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Today's Topics:
1. Re: Peter v Andrey (Alex Fak)
2. couch for sale (Aneta Szpyrka)
3. Re: Fw: Expat Digest, Vol 58, Issue 26 (Nick Hodgkins)
4. fun with stereotypes (Michele A. Berdy)
5. Re: Expat List Fw: Expat Digest, Vol 58, Issue 26 (Nick Wilsdon)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Sun, 23 Aug 2009 21:45:04 +0400
From: Alex Fak <[email protected]>
Subject: Expat List Re: Peter v Andrey
To: [email protected]
Message-ID:
<[email protected]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
Andrei, I also find it hard to understand your concern. I think you're
making several assumptions that are not quite obvious. a) that only
"foreigners" hire nannies and private tutors for their children - I
would
think this is an aspiration of every middle class Russian family as
well; b)
that hiring a nanny is tantamount to "exploiting other people" - as
if Peter
is forcing someone to take that job; c) that being a nanny or a
tutor is a
"dead-end and humiliating job" - I don't see where you get that at
all; many
educated people make perfectly successful careers out of it; d) that
in this
particular case, the job pays "hardly enough to survive in Moscow" -
do you
actually know what kind of salary Peter is proposing?
Every child should be lucky enough to have his parents forego some
fruits of
their hard-earned wages to give him the gift of a private tutor. Read
Malcolm Gladwell's *Outliers* - Peter's child is much more likely to
succeed
in life not because his parents are well-off, but because they are
taking
care to motivate and challenge him at an early age.
Alex
---
-------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Fri, 21 Aug 2009 09:12:09 -0700 (PDT)
From: Andrey <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: Expat List Fw: Expat Digest, Vol 58, Issue 26
To: The Moscow Expat List <[email protected]>
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
What gets me is how foreigners have no qualms about trying to
exploit other
people. Please forgive me for feeling a little peeved because of the
brazenness with which some expats assume that well-educated and
stimulating
Russian women must be ecstatic about the possibilities of a dead-
end and
humiliating job that pays hardly enough to survive in Moscow.
--- On Fri, 8/21/09, Peter Richter <[email protected]> wrote:
From: Peter Richter <[email protected]>
Subject: Expat List Fw: Expat Digest, Vol 58, Issue 26
To: "Expat List" <[email protected]>
Date: Friday, August 21, 2009, 11:16 AM
Andrey, what do you have a problem
with... me working hard to try and offer my son the best
life possible or you being frustrated with your pathetic
life?
On Thu, Aug 20, 2009 at 11:35 AM,
Andrey <[email protected]>
wrote:
Bourgeois hiring stimulating women for their obstreperous
offspring? I envy your son, my father couldn't afford a
clown!
--- On Thu, 8/20/09, Peter Richter <[email protected]>
wrote:
From: Peter Richter <[email protected]>
Subject: Expat List Looking for a reliable
Nanny
To: "Expat List" <[email protected]>
Date: Thursday, August 20, 2009, 12:45 PM
Dear Fellow Listers...
After 6 years we have parted from our Nanny even
though she
was a part of the family, but unfortunately our son
was
outgrowing her ability to keep up with him and his
needs.
So here we are looking for a new Nanny... somebody
who
comes well recommended... English knowledge a plus,
but not
at all a must. A good education makes sense as she has
to be
able to challenge and stimulate our son also from an
intellectual point of view.
We live easy to reach in Kitai Goriod with both Kitai
Gorod
and Lubljanka Metro stations within a 5 min walk.
Would appreciate any leads
Thanks in advance
BR
Peter
you can reply off list to [email protected]
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Message: 2
Date: Mon, 24 Aug 2009 10:25:47 +0400
From: Aneta Szpyrka <[email protected]>
Subject: Expat List couch for sale
To: The Moscow Expat List <[email protected]>
Message-ID:
<[email protected]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252"
I've got a quality IKEA couch that I'm looking to sell at reasonable
prices
(listing in Rubles). It is in a very good condition.
Asking PriceCurrent List Price @ IKEACatalog profile
Fothult 3-person couch* 6,000**
8,990*
http://www.ikea.com/ru/ru/catalog/products/00085339
--
“Own only what you can carry with you; know language, know countries
, know
people. Let your memory be your travel bag.”
-Alexandr Solzhenitsyn
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Message: 3
Date: Sun, 23 Aug 2009 02:47:09 -0700 (PDT)
From: Nick Hodgkins <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: Expat List Fw: Expat Digest, Vol 58, Issue 26
To: The Moscow Expat List <[email protected]>
Message-ID: <[email protected]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
What gets me is how foreigners have no qualms about trying to
exploit other
people.
Why do u single out 'foreigners'. Only 'foreigners' have home help
staff? Or only foreigners pay around market rates. Eh?
------------------------------
Message: 4
Date: Sun, 23 Aug 2009 16:37:25 +0400
From: "Michele A. Berdy" <[email protected]>
Subject: Expat List fun with stereotypes
To: "expat" <[email protected]>
Message-ID: <663b63f315ff46ddad6c08c23d218...@sony>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="koi8-r"
I usually don't get involved in the expat list spitting matches, but
this one floored me. An expat wrote: "After 6 years we have parted
from our Nanny even though she was a part of the family, but
unfortunately our son was outgrowing her ability to keep up with him
and his needs. So here we are looking for a new Nanny... somebody
who comes well recommended... English knowledge a plus, but not at
all a must. A good education makes sense as she has to be able to
challenge and stimulate our son also from an intellectual point of
view."
Then Andrey makes up that "some expats assume that well-educated and
stimulating Russian women must be ecstatic about the
possibilities." (I've read the above several times and I don't see
anything in there about ecstasy.) Then he makes up that it's a "dead-
end and humiliating job", and he makes up that it's a job that "pays
hardly enough to survive in Moscow." (How do you know how much they
pay, and why are you sure that it's a dead-end job, or that it would
be humiliating, Andrey?) And then, having made all this up and
created a horrible straw man, Andrey damns foreigners (all
foreigners? some foreigners?): "What gets me is how foreigners have
no qualms about trying to exploit other people."
What gets me is how some people make up stories to hang their
stereotypes on. Andrey, here's some friendly observation and advice:
In every national and ethnic group there are a few rotten apples.
But it's a good rule of thumb to make sure the apple is rotten
before you start making accusations. It's also generally a good idea
to keep the accusations to one person and not generalize to entire
nations.
Sorry; end of Sunday sermon.
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Message: 5
Date: Sun, 23 Aug 2009 13:33:26 +0400
From: Nick Wilsdon <[email protected]>
Subject: Re: Expat List Fw: Expat Digest, Vol 58, Issue 26
To: The Moscow Expat List <[email protected]>
Message-ID:
<[email protected]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
On Fri, Aug 21, 2009 at 8:12 PM, Andrey <[email protected]> wrote:
What gets me is how foreigners have no qualms about trying to
exploit other
people. Please forgive me for >feeling a little peeved because of the
brazenness with which some expats assume that well-educated and
>stimulating
Russian women must be ecstatic about the possibilities of a dead-end
and
humiliating job that >pays hardly enough to survive in Moscow.
I don't understand your objections here Andrey. Peter is offering a
job, if
it's underpaid or 'humiliating' he won't find anyone to do the work.
He's
not forcing anyone to take the job. With the current unemployment
rate in
Russia someone might be grateful for the opportunity. Either way he
either
finds someone willing to do the job or he raises the money (or
lowers his
expectations), the market decides.
I employ people myself here - and pay above the standard wage level
in the
sector. I haven't given any of my staff a pay cut during the crisis.
Talking
to my employees about previous jobs they have had assures me that
there are
plenty of Russians out there exploiting people. Generalisations about
foreigners are as meaningless as any conclusions I could draw from
their
reports.
There is something in your statement though that annoys me, you seem
to be
indicating that any well-educated person deserves a high salary.
I've come
across this attitude before here, many times, especially among
programmers
who have just finished university. Irrespective of their abilities,
skills
or attitudes to work, they feel that they have earned the automatic
right to
a top end salary. That's just wrong.
Best Regards
Nick Wilsdon
e3internet
http://www.e3internet.com
Skype: Nick_Wilsdon
US Tel: (415) 508-4120
UK Tel: +44 (0) 20 3287 6977
RU Tel: +7 499 5029700
UK Fax: +44 (0) 207 900 3170
Personal Blog: http://NickWilsdon.com
http://www.RussianMarketer.com
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End of Expat Digest, Vol 58, Issue 30
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