Vaj, what distinction is there between the unenlightened on any path? Whether the ignorant adhere to belief in god or to belief in no god, the problems of injustice and atrocities are directly attributed to ignorance. The atheists and the god-believers are all equally capable of evil and will create or adopt structures of belief and images of god that reflect and condone their own ignorance and limitation.
And what difference is there between paths to enlightenment? There is One Reality which is known or not known. This Reality is all that is. We live in the illusion of many teachings and many paths, but when the One Reality is known, it is found to be everywhere equally, in all teachings and paths. Bhakti yoga is not an inferior path which produces a duality-based enlightenment. The appearance of duality in the devotional path is just an appearance. When the bhakta closes her eyes in meditation, she also merges into deep formlessness. The bhakta is drawn by love to seek a deeper and deeper experience of the beloved, and this movement toward more and more subtle experience of the divine inevitably takes the bhakta to the same deepest conscious union as that found by any other seeker. --- In [email protected], Vaj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > On Mar 29, 2008, at 9:24 PM, Michael wrote: > > > --- In [email protected], Vaj <vajradhatu@> wrote: > > > >> I actually suspect, based on things you've shared in the past, that > >> we > >> actually have quite a bit in common. Bhakti type approaches were just > >> never my cup of tea, that's all. > > > > On a second thought: My reaction is simply the insight, that I donot > > actually want to change you or anyone here. If its not your cup of tea > > its not your cup of tea. If it was, we wouldn't need to discuss it, it > > would just be obvious. I OTOH have not need in proving anything about > > myself either - if you think I am stupidly attached to a dual view, > > while the nondual is highest, (btw Willy is right - Buddhism is most > > certainly not nondualistic )I am okay, its okay to be stupid ;-) I > > have my own insights, and I follow them, no need really to share. > > > > Thats why it is futile. > > > What would be interesting would be to hear your own insight as to what > the worship of god, gods and goddesses has done for humanity--and > other life on this planet--throughout history. Has it decreased > suffering or has it increased it? Has it helped decrease negative > emotions for the majority of it's adherents? What has worship of god, > gods or goddesses done for world peace? And what of science and god, > gods and goddesses? Are god, gods or goddesses considered higher or > more special than humans or other forms of sentient life? > > Should laws be put in place globally to prevent god or goddess-based > human right abuses? If my parents god believes that the foreskin of my > penis should be removed surgically while still a child, should they be > allowed to do that or is that child abuse? Should temples throughout > India, Nepal and other places be allowed to sacrifice animals and/or > humans to gain the boon or favor from some god or goddess? Are there > some forms of god that are naturally disruptive of human and other > life? If yes, what does that mean? > > Should Indian sacrificial wars still be allowed to 'blow of steam' and > re-establish balance with nature? > > Should texts which once promulgated human and or animal sacrifices > still be considered valid or even useable? If yes, what are the > implications for karma? >
