Good reply, t3rinity. I'll riff on that... :-) --- In [email protected], t3rinity <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Good list Unc, I'll answer > > --- In [email protected], TurquoiseB <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > --- In [email protected], "sparaig" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > What deliberate conditioning did *I* go through? > > Every word you hear is conditioning.
And much of what you never hear in any formal lecture or read in any book, but see around you all the time in the environment. > > > I took TM in 1973, SCI and checker-training in 1974-5, > > Lots of conditioning in the 2nd lecture (Bubble diagram) 2nd > day-checking (Theory of Stress-release), group-effect. > enlightenment, 'scientific validation', everything, every > little thing is conditioning. You will realize this only > when you leave TM or join a different group with different > spiritual ideas. Or just move on and find no other group but time works its magic on you anyway. > Conditioning is not always bad,... Absolutely :-) not. > ...one kind of conditioning can undo another kind (thorn > removes thorn) And one can continue climbing up the stem to the rose itself. Which is just another kind of conditioning, and another kind of thorn. :-) > > an advanced > > > course in the UK after I joined the USAF, then the TM-Sidhis in > > > 1985-ish. Went back to Fairfield once or twice for a week, and > > > to DC for a week. That's over a period of 30 years... > > > > How many states of consciousness are there? > > No idea. Maybe one? Or none. Depends on one's POV, n'est-ce pas? > > Can one transcend directly via concentration, with > > no intervening interval of "effortlessness?" > > Possibly. Can anyone transcende *Via* anything at all? Or, for that matter, "transcend" anything? :-) > > Is intent or effort in meditation a good thing or a > > bad thing? > > Depends really on the stage in meditation. There is also > spontaneaous concentration. There is intent in the sidhis, Is there intent in the Absolute? :-) > > Are there physiological coorelates to enlightenment? > > I don't really know. there are definitly correlates to states of > experience, but enlightenment is beyond experience. Well said. Nothing to add or quip about. Well said. > > Are the Vedas the primary "source of all knowledge?" > > Depends how abstract you define them. Well said again. But even at the most abstract level, is there only one "source of all knowledge," or as many of them as there are beings/imaginary beings to gain knowledge? > > Is thought in meditation a result of the release of > > stress or is it an indication that the meditator is > > just being lazy about entertaining thoughts during > > meditation? > > It could be both, in fact it can be catharsis or just laziness or a > mixture of both. But maybe laziness is just okay. After all, what do > you want to achieve? There is nowhere to go... And no one to "go" there. Again, it's just POV. > > Can enlightenment be intellectually understood? > > No. Can lack of the realization of enlightenment be intellectionally understood? :-) > > Does "stress" have anything to do with the lack of > > realization of enlightenment? > > One is more relaxed when one is enlightened, because unecessary > mental activity falls away, but you could still have stress I > think. I think so, too, on one level. On another, who or what defines "unnecessary?" ;-) > > Is it Ok to be a TM teacher or a student at MUM > > and openly see teachers from other spiritual > > traditions? > > YES. Especially if you haven't seen any enlightened person before. > If you want to be devoted to only ONE teacher, it should come from > inside and should not be enforced by fear. I would tend to agree. The spiritual teachers it was the most fun, and in my opinion the most productive, to be around always encouraged their students to see anyone they wanted, and to either continue to see these other teachers while ocntinuing to see them, or to leave altogether and hang with the other teacher. No problem, either way. > > Is it Ok to learn and practice meditation techniques > > other than TM along with TM? > > If they don't interfere directly, why not? I'm down with this, but can see how the interpretation of "don't interfere directly" says more about the organization that believes in "interference" than the other meditation techniques. > > Is it Ok to "excommunicate" from the organization > > someone who sees other teachers or practices other > > techniques than TM? > > No, but its their thing. Then the person will know where to > go ahead. Wasn't there a song like that? "Its your thing...do what you wanna do..." :-) > > Can the enlightened make mistakes? > > Nobody can do any mistakes, because its all Gods will. But from > the surface point of view anbody can make mistakes. What if there is no sentient God, and no "will." Can there still be an absence of mistakes anyway? :-) > > Is there such a thing as "the laws of nature?" > > You would have to define it. Physical LoN there are. I'm not as convinced. I give nature a little more credit than to constrain its Self. > > Does Maharishi have the ability to accurately "see" > > the future and thus make "proclamations" about it? > > I don't know. He sometimes makes astonishing predictions I > must admit I was never particularly impressed by any. Do you have any examples in mind? > > Is the effortlessness of TM unique among meditation > > techniques? > > No. there are other methods using effortlessnes. Gotta agree with this one. > > Is TM the "best" or most effective method of meditation > > available? > > Not in my opinion. But it is very good for many people. Its good for > many people who would have problems with other techniques, and that > are many. And it is the one to carry you through all the way, for > some people. This one, too. > > They're just questions, man. But if you think about it, > > each of the "right answers," according to the TM dogma, > > was taught to you. I call that conditioning. > > Thank you. I was just rappin', man, while waiting to see whether I'm going to have to sell my unborn children into slavery. :-) Still am. Beats waiting around and doing nothing... Unc To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! 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