response below --- In [email protected], Peter Sutphen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > The following responses are based on "my" own > experiences (is that good akasha? ;-): > > --- Irmeli Mattsson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > --- In [email protected], Peter Sutphen > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > Individuality is a very curious delusion. When > > > identification of consciousness with mind ceases, > > > there is no longer an individual. Everything goes > > on > > > as before, but there is no longer a "doer" or > > > "decider" who has intent. There's just nobody > > home. > > > The individual doesn't even become "unbounded." > > "You" > > > simply cease to exist. > > > -Peter > > > > > **** > > > > I think this is a too general simplification. The > > term individual has > > many aspects to it. > > I would say that when the identification of > > consciousness with mind > > ceases, there is not anymore an ego as a contraction > > of awareness, who > > wants to be somebody and wants to be seen as > > somebody. > > Agree. There is nobody to want or not want anything. > > > When that > > entity ceases to exist, you have no need to be seen > > as enlightened, > > something special, superior to others. > > Agree. There is no individual to want or not want > anything. There is no individual to enter into any > superior or inferior relationship with anybody. > > > Rather you > > see the same life > > force in others as in you. > > Still there is a clear sense of individuality left. > > No. There is no individuality in Self Realization. > > > An I, who > > observes, makes interpretations, creates plans, > > acts, and reacts, and > > often quite differently than the others. > > Observation occurs, interpretation occurs, creating > plans occurs, action occurs and reaction occurs, but > there simply is no "one" doing it. > > > And intents > > there are still > > on the gross level. But one realizes that you cannot > > have intents or > > control the impulses on the subtlest level. > > There is no individuality on any level, gross or > subtle. Individuality is a delusion. > > > This has > > always been the > > case, you just become aware of it. > > True. You realize that you never existed at all! > > > And possibly you learn to constructively co-operate > > with those > > impulses. If you resist those impulses or you cannot > > consciously > > contain them ( this is quite often the case), they > > can get acted out > > in odd or disastrous ways. > > Again, you are assuming an individuality that does or > does not do these things. In Self-Realization it > becomes quite clear that there is no individual doing > or not doing anything. It can not be understood from > waking state. This is not arrogance or an attempt to > malign someone in waking state, but you can not > extrapolate experience from waking state to understand > CC. It's impossible. All waking state models fall > completely apart. > -Peter > >
**** The conclusion I can make from this is that I have no idea of Self-realization and have never experienced CC, not even as a glimpse. And I'm not missing that experience either. If something like that happens it is OK, but it is not my livede experience in everyday activities. The one who writes this comment, I perceive to be an evolving, learning entity, that I call an individual. It is in no way separate or independent of others or the Universe, and an instrument for the Universe to express itself. Also an instrument through which the Universe learns. As long as I have use for the concept 'I', I perceive myself at least in some extent as an individual. I could be theoretizing pretty well there being no individual here, but it is not my lived reality. I'm sense you seeing your description of CC to be superior to the `low' waking state experience of evolving as a human being. Do you consider yourself to be a human being? If yes, isn't that entity somehow different than others. I mean an individual? And I would like to hear a description of your daily life without the waking state experience of an individual making choices. How do you do shopping? Like a robot under divine guidance and inspiration? Who decides what you eat? Who decides how much you charge your clients ? Irmeli, the Curious One Irmeli To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
