(Comment below) --- In [email protected], steven klayman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > -- In [email protected], "Jeff Fischer" > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > --- In [email protected], steven klayman > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > wrote: > > > snip > > > > Do the puja, give them Gods name and have them > repeat > > > it. End of story. Check up on them once in a while > > > and know their own karma guides them. > > > > > > You dont still believe in meaningless sounds do > you? > > > Or are you worried if you told the truth you would > > > break some "fine threads" between you and MMY. > > > Read my lips. MANTRAS ARE NOT MEANINGLESS SOUNDS. > > > Read the Gita. Chapter 8. Krishna gives the > technique > > > for God Realization at hte time of death. > > > Of course MMY never published the last 12 > chapters. > > > Curious HuH? > > > Concentrate your gaze between the eyebrows and > > > meditate on Gods name. > > > > > > Good luck to all true seekers and lovers of truth. > > > steve > > > > The point I'd like to query here is that as an > initiate and > initiator > > I was told the mantras were meaningless sounds. I > became > suspicious > > about this hearing about the NJ court case and > having been taught > > that Sanskrit is a "name is form" language. It > unravelled for me > > when I got my advanced technique and knew the > meaning of > that "sound". > > If the mantras were promoted as meaningless sounds > and were indeed > > names of God, doesn't it seem rather Machiavellian > to misrepresent > > (dare I say lie?) this fact to westerners to get > them to silently > > chant the names of God "for their own good?".... > > This is all well and good but a complete understanding > would mean > knowing what is referred to by the word God. What is > the meaning of > a name for God? Why not just say God? Does God have > meaning? I dont > think there is enough information here to allow one to > decide > whether these are meaningless sounds or not. A fart > could probably > be seen(heard) as a meaningless sound but such an > expression could > easily be imbued with meaning depending on whether or > not there were > intention involved. > > This is a tough one. > > Rick CaArlstrom > > Rick-What part of the above phrase " MANTRAS ARE NOT > MEANINGLESS SOUNDS", did you not understand? > To make it perfectly clear let me tell you the > meanings of some of these "meaningless sounds" > the mantra "aim" means wisdom > the mantra "hrim" means all existence > the mantra" klim means transformation > themantra "srim" means increase > the mantra"namaha"i bow down > > Now, do you have enough information to decide if these > mantras have meanings?
"aim" is an english spelling that can be expressed as a sound out loud or silently in the mind. I don't see that this sound "means" wisdom, to me these sounds set up a reverberation in the gross mind that cultivates an allignment with a more fundamental characteristic of creation that when forced to fit into the static confines of spoken english comes out something like the word "wisdom". Mantra's themselves do not mean anything, there is a form that they are associated with and when the distinction between the meditator and the mantra disappears then there is only the form. The mantra by itself is meaningless but you can choose to assign it a meaning at the relative level. > If you are going to continue with the party line of > doublespeak, like "Uh. I donno if wisdom really means > wisdom. Maybe it aint got no meaning at all," Then we > dont really have room for an intelligent discussion. > What Jeff was stating is he was lied to. "namaha" in > his advanced technique means "i bow down". > It is not meaningless and that pissed him off. I have always felt that it wouldn't be a bad idea when teaching T.M (I do not teach) to explain that traditionally these mantras have often been translated as meaning such and such but that the assigning of particular words and images to these sounds was unnecessary because their true nature is expressed at a much more fundamental level. This last point is illustrated by the fact that mantras work whether or not their traditional meaning is known. So I don't think that Jeff was lied to as much as he wasn't given all the information available on the subject. Rick Carlstrom (snipped the rest) To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
