Many thanks, Mark! Responses interleaved below... * * --- In [email protected], Mark Landau <m@...> wrote:
> > > Hmmm, I like this, thank you. It is, of course, a different, more > highest-level-of-counsciousness (or Reality) viewpoint of the three gunas > than the one given to us by M, which was more a three dimensional (or, as you > say, particle) viewpoint. But I like it a lot and may sit with it. I love > the torus, which, of course, is the most basic structure of the universe, > coming out from the first singularity to come forth at the time of the big > bang and showing up everywhere, * * Yes! The torus actually shows the ultimate equivalence of particle and field, as "curving back within myself I create again and again..." And personally I recall that about seven years after the Kundalini had completed its initial housecleaning, it settled down into that same stable torus-field through and around me. It now appears also to be the pattern behind all of the different life-flows of the pranas. >like in the apple, which may connect with the reference in the bible when Adam >and Eve eat/know the basic component of all that is (does the bible really >have that much wisdom in it?). * * Good point, Mark. Beautiful! I had forgotten about the apple. And yes, it appears to me as if there is infinite Wisdom in everything, even the Bible :-) ... Eating the apple might then be partaking of the particle-making phenomenon, entering creation by identifying solely with creature, indulging in duality, believing in (or partaking in) "good" and "evil," and thus appearing to exile oneself from Paradise. And perhaps this is the truth behind the Persephone-myth too -- that eating the "seeds" of the fruit, believing in the I-point perspective, is what brings about our apparent exile in this underworld. :-) >So who/what would the equator itself be? * * Great question. For me, the equator is the appearance of creation "out there" -- it is the gap-like, golden, ephemeral appearance of IS HERE NOW between the flows of creation and destruction, and appears to be sustained as the outer radiance or flip-side of our Brahma-singularity or central point "in here". We discover more about the mechanics of this gap-equator if we subdivide our three-fold guna-body into a nine-fold sub-guna chakra system (which incidentally supports our 5 basic prana-flows), and then again into a 27-state sub-sub-guna nakshatra-system to show Life's progression from conception through Awakening to dissolution, embracing along the way Vishnu's or Indra's 9 states of coherent being or Love (from conception through prenatal waking, dreaming and sleep, birth, postnatal sleep, dreaming and waking to transcendental being), Brahma's 9 states of consciousness or Light (from transcendental consciousness through what we could call C.C., G.C., U.C., Brahman, post-Brahmanic U.C., G.C., C.C., and transcendence), and Rudra's 9 states of blissful dissolution or Laughter (from premortal transcendence to premortal waking, dreaming, sleeping, death, postmortal sleeping, dreaming, waking, and dissolution). And as shown by the 27 nakshatras, we actually go through this entire cycle many, many times within an apparent lifetime (perhaps even trillions of times a second), though we may well fail to notice all of the milestones in many of these cycles, abstracting only the particular information that supports our current reality-story. Much to my surprise, I have found that these 27 states are all generated by the progressive dance or fusion, separation, refusion, and re-separation of impulses from Shiva or Father (the "Absolute" or Spirit or Purusha), and Shakti (the "Relative" or Body or Prakriti) or Mother, as they cross and recross through our chakra-system, lighting up our different chakras and thus creating highly specific different states of being-consciousness-bliss along the way. However, in this model, at our close in dissolution, it turns out there are 9 more states completely outside of spacetime, which mechanically are a reflection of Brahma's middle-9 golden states, and which are required to bring Us back to the conception of a new cycle. We see this because at the model's beginning in conception, as the egg is fertilized, Absolute Spirit and Relative Matter are completely merged, and they progressively separate across our chakras (actually parting ways at birth, where a third element, radiant Soul, arises at our midpoint, our Solar Plexus, to occupy the gap between Spirit and Matter) until they are completely polarized in transcendental being (at which point the separate Soul has expanded to occupy all 9 chakras, while Spirit has retreated to our crown and Matter has retreated to our feet). They then begin to approach each other again from transcendental consciousness through Brahman (where they overlap our Solar-plexus again, extinguishing our identification with a personal separate Soul) through post-Brahmanic transcendence, where they are fully merged as they were at conception. But then over the final 9 states they separate again (finally parting at death, where a radiant personal Soul is again engendered, exactly as at birth, but on another turn of the spiral: in bliss as opposed to being), to become fully polarized at dissolution, where the separate Soul has become as all-inclusive as possible. And now what? We need another 9 states "in the gap" after dissolution in order to re-marry Absolute and Relative, to begin another cycle with conception. And it turns out these golden-outermost 9 are our IS-HERE-NOW equator, beyond space and time (and thus always available here and now once we take responsibility for our own creation), as an eternal reflection of our own Awareness. I realize I am throwing an aw(e)ful lot of spaghetti at the wall here all at once, Mark; if you're interested in any of it I would be happy to go into any further detail I have come across. Much of it is available in my older posts here, as well as on rorygoff.com. If not, that's perfectly OK, too! :-) *L*L*L* > > But that is all from the POV of particles within the flow; in Reality, we > > are no-thing, beyond the three gunas; the apparent flow is inside of us as > > an eternal field, and nothing really happens ... > > > Yes, of course > > > :-) > > > > --- In [email protected], Mark Landau <m@...> wrote: > > > > > > Is there anyone who would care to discuss the three gunas as living > > > experiences within us, even as personified beings taking us over, similar > > > to but, perhaps, somewhat different than what RC writes about? All three > > > were and are huge parts of my experience in the movement and now. > > > > > > Sattva, as the direct experience of love of the sublime, the divine, even > > > love of reverence, itself, and certainly reverence, pulling the heart > > > along with it as bhakti? I don't, I must say, see a whole lot of that > > > here with a few exceptions. Though we didn't practice bhakti, per se, in > > > TM, that and sattva were certainly huge components of my experience. Of > > > course pure sattva, the simplicity of purity itself, is more > > > characterized by equanimity and balance, but that is not what I wish to > > > speak of here. > > > > > > Rajas, especially in it's form of sexual energy, almost as if it were > > > this huge rakshasa dwelling within one, and yes, rising up into towering > > > intensities, was, for me, rampant in the movement. IME, there were times > > > when M cranked that energy out almost as effectively as the darshan, so > > > that men and women sitting next to each other would start eyeing each > > > others bodies, stroking chair posts and rubbing chair arms and nubs with > > > their fingers. Did no one else perceive this? (No, folks, this was not > > > purely my projections.) There were a whole lot of sexual energies raging > > > around in the subtle planes on our august courses, and M was certainly > > > one of the main perpetrators and participants. > > > > > > And Tamas, in, WIWC, its demonic form, this titanic desire to thrust > > > one's hands into the universe, rip it to shreds and stomp it to > > > smithereens beneath one's feet, to become Siva or Shakti and really do it > > > or, also, of course, to completely remake it in one's own image, and to > > > be furious and frustrated that one couldn't do either, yes, like an > > > acting out frozen inner child? > > > > > > I also, of course, realize, that one could contribute all of the above to > > > a titanic ego, but that, IMO, is the easy way out and wouldn't, I think, > > > do the above justice though, perhaps, I am wrong in this. > > > > > > And, perhaps, there is not much to discuss. Perhaps I am only revealing > > > myself here, yes, in front of the "wrong" audience. But, OWT (one would > > > think), this forum could possibly be helpful for more than one person in > > > discussing such things. > > > > > > Thanks > > > > > > m > > > > > > > >
