I totally agree, the presentation is VERY COOL!
Great visual style, great accent on the details in small steps, great topics covered, no clutter.
The only minor criticism is the use of the word "breath" instead of "width". If it wasn't some intentional joke, I would at least fix the typo in "brea_d_th".
I starred and bookmarked the repo. If I need to show off Factor to someone, that'd be a great starting point. Thank you!
17.06.2017, 03:21, "John Benediktsson" <mrj...@gmail.com>:
This is GREAT!I love the topics covered, the step-through approach, and the overall feeling. I bet that was a great presentation.Best,John.,On Fri, Jun 16, 2017 at 5:09 PM, Sankaranarayanan Viswanathan <rationalrev...@gmail.com> wrote:Hello Everyone,
Thank you for your inputs. In the end, I decided to focus on the aspects of Factor that I was most amazed by when I first discovered the language last year. I presented yesterday, and it was received well. I think I kindled the interest of a few people who attended.
The slide I went over are here:
https://github.com/viswans83/stack-based-languages-presentation
Thanks again,
Sankar
On 6/1/17 4:05 AM, Alexander Ilin wrote:John, the question was specifically about the quotation parameter's
stack effects in general, i.e. `quot: ( x -- x )` vs. simply `quot` in
the parameter lists.
My take is that the quotation stack effects are not checked separately
on a per-parameter basis, only the word as a whole is checked. So, they
are merely for documentation purposes, and may be incorrect with no
penalty. From the documentation: "For words that are not inline, only
the number of inputs and outputs carries semantic meaning, and effect
variables are ignored."
http://docs.factorcode.org/content/article-effects.html
01.06.2017, 05:33, "John Benediktsson" <mrj...@gmail.com>:Well, technically neither ``dip`` nor ``keep`` need those stack
effects, they are inlined which means the non-inline word that
includes them will have it's stack effect checked by the compiler for
correctness.
There are few reasons why we want to have the ".." variadic stack
effects, and those are useful in the stack-checker and visually for
documentation, but if you removed them and tried to compile a word
that was incorrect, it would give you a worse error message but still
give you an error.
On Wed, May 31, 2017 at 7:03 PM, Sankaranarayanan Viswanathan<mailto:rationalrev...@gmail.com<rationalrev...@gmail.com <mailto:rationalrev...@gmail.com>> wrote:
Thanks for the ideas John!
I have been looking at the collection of talks, and they've been
quite helpful. Your thoughts about discussing "Java like" things
makes a lot of sense and I think contrasting Factor's object
system with Java's should be a nice topic.
That said, I did run into a question preparing the slides related
to stack-effects. I noticed that some combinators do not specify
stack effects for quotation inputs.
e.g.
dip ( x quot -- x )
keep ( ..a x quot: ( ..a x -- ..b ) -- ..b x )
Why does `dip` not need to specify the quotations stack effect,
but `keep` did? I suspect they also have something to do with the
inline word, but I'm not really sure. Could you explain?
Thanks,
Sankar
On 5/30/17 11:47 PM, John Benediktsson wrote:
We have a few "talks" that were given a number of years ago
(not all
code in them is up to date, but it's mostly good -- if you
have problems
updating the code let me know and I can help):
https://github.com/factor/factor/tree/master/extra/talks
https://github.com/slavapestov/boston-lisp-talk
https://github.com/slavapestov/emerging-langs-talk
You might find it interesting to discuss "Java-like" things, for
example, interfaces vs protocols:
public interface Foo {
String a();
int b();
}
public class FooImpl {
public String a() { return "hello" } ;
public int b() { return 42 } ;
}
vs a protocol (two generic methods) and a concrete class that
implements
it...
GENERIC: a ( obj -- a )
GENERIC: b ( obj -- a )
TUPLE: foo ;
M: foo a "hello" ;
M: foo b 42 ;
Could also talk about ``SINGLETON:``, so instead of (plus or minus
thread safety):
public class Foo {
private static _instance = null;
public static Foo getInstance() {
if ( _instance == null ) { _instance = new Foo() };
return _instance;
}
}
vs.
SINGLETON: foo
So, touching on code generation and higher level concepts.
Maybe macros might be interesting?
Some other ideas from my blog, not sure of your audience's
interest:
https://re-factor.blogspot.com/2009/08/calculating-with-ebnf.html
https://re-factor.blogspot.com/2010/11/estimating-cpu-speed.html
https://re-factor.blogspot.com/2011/02/simple-rpg.html
https://re-factor.blogspot.com/2011/04/powers-of-2.html
https://re-factor.blogspot.com/2011/04/mail-with-gui.html
https://re-factor.blogspot.com/2011/07/concatenative-thinking.html
https://re-factor.blogspot.com/2011/07/one-liners.html
https://re-factor.blogspot.com/2011/08/printf.html
https://re-factor.blogspot.com/2012/02/readability.html
https://re-factor.blogspot.com/2012/08/literate-programming.html
https://re-factor.blogspot.com/2013/10/rock-paper-scissors.html
https://re-factor.blogspot.com/2015/06/send-more-money.html
https://re-factor.blogspot.com/2017/02/711.html
Best,
John.
On Tue, May 30, 2017 at 8:14 PM, Sankaranarayanan Viswanathan
<rationalrev...@gmail.com <mailto:rationalrev...@gmail.com><mailto:Factor-talk@lists.sourceforge.net
<mailto:rationalrev...@gmail.com>>> wrote:
Hi Guys,
We have a developer community at where I work, and we do
monthly
tech talks that usually last between 30 and 40 minutes. I
presume
very few in that group have looked at stack based
languages before,
and I've been wanting to do a small talk about Factor there.
After spending a week preparing slides, I'm having a bit
of trouble
understanding what would be a meaningful scope for my
talk. I really
want to touch upon a couple of aspects:
- show what stack based code looks like (i.e. avoid naming
variables most of the time)
- show that all syntax is just words, and that syntax is
extensible
- show a little of the help system
- show a bit of the interactive development workflow (change,
refresh, test)
But, I'm suspecting before I even get here I might need to
spend a
lot of time talking about stack-effects, combinators, and
other
basics before they might get a feel for what factor code
feels like.
And this I'm afraid might be a little too much to digest
in a short
time. Words like dip, bi@ and sequence combinators like
map seem
fundamental to work with factor, and I'm afraid a short
presentation
might not be the best place to introduce these topics.
But, without
them code examples are going to be hard to understand.
Any ideas?
Thanks,
Sankar
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