I'm waiting for Tom to weigh in on this debate! The sutras are not practiced to primarily bring about a siddhi. Although they can do that. I have had several siddhi experiences that came about after practicing the TM-sidhi program for about ten years. These where experiences and not permanent abilities. But as Vaj has noted, they are only experiences and just as binding as any other experience. I believe, through direct experience, that the practice of the siddhis is for an entirely different reason than overtly stated by MMY. For me, the profound transformation in foundational consciousness came about only through the practice of the siddhis. The practice "pulled" pure consciousness into the relative mind. That's the only way I can explain it. -Peter --- anonymousff <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > Patanjali believed them be fully working. > also if they are useless why Purusha spent so much > time > practicing them? > > we also have historic evidence that above normal > powers are > achievable. > > > --- In [email protected], "Patrick > Gillam" > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > Setting aside the texts for a moment, what are > > peoples' experiences with the TM-Siddhi > > program? It seems whacky to debate a text, > > however learned, when we have such a large > > cohort of people who've practiced the techniques > > for decades. I'm thinking we could evaluate them > > for ourselves, based on our own knowledge. > > > > For myself, I can't confess to any powers from > > the siddhis, other than the hopping stuff, but > > they do seem to do just what I was told they'd > > do: solidify the presence of silent consciousness. > > > > What are other people getting? > > > > - Patrick Gillam > > > > > On Apr 20, 2005, at 8:18 AM, wayback71 wrote: > > > > > > > What do the Shankaracharyas say? Who is > > > > Vidyaranya? > > > > > > Vaj wrote: > > > > > > Vidyaranya was one of the most eminent > Shankaracharyas. He was > the 12th > > > jagadguru of the Sringiri seat. His text on the > attainment of > Cosmic > > > Consciousness is still the standard among yogis > today. That's why > is it > > > so significant on what he says of the siddhis > and samyama--if you > are > > > interested in enlightenment that is. > > > > > > > Is it possible that the siddhis are really > about making the > relative, > > > > subjective aspect of the > > > > individual a better, kinder and more skilled > human being - so > that > > > > when they do reach > > > > CC, they aren't a nasty, unpleasant, unkind > Enlightened person? > > > > > > Vaj wrote: > > > > > > Vidyaranya would disagree. You would more likely > become either > > > egocentric or a collector of subtle experiences. > These > experiences > > > would come and go and not lead to a permanent > state of higher > > > consciousness. > > > > > > To subscribe, send a message to: > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > Or go to: > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ > and click 'Join This Group!' > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > >
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