinking what it says. Just because a >> galaxy is now receding at less than c, how will continued expansion >> increase that speed to greater than c? AG * >> >> >> The farther they are the faster they are receding from you, so as they >> continue to get farther away they receed faster from you till the point >> they receed faster than c and go out of your horizon. >> >> Quentin >> >> >> *That's your claim, but, like I wrote, if say, the rate of expansion is >> fixed, the separation distance isn't increasing faster than c. It's just >> increasing. AG * >> >> >> Just take the balloon example, it's a perfect explanation, any two >> points receed faster from each other as the balloon inflates. >> >> >> *If the rate of expansion is fixed, the distance along some equator >> containing two separated galaxies increases linearly as a function of the >> radial distance, s. * >> > No, the distance between two galaxies carried by the Hubble expansion > increases exponentially. > It's because the expansion rate is going faster.... but even if it was linear, as long as it is > 0, there will be objects receeding faster than c. > The problem, AG, is that you put no effort at all into understanding or > researching your on your own. > > Brent > > > *So I don't see what you claim your model proves. AG * >> > > You're correct that, with a fixed rate of expansion, the distance between > two galaxies increases linearly as a function of time. However, the key > point is that recession velocity depends on the distance between the > galaxies. > > Using the balloon analogy: imagine two points on an inflating balloon. > Even if the balloon expands at a constant rate, the farther apart the > points are, the faster they move away from each other. This means the rate > at which the distance between the two points increases is proportional to > how far apart they are. So, as the distance between galaxies grows, their > recession velocity increases. > > In an expanding universe, the same thing happens: even if the expansion > rate is constant, galaxies that are farther apart recede faster. At large > enough distances (like beyond the Hubble radius), the recession velocity > will exceed the speed of light because the space between the galaxies is > expanding faster. > > So, while the distance may increase linearly with time, the recession > velocity still increases with distance, and at sufficiently large > distances, it exceeds . This is how galaxies beyond a certain distance can > recede faster than the speed of light, even with a constant rate of > expansion. > >> >> * John* K Clark See what's on my new list at Extropolis >> <https://groups.google.com/g/extropolis> >> >> hwt >> >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Everything List" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to [email protected]. >> >> To view this discussion on the web visit >> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/5485c7a2-a527-448a-b337-3c8c60466d73n%40googlegroups.com >> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/5485c7a2-a527-448a-b337-3c8c60466d73n%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >> . >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Everything List" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to [email protected]. >> >> To view this discussion on the web visit >> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/efc374c4-d738-4fb1-998d-ebf238e48d95n%40googlegroups.com >> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/efc374c4-d738-4fb1-998d-ebf238e48d95n%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >> . >> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Everything List" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to [email protected]. >> To view this discussion on the web visit >> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/dbe32589-1ac8-41a8-89dc-fe75f37bc657n%40googlegroups.com >> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/dbe32589-1ac8-41a8-89dc-fe75f37bc657n%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >> . >> > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/CAMW2kAoC2LUaqTXewHq%3DE%3DK4ifawBHcd5nVVNWqYLv2xcbFGKA%40mail.gmail.com > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/CAMW2kAoC2LUaqTXewHq%3DE%3DK4ifawBHcd5nVVNWqYLv2xcbFGKA%40mail.gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> > . > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected]. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/84d50e17-bd0c-417f-b3f6-cfcb3c87741d%40gmail.com > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/84d50e17-bd0c-417f-b3f6-cfcb3c87741d%40gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> > . > -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. 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